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Garland

Created by: Mediumyeet
Team: 2023-24 Vancouver Canucks
Initial Creation Date: Dec. 3, 2023
Published: Dec. 3, 2023
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 3:56 a.m.
#1
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Terrible for the Canucks. Garland is so so so much better than Anderson. It’s not even close

Anderson has 0G and 3A in 24 games while playing on PP1. Garland is struggling this year points wise, yet still has more than double Anderson’s points, is infinitely times better defensively, and is also our best play driver in the bottom 6

The only way the Canucks should consider this is if Montreal adds their unprotected 2024 1st minimum
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:08 a.m.
#2
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Quoting: mv21227
Terrible for the Canucks. Garland is so so so much better than Anderson. It’s not even close

Anderson has 0G and 3A in 24 games while playing on PP1. Garland is struggling this year points wise, yet still has more than double Anderson’s points, is infinitely times better defensively, and is also our best play driver in the bottom 6

The only way the Canucks should consider this is if Montreal adds their unprotected 2024 1st minimum


Andersen fits a need in size and speed and had consistently averaged over a 20goal/82 have pace. Slow start offensively so far this year but same goes for Garland.

I don't love the deal but if nobody will take Garland without bad money coming back then I think Anderson makes the team better due to his play style. I think tocchet would be a fan of getting a guy like that in.
Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:22 a.m.
#3
Le patriote
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Quoting: mv21227
Terrible for the Canucks. Garland is so so so much better than Anderson. It’s not even close

Anderson has 0G and 3A in 24 games while playing on PP1. Garland is struggling this year points wise, yet still has more than double Anderson’s points, is infinitely times better defensively, and is also our best play driver in the bottom 6

The only way the Canucks should consider this is if Montreal adds their unprotected 2024 1st minimum

Have you not seen the point-chart of CapFriendly? Garland is at 71 and Anderson at 77 ... sorry to tell you but points are not a thing anymore...
Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:23 a.m.
#4
Le patriote
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Quoting: Mediumyeet
Andersen fits a need in size and speed and had consistently averaged over a 20goal/82 have pace. Slow start offensively so far this year but same goes for Garland.

I don't love the deal but if nobody will take Garland without bad money coming back then I think Anderson makes the team better due to his play style. I think tocchet would be a fan of getting a guy like that in.


Anderson is doing everything a coach loves but his finish is not on point this season.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:28 a.m.
#5
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Quoting: Mediumyeet
Andersen fits a need in size and speed and had consistently averaged over a 20goal/82 have pace. Slow start offensively so far this year but same goes for Garland.

I don't love the deal but if nobody will take Garland without bad money coming back then I think Anderson makes the team better due to his play style. I think tocchet would be a fan of getting a guy like that in.


We don’t need to move Garland, especially if the only option is Anderson. Anderson has a legit bottom 5 contract in the league. Garland is slightly overpaid but has consistently produced at a 5M level the previous 4 seasons prior to this season. Anderson has maybe once in his career, which was 5 years ago

Anderson isn’t even a much better goal scorer over his career. He averages less than 1 more goal per 82 games than Garland does (20.8 compared to 20.14)

Anderson has 1 season at above a 0.5 PPG, Garland has 4

Anderson has 1 season with more than 32 points, Garland has 4

Anderson is awful defensively, Garland is good defensively

Garland is the most important player in our bottom 6 right now. He’s driving play very effectively and creating a lot of scoring chances. Moving him would be a mistake, especially for Anderson. That move makes us a lot worse of a team
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:32 a.m.
#6
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
Have you not seen the point-chart of CapFriendly? Garland is at 71 and Anderson at 77 ... sorry to tell you but points are not a thing anymore...


I have no idea how those really work tbh, but considering they have Fantilli > MacKinnon and also have OEL > Jason Robertson and Matt Tkachuk I’m not gonna put any value on them lol

(Also not sure if this was sarcasm as it’s hard to tell over the internet)
Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:36 a.m.
#7
Le patriote
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Quoting: mv21227
I have no idea how those really work tbh, but considering they have Fantilli > MacKinnon and also have OEL > Jason Robertson and Matt Tkachuk I’m not gonna put any value on them lol

(Also not sure if this was sarcasm as it’s hard to tell over the internet)


A point chart or point in the NHL is nothing cuz 95% of the game is to skate to create space and Anderson creates a whole lot of it. the sport has changed my friend. This is what I want to show you.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 4:50 a.m.
#8
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
A point chart or point in the NHL is nothing cuz 95% of the game is to skate to create space and Anderson creates a whole lot of it. the sport has changed my friend. This is what I want to show you.


Anderson also hurts his team tremendously by being an awful defensive player. The only things he does well is hit and skate fast. He’s a bad player with an awful contract. Everyone apart from biased Habs fans see that. The Canucks don’t want him
Dec. 3, 2023 at 5:02 a.m.
#9
Le patriote
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Quoting: mv21227
Anderson also hurts his team tremendously by being an awful defensive player. The only things he does well is hit and skate fast. He’s a bad player with an awful contract. Everyone apart from biased Habs fans see that. The Canucks don’t want him


look more habs games plz the guy is not a defensive liability at all, can also play pk if needed.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 7:49 a.m.
#10
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Quoting: Mediumyeet
Andersen fits a need in size and speed and had consistently averaged over a 20goal/82 have pace. Slow start offensively so far this year but same goes for Garland.

I don't love the deal but if nobody will take Garland without bad money coming back then I think Anderson makes the team better due to his play style. I think tocchet would be a fan of getting a guy like that in.


The Canucks would be taking on more money and for an additional year, all other points should be thrown out the door, because it makes it pointless to move him and extremely risky to take on Anderson's deal.

If MTL was retaining at least 36.3%-50%, then at least then at least they are clearing 1.45M-2.2M in cap (not sure if that's a huge bonus) but maybe with the stuff you mentioned if you truly believe that swap is worth it, then you could consider. More than likely it's a huge mistake.
Dec. 3, 2023 at 8:05 a.m.
#11
You know nothing JS
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We went throught this with Beauvillier already. Keep your small wingers. Not interrested the slighest.
Dec. 3, 2023 at 9:56 a.m.
#12
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Attach a 2nd to Garland and remove Anderson, then MTL answers the phone. Neither player is "producing" but at least one of them has something to offer when the points aren't coming. (Hint: Garland has nothing to offer)
Dec. 3, 2023 at 9:57 a.m.
#13
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Quoting: mv21227
Terrible for the Canucks. Garland is so so so much better than Anderson. It’s not even close

Anderson has 0G and 3A in 24 games while playing on PP1. Garland is struggling this year points wise, yet still has more than double Anderson’s points, is infinitely times better defensively, and is also our best play driver in the bottom 6

The only way the Canucks should consider this is if Montreal adds their unprotected 2024 1st minimum


Quoting: Just_A_Guess
Attach a 2nd to Garland and remove Anderson, then MTL answers the phone. Neither player is "producing" but at least one of them has something to offer when the points aren't coming. (Hint: Garland has nothing to offer)
Dec. 3, 2023 at 10:22 a.m.
#14
westleysnipez
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
look more habs games plz the guy is not a defensive liability at all, can also play pk if needed.


Play the PK? Anderson has 3 mins of PK time this season, that's like 6 shifts. The main MTL forward Pkers are Evans, Ylonen, Dvorak, and Monahan. If he could play the PK, he'd be used in the PK more than that.

Also, Anderson's 5v5 stats are awful. 41% Corsi in 5v5 situations this year and last, combined with poor performance despite being the sixth most used PP guy.

Just seems like Anderson isn't anything more than a fast, big guy. Sure, he can't hit like a truck, but he can't score or defend and in the playoffs that matters. He only has 14 career playoff points across 43 games.

Anderson is a bottom six forward being paid top six money because he had a 20g pace and is big. That's all.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 10:24 a.m.
#15
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Quoting: westleysnipez
Play the PK? Anderson has 3 mins of PK time this season, that's like 6 shifts. The main MTL forward Pkers are Evans, Ylonen, Dvorak, and Monahan. If he could play the PK, he'd be used in the PK more than that.

Also, Anderson's 5v5 stats are awful. 41% Corsi in 5v5 situations this year and last, combined with poor performance despite being the sixth most used PP guy.

Just seems like Anderson isn't anything more than a fast, big guy. Sure, he can't hit like a truck, but he can't score or defend and in the playoffs that matters. He only has 14 career playoff points across 43 games.

Anderson is a bottom six forward being paid top six money because he had a 20g pace and is big. That's all.


IF NEEDED. Geez you guys jump on the number board like being on high horse. .... He also play for the team who have the most injured players for the last 3 freaking season .... you guys have poor capabilities to understand hockey and only refer to number ... ... ...
Dec. 3, 2023 at 10:31 a.m.
#16
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Quoting: mv21227
We don’t need to move Garland, especially if the only option is Anderson. Anderson has a legit bottom 5 contract in the league. Garland is slightly overpaid but has consistently produced at a 5M level the previous 4 seasons prior to this season. Anderson has maybe once in his career, which was 5 years ago

Anderson isn’t even a much better goal scorer over his career. He averages less than 1 more goal per 82 games than Garland does (20.8 compared to 20.14)

Anderson has 1 season at above a 0.5 PPG, Garland has 4

Anderson has 1 season with more than 32 points, Garland has 4

Anderson is awful defensively, Garland is good defensively

Garland is the most important player in our bottom 6 right now. He’s driving play very effectively and creating a lot of scoring chances. Moving him would be a mistake, especially for Anderson. That move makes us a lot worse of a team


Very well said.IMHO.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 10:38 a.m.
#17
westleysnipez
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
IF NEEDED. Geez you guys jump on the number board like being on high horse. .... He also play for the team who have the most injured players for the last 3 freaking season .... you guys have poor capabilities to understand hockey and only refer to number ... ... ...


When people say a guy can play the PK, they typically mean a guy who is reliable and consistently played on the PK, a shift or two per game. Not a guy who plays 6 shifts over 24 games.

Anderson is the 9th forward MTL uses for penalty kills. That's not an understatement, there are 8 Habs forwards with at least 9 games played this season who have more PK time than Anderson.

You want to say we have a poor understanding of hockey, but it's pretty clear you're straight up misrepresentating the facts.
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 12:14 p.m.
#18
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Quoting: Just_A_Guess

Quoting: Just_A_Guess
Attach a 2nd to Garland and remove Anderson, then MTL answers the phone. Neither player is "producing" but at least one of them has something to offer when the points aren't coming. (Hint: Garland has nothing to offer)


The only thing Anderson offers is hitting ability and awful defensive play. Garland offers great play driving ability and good defensive play when he’s not scoring. He’s better than every winger on Montreal not named Caufield
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Dec. 3, 2023 at 3:46 p.m.
#19
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Quoting: Just_A_Guess
Attach a 2nd to Garland and remove Anderson, then MTL answers the phone. Neither player is "producing" but at least one of them has something to offer when the points aren't coming. (Hint: Garland has nothing to offer)


Lmao this site is a **** show. Both guys are fine 3rd line/middle 6 players that are overpaid. Neither one is awful, neither one is great. They both have their upsides and downsides. It doesn't always have to be "X player is absolutely useless"
Dec. 3, 2023 at 3:47 p.m.
#20
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Quoting: mv21227
The only thing Anderson offers is hitting ability and awful defensive play. Garland offers great play driving ability and good defensive play when he’s not scoring. He’s better than every winger on Montreal not named Caufield


Lmao this site is a **** show. Both guys are fine 3rd line/middle 6 players that are overpaid. Neither one is awful, neither one is great. They both have their upsides and downsides. It doesn't always have to be "X player is absolutely useless"
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Dec. 4, 2023 at 7:26 a.m.
#21
Le patriote
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Quoting: westleysnipez
When people say a guy can play the PK, they typically mean a guy who is reliable and consistently played on the PK, a shift or two per game. Not a guy who plays 6 shifts over 24 games.

Anderson is the 9th forward MTL uses for penalty kills. That's not an understatement, there are 8 Habs forwards with at least 9 games played this season who have more PK time than Anderson.

You want to say we have a poor understanding of hockey, but it's pretty clear you're straight up misrepresentating the facts.


you are overstating yourself here. If needed it does not mean he plays, but can cover if needed, but yet language seems to be an issue too here. Anderson is a transition player playing in the worst team for injury over the last few years and yet still manages to balance between - 5 and -8. Oh yeah he did have a -25 playing with Suzuki Caufield against the top 3 from another team, but has a middle six in a good team he can thrive, but you guys look to numbers instead of trying to insert him in other team's system and lineup .... so you're misleading yourself into interpretation instead of implementing the player into the new team ... Value are not point base but upon projection of what they can bring which is completely different.
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Dec. 4, 2023 at 7:31 a.m.
#22
Le patriote
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Quoting: Mediumyeet
Lmao this site is a **** show. Both guys are fine 3rd line/middle 6 players that are overpaid. Neither one is awful, neither one is great. They both have their upsides and downsides. It doesn't always have to be "X player is absolutely useless"


too many here have cognitive bias. This needs to change but the site owner and modo are not trying enough to build charts to help them catch what AGMing is or even hockey .... so we pay the full price of love/hate about hockey players which is at best related to talk about taste and not underlying how we can insert or add a player to a team needs. He's not good so my team does not need him, while the team needs a player to bring space and enter the offensive zone ... LOL!!
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Dec. 4, 2023 at 3:33 p.m.
#23
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
too many here have cognitive bias. This needs to change but the site owner and modo are not trying enough to build charts to help them catch what AGMing is or even hockey .... so we pay the full price of love/hate about hockey players which is at best related to talk about taste and not underlying how we can insert or add a player to a team needs. He's not good so my team does not need him, while the team needs a player to bring space and enter the offensive zone ... LOL!!


Lol exactly. Like ya both players are imperfect and are overpaid with term but that doesn't mean they can't be useful. Vancouver could absolutely use a player with Anderson's attributes on either Petey or Miller's wing. We need speed and size to create space and get in on the forcheck. He has that ability and has shown in the past that he can pot 20+ goals in a season.

For MTL, garland is imperfect and they already have some smaller players but Garland has also shown an ability to be an effective play driver and put up 50ish points a year. He has great possession numbers which I think could be a big benefit for MTL. But the biggest thing for MTL here is they are getting out of a contract a year earlier (and potentially 2years earlier as garland is probably moveable when he only has a year left). When he played higher in the lineup with Arizona he was a **** disturber and showed there might even be more offense in him.

I don't love the deal for either team but that's because both guys have rough contracts but I do think there is some potential benefits for both teams here.
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Dec. 5, 2023 at 10:08 a.m.
#24
westleysnipez
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Quoting: habitantlecolon
you are overstating yourself here. If needed it does not mean he plays, but can cover if needed, but yet language seems to be an issue too here. Anderson is a transition player playing in the worst team for injury over the last few years and yet still manages to balance between - 5 and -8. Oh yeah he did have a -25 playing with Suzuki Caufield against the top 3 from another team, but has a middle six in a good team he can thrive, but you guys look to numbers instead of trying to insert him in other team's system and lineup .... so you're misleading yourself into interpretation instead of implementing the player into the new team ... Value are not point base but upon projection of what they can bring which is completely different.


You keep falling back on injuries being the reason he doesn't succeed, but even playing in the role you'd ideally want him (middle six), he still struggles as you pointed out. That's why I'm pointing out him being worse than Garland (and also even more overpaid). You can sign a guy who can hit like Anderson for league minimum. I don't care if a guy can score 20 goals if he's responsible for 30 going in against him, and paying him 5M to be a middle sixer as a "transitional player" just means that when MTL looks to compete, he won't be there.
 
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