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NEW Predictions for next season in the NHL

Jul. 20, 2017 at 6:49 p.m.
#51
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


As a jets fan this is comforting
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Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:25 p.m.
#52
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Quoting: rangersandislesfan


look how CBJ did in 15-16 after that long streak in 14-15.


CBJ played very well this past season...


yes, but i'm saying NYI is better than PHI right now.

Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


I disagree. He got a 2.66 GAA and a 9.08 SV%. Sure, that's good, but not like, top 10 goalie in the league kind of good.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:38 p.m.
#53
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Quoting: rangersandislesfan
Quoting: phillyjabroni


CBJ played very well this past season...


yes, but i'm saying NYI is better than PHI right now.

Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


I disagree. He got a 2.66 GAA and a 9.08 SV%. Sure, that's good, but not like, top 10 goalie in the league kind of good.


Tell me his SV% EV the last 3 years...
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:40 p.m.
#54
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Quoting: rangersandislesfan


yes, but i'm saying NYI is better than PHI right now.



I disagree. He got a 2.66 GAA and a 9.08 SV%. Sure, that's good, but not like, top 10 goalie in the league kind of good.


Tell me his SV% EV the last 3 years...


okay, fair enough ... i still wouldn't call him a top 10 goalie.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:42 p.m.
#55
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I'll do it for you : .929 SV%EV
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:44 p.m.
#56
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Can you tell me what Bobs is the last 3 years EV? Oh wait, it's .929
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:45 p.m.
#57
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
I'll do it for you : .929 SV%EV


his save percentage over the last 3 years is not .929 .. he hasn't even got that in a season in the last 3 years.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:49 p.m.
#58
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Quoting: rangersandislesfan
Quoting: phillyjabroni
I'll do it for you : .929 SV%EV


his save percentage over the last 3 years is not .929 .. he hasn't even got that in a season in the last 3 years.


Steve Mason 5v5 SV% the last three seasons : .940 ; .934 ; .920 Average of .929
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:51 p.m.
#59
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Sergei Bobrovsky 5v% SV% the last three seasons : .925 ; .916 ; .938 Average of .929
Jul. 20, 2017 at 7:51 p.m.
#60
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


As a jets fan this is comforting


as long as you have a decent PK, you have good looks in Mase
Jul. 20, 2017 at 8:51 p.m.
#61
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


... I would say 20-25, sometimes his play is top 10, but needs to keep up his consistency
Jul. 20, 2017 at 8:51 p.m.
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


Steve Mason is a literal piece of garbage that wears pads. He is absolutely NOT a top 15 goalie in the NHL. Do you need a list of goalies in the NHL that are better than Steve Mason? I'll give one to you.

(In no particular order) Price, Holtby, Bobrovsky, Crawford, Quick, Jones, Rinne, Rask, Dubnyk, Allen, Talbot, Lundqvist, Bishop, Fleury, Grubauer, Darling, Smith, Murray, Schneider, Raanta, Howard, Luongo, Elliot, Vasilevskiy, Andersen, Anderson, Gibson, Greiss

That's 28 goalies I'd rather have starting for me than Mason. There are a bunch of other guys that are in that range where I might rather have them over Mason -- Dell, Ward, Pickard, Halak, Hellebuyck, Markstrom, etc

Steve Mason...that's a big yikes. Winnipeg probably got worse by signing him this offseason
Jul. 20, 2017 at 9:04 p.m.
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Quoting: krakowitz
Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


Steve Mason is a literal piece of garbage that wears pads. He is absolutely NOT a top 15 goalie in the NHL. Do you need a list of goalies in the NHL that are better than Steve Mason? I'll give one to you.

(In no particular order) Price, Holtby, Bobrovsky, Crawford, Quick, Jones, Rinne, Rask, Dubnyk, Allen, Talbot, Lundqvist, Bishop, Fleury, Grubauer, Darling, Smith, Murray, Schneider, Raanta, Howard, Luongo, Elliot, Vasilevskiy, Andersen, Anderson, Gibson, Greiss

That's 28 goalies I'd rather have starting for me than Mason. There are a bunch of other guys that are in that range where I might rather have them over Mason -- Dell, Ward, Pickard, Halak, Hellebuyck, Markstrom, etc

Steve Mason...that's a big yikes. Winnipeg probably got worse by signing him this offseason


As a Flyers fan, you couldn't be more wrong. Mason was not only the best FA goalie this offseason, he was one of the only good ones.

Greiss? Grubauer? Darling? Raanat? How many Flyers games did you watch this season?
Jul. 20, 2017 at 9:05 p.m.
#64
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Quoting: Sahil2020
Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


... I would say 20-25, sometimes his play is top 10, but needs to keep up his consistency


I think the inconsistency has more to do with the terrible "defense" that is in front of him.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 10:57 p.m.
#65
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Quoting: krakowitz
Quoting: phillyjabroni
Steve Mason is also an arguable top 10 goalie in the NHL...at least top 15


Steve Mason is a literal piece of garbage that wears pads. He is absolutely NOT a top 15 goalie in the NHL. Do you need a list of goalies in the NHL that are better than Steve Mason? I'll give one to you.

(In no particular order) Price, Holtby, Bobrovsky, Crawford, Quick, Jones, Rinne, Rask, Dubnyk, Allen, Talbot, Lundqvist, Bishop, Fleury, Grubauer, Darling, Smith, Murray, Schneider, Raanta, Howard, Luongo, Elliot, Vasilevskiy, Andersen, Anderson, Gibson, Greiss

That's 28 goalies I'd rather have starting for me than Mason. There are a bunch of other guys that are in that range where I might rather have them over Mason -- Dell, Ward, Pickard, Halak, Hellebuyck, Markstrom, etc

Steve Mason...that's a big yikes. Winnipeg probably got worse by signing him this offseason


I agree with most of this except that line.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 11:05 p.m.
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Quoting: phillyjabroni


As a Flyers fan, you couldn't be more wrong. Mason was not only the best FA goalie this offseason, he was one of the only good ones.

Greiss? Grubauer? Darling? Raanat? How many Flyers games did you watch this season?


As a hockey fan, you're wrong. There were no good FA goalies after Bishop and Darling got signed. Elliot was probably the best available. You realize that if Mason actually was that good, he would have a) gotten more money and b) the Flyers would have retained him instead of Neuvirth

Grubauer, Darling and Raanta had some of the best SV %s in the league last year. Grubauer would have started 50-60 games if he were a Flyer. Darling and Raanta probably would have gotten 50, Greiss too.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 11:43 p.m.
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Quoting: krakowitz
Quoting: phillyjabroni


As a Flyers fan, you couldn't be more wrong. Mason was not only the best FA goalie this offseason, he was one of the only good ones.

Greiss? Grubauer? Darling? Raanat? How many Flyers games did you watch this season?


As a hockey fan, you're wrong. There were no good FA goalies after Bishop and Darling got signed. Elliot was probably the best available. You realize that if Mason actually was that good, he would have a) gotten more money and b) the Flyers would have retained him instead of Neuvirth

Grubauer, Darling and Raanta had some of the best SV %s in the league last year. Grubauer would have started 50-60 games if he were a Flyer. Darling and Raanta probably would have gotten 50, Greiss too.


Great analysis on Mason. He hates a tandem, hence the departure from Philadelphia. He hated the majority of the Front Office within Philadelphia. Ideally, we would have kept Mason, since he is a very constant goaltender, with the defense being the inconstancy.

Here my point of contention that you haven't countered. In the last 3 years, here are the 28 players you said better than Mason with their 5v5 SV% ranked :

1.) Price - .939
2.) Anderson - .935
3.) Murray - .933
3.) Raanta - .933
5.) Holtby - .932
5.) Crawford - .932
5.) Darling - .932
8.) Dubnyuk - .931
9.) Grubauer - .930 (14-15 excluded ; 13-14 used)
10.) Bobrovsky - .929
10.) Mason - .929
12.) Quick - .927
12.) Talbot - .927
12.) Schneider - .927
15.) Lundquvist - .926
15.) Rinne - .926
17.) Elliot - .925
17.) Andresen - .925
17.) Greiss - .925
20.) Lunongo - .924
21.) Rask - .923
21.) Smith - .923
21.) Gibson - .923
21.) Bishop - .923
25.) Fleury - .922
26.) Vasilevski - .921
27.) Allen - .920
27.) Jones - .920

It can be vehemently determined that the 9 players listed before Mason are not only better defensive teams, but have a play a more defensive style. Holtby, Raanta, Grubauer, Darling, Crawford are "Products of the System". If I were to theoretically put Steve Mason into the Washington's Net, and put Gruabauer into the Philadelphia Net, the 5v5 SV% would rise dramatically for Mason and steeply decline for Grubaurer.
Jul. 20, 2017 at 11:59 p.m.
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Quoting: krakowitz


As a hockey fan, you're wrong. There were no good FA goalies after Bishop and Darling got signed. Elliot was probably the best available. You realize that if Mason actually was that good, he would have a) gotten more money and b) the Flyers would have retained him instead of Neuvirth

Grubauer, Darling and Raanta had some of the best SV %s in the league last year. Grubauer would have started 50-60 games if he were a Flyer. Darling and Raanta probably would have gotten 50, Greiss too.


Great analysis on Mason. He hates a tandem, hence the departure from Philadelphia. He hated the majority of the Front Office within Philadelphia. Ideally, we would have kept Mason, since he is a very constant goaltender, with the defense being the inconstancy.

Here my point of contention that you haven't countered. In the last 3 years, here are the 28 players you said better than Mason with their 5v5 SV% ranked :

1.) Price - .939
2.) Anderson - .935
3.) Murray - .933
3.) Raanta - .933
5.) Holtby - .932
5.) Crawford - .932
5.) Darling - .932
8.) Dubnyuk - .931
9.) Grubauer - .930 (14-15 excluded ; 13-14 used)
10.) Bobrovsky - .929
10.) Mason - .929
12.) Quick - .927
12.) Talbot - .927
12.) Schneider - .927
15.) Lundquvist - .926
15.) Rinne - .926
17.) Elliot - .925
17.) Andresen - .925
17.) Greiss - .925
20.) Lunongo - .924
21.) Rask - .923
21.) Smith - .923
21.) Gibson - .923
21.) Bishop - .923
25.) Fleury - .922
26.) Vasilevski - .921
27.) Allen - .920
27.) Jones - .920

It can be vehemently determined that the 9 players listed before Mason are not only better defensive teams, but have a play a more defensive style. Holtby, Raanta, Grubauer, Darling, Crawford are "Products of the System". If I were to theoretically put Steve Mason into the Washington's Net, and put Gruabauer into the Philadelphia Net, the 5v5 SV% would rise dramatically for Mason and steeply decline for Grubaurer.


SV% doesn't tell everything.
Jul. 21, 2017 at 12:00 a.m.
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Quoting: rangersandislesfan
Quoting: phillyjabroni


Great analysis on Mason. He hates a tandem, hence the departure from Philadelphia. He hated the majority of the Front Office within Philadelphia. Ideally, we would have kept Mason, since he is a very constant goaltender, with the defense being the inconstancy.

Here my point of contention that you haven't countered. In the last 3 years, here are the 28 players you said better than Mason with their 5v5 SV% ranked :

1.) Price - .939
2.) Anderson - .935
3.) Murray - .933
3.) Raanta - .933
5.) Holtby - .932
5.) Crawford - .932
5.) Darling - .932
8.) Dubnyuk - .931
9.) Grubauer - .930 (14-15 excluded ; 13-14 used)
10.) Bobrovsky - .929
10.) Mason - .929
12.) Quick - .927
12.) Talbot - .927
12.) Schneider - .927
15.) Lundquvist - .926
15.) Rinne - .926
17.) Elliot - .925
17.) Andresen - .925
17.) Greiss - .925
20.) Lunongo - .924
21.) Rask - .923
21.) Smith - .923
21.) Gibson - .923
21.) Bishop - .923
25.) Fleury - .922
26.) Vasilevski - .921
27.) Allen - .920
27.) Jones - .920

It can be vehemently determined that the 9 players listed before Mason are not only better defensive teams, but have a play a more defensive style. Holtby, Raanta, Grubauer, Darling, Crawford are "Products of the System". If I were to theoretically put Steve Mason into the Washington's Net, and put Gruabauer into the Philadelphia Net, the 5v5 SV% would rise dramatically for Mason and steeply decline for Grubaurer.


SV% doesn't tell everything.

You're right, the way my Uncle Bob "sees them play" is most important
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Jul. 21, 2017 at 1:37 a.m.
#70
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Quoting: krakowitz


As a hockey fan, you're wrong. There were no good FA goalies after Bishop and Darling got signed. Elliot was probably the best available. You realize that if Mason actually was that good, he would have a) gotten more money and b) the Flyers would have retained him instead of Neuvirth

Grubauer, Darling and Raanta had some of the best SV %s in the league last year. Grubauer would have started 50-60 games if he were a Flyer. Darling and Raanta probably would have gotten 50, Greiss too.


Great analysis on Mason. He hates a tandem, hence the departure from Philadelphia. He hated the majority of the Front Office within Philadelphia. Ideally, we would have kept Mason, since he is a very constant goaltender, with the defense being the inconstancy.

Here my point of contention that you haven't countered. In the last 3 years, here are the 28 players you said better than Mason with their 5v5 SV% ranked :

1.) Price - .939
2.) Anderson - .935
3.) Murray - .933
3.) Raanta - .933
5.) Holtby - .932
5.) Crawford - .932
5.) Darling - .932
8.) Dubnyuk - .931
9.) Grubauer - .930 (14-15 excluded ; 13-14 used)
10.) Bobrovsky - .929
10.) Mason - .929
12.) Quick - .927
12.) Talbot - .927
12.) Schneider - .927
15.) Lundquvist - .926
15.) Rinne - .926
17.) Elliot - .925
17.) Andresen - .925
17.) Greiss - .925
20.) Lunongo - .924
21.) Rask - .923
21.) Smith - .923
21.) Gibson - .923
21.) Bishop - .923
25.) Fleury - .922
26.) Vasilevski - .921
27.) Allen - .920
27.) Jones - .920

It can be vehemently determined that the 9 players listed before Mason are not only better defensive teams, but have a play a more defensive style. Holtby, Raanta, Grubauer, Darling, Crawford are "Products of the System". If I were to theoretically put Steve Mason into the Washington's Net, and put Gruabauer into the Philadelphia Net, the 5v5 SV% would rise dramatically for Mason and steeply decline for Grubaurer.


So you find an extremely specific stat (probably the only one Mason is decent in) and say that makes him a top 10 goalie? And did you ever consider that the defensive system the Caps have is centered around our goalies? Because if you actually knew what you were talking about here, you'd know that Holts and Gruby are the reasons our defensive system works so well.
Jul. 21, 2017 at 1:57 a.m.
#71
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If you throw Mason into the Caps net, you still make the playoffs. If you throw Grubauer into the Flyers net, they don't make the playoffs.

This specific stat actually compares how good goalies are when you remove special teams, something that typically good teams have good ones of.
Jul. 21, 2017 at 2:02 a.m.
#72
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The Flyers have had a PK under 80% over the last 3 seasons, yet Mason still stands on his head when on 5v5...seems like a PK problem than a Mason problem
Jul. 21, 2017 at 10:19 a.m.
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I would caution against saying Mason and Bobrovsky are equivalents. Even though Columbus' defense has been better recently than Philly's, they still have plenty of holes, and when Bobrovsky isn't playing well, it's obvious (similar to the situation in Montreal). On the aggregate they have similar numbers, but Bobrovsky can by truly dominant for long stretches.

Overall, Bobrovsky shouldn't be underestimated, but Winnipeg is likely getting a much-needed goalie improvement. Mason is good.
Jul. 21, 2017 at 10:24 a.m.
#74
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Quoting: tadhockey
I would caution against saying Mason and Bobrovsky are equivalents. Even though Columbus' defense has been better recently than Philly's, they still have plenty of holes, and when Bobrovsky isn't playing well, it's obvious (similar to the situation in Montreal). On the aggregate they have similar numbers, but Bobrovsky can by truly dominant for long stretches.

Overall, Bobrovsky shouldn't be underestimated, but Winnipeg is likely getting a much-needed goalie improvement. Mason is good.


Not attempting to say that Bob=Mase. I am stating that if you remove the Flyers bottom-3rd PK from the SV%, you have a great goalie. I mean, if he played with a team with actual defensemen (Provorov and Gudas are the only defensemen ; Ghost is an offensmen ; Manning is a bounty hunter ; MacDonald is a pylon ; MDZ is a poor mans offense men ; Shultz is scratched ; Streit is decent, nothing to write home about) - he would actually have stats that enhance his play
Jul. 21, 2017 at 12:24 p.m.
#75
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Quoting: tadhockey
I would caution against saying Mason and Bobrovsky are equivalents. Even though Columbus' defense has been better recently than Philly's, they still have plenty of holes, and when Bobrovsky isn't playing well, it's obvious (similar to the situation in Montreal). On the aggregate they have similar numbers, but Bobrovsky can by truly dominant for long stretches.

Overall, Bobrovsky shouldn't be underestimated, but Winnipeg is likely getting a much-needed goalie improvement. Mason is good.


Not attempting to say that Bob=Mase. I am stating that if you remove the Flyers bottom-3rd PK from the SV%, you have a great goalie. I mean, if he played with a team with actual defensemen (Provorov and Gudas are the only defensemen ; Ghost is an offensmen ; Manning is a bounty hunter ; MacDonald is a pylon ; MDZ is a poor mans offense men ; Shultz is scratched ; Streit is decent, nothing to write home about) - he would actually have stats that enhance his play


Stop being bias and realize Mason is not that great of a goalie. He is a good but not great. You curve stats to prove your point, which makes sense. In the last 3 seasons he has a .918 save percentage to go along with a 2.47 GAA. That is not top 10 goalie material. Maybe top 20 but not top 10. He also allows soft goals to go in when they shouldn't and is not very consistent.

Maybe you don't have a great defense but you can't always use that as an excuse to why the goalie's numbers are bad. Elliott is a perfect example of that. Calgary had a good defense and the guy lets in goals from the half boards and stunk up the playoffs and parts of the regular season. Mason would not be a starter on a playoff contending team, reason why he went to the Jets.
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