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May 22, 2015
2nd Favourite Team
Tampa Bay Lightning
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<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Claesson4Norris</b></div><div>Bozak is basically just a one year buffer player. Anisimov is a good 3rd/4th C, but Bozak has history playing higher than that. Basically my thought process is that Bozak can be a one year option as a centre, and it lets you comfortably trade Chris Tierney, without having to go fully young down the middle, which I'm not sure is the smartest for Development. You could in theory sign a centre on a 1 year deal, but this way let's you add a pick to accomplish the same goal. Bozak would be a good Vet leader for Ottawa for one year, and come deadline he's a very tradable asset.
He shouldn't be playing as the 1st line center, but Ottawa doesn't have any immediately better options. Colin White will likely be the top Checking centre against top lines, and that leaves you with whichever of Brown or Norris makes the team. I think you're hoping Brown/Norris can take the top spot, but you don't just hand him the job out of camp. You put him as the 2/3and make him earn it.
Also trading Anisimov is mostly just so I can have Chlapik as 4C full time, which I think needs to happen, because he was great on the 4th line this year. Zub will still have the russian Connection with Zaitsev, who isn't going anywhere for at least a couple of years.
Also as far as Cernak is concerned, I gave him 5 years, because he presumably is a long term piece on that blueline. He's 22, and you make that offersheet because you think he fits in alongside JBD and Thomson. If you view him as just a stopgap, I don't think you make the offersheet, and you look at other options.
Zaitsev isn't a player I factor into the long term. I would be surprised to see him finish that contract playing for the Sens. He's probably going to be around for another 2 years, but after that he's either bought put or Traded. After two more years, you expect JBD and Thomson to be on the Sens.</div></div>
Thank you for explaining all of that, it makes all your moves really clear. And I really hope Zaitsev can improve, but if not, then hopefully as you say the Sens can find a way to move that contract eventually
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Green4D4Again</b></div><div>Apologies for the sarcasm. But, you've been insinuating a bridge deal throughout this entire thread so I'm calling you out. You've also said trading him if he wants 8 million per. That's ludicrous considering the situation Ottawa is in. If any other team had Ottawa's cap space, 8x8 is a steal.
If you trade a rising star before his first contract, does that instill faith in the fan base that we will keep Byfield/Stutzle/Lafreniere/Batherson/Brannstrom/Norris if they ask for market value? If you low-ball the player during contract negotiations, do you think he'd consider staying if upper management thinks he's not worth keeping at a higher price for what he brings on and off the ice? If you bridge deal a rising star for no good reason other than "prove-it again", what does that tell the player?
What does that mean for Chabot and White when you won't commit long term a future captain/assistant captain/friend?</div></div>
Not sure how I insinuated that, I hate bridge deals, especially with the Sens. $8 million just doesn't make sense for Brady. He's an incredible player at around $7 million, especially when compared to Chabot, who is the better player. And I think it's a stretch to say 8x8 is a steal. Honestly, I just don't even think Tkachuk and his agent will be looking for 8x8, even they probably see and know that that is too much. Maybe if Brady decides not to sign and has an amazing year and then negotiates, he could ask for 8x8 or even 9x8, but not now. It obviously won't look good if Ottawa trades Tkachuk, and they won't, because I'm pretty confident they'll be able to sign him to a reasonable contract. It also won't look good if Ottawa locks him up, 8x8, and he never surpasses the 50-point mark in a single season.
Trades are okay... but I don't understand why Ottawa wouldn't just keep Anisimov and his contract, helps meet the cap floor anyways, and I would never see Bozak on the top line, unless Ottawa wants to battle for another lottery pick next season. The Cernak signing is very interesting, he could be good with Chabot, but again, you signed him for 5 years when there are JBD and Lassi Thomson who should be ready before then, and Zaitsev is locked too. Also, I like Anisimov, along with Zaitsev, to help Zub integrate smoothly from Russia on and off the ice. I don't imagine Anisimov will be traded, and Zub I think is a factor in that. <div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Green4D4Again</b></div><div>Ah yes, in 5 years. Let's bridge deal this young star so he feels alienated and then act surprised when he doesn't want to commit long term. Worked so well with Stone, didn't it?
It's easy to give "prove it" contracts to someone like Duclair because of his lack of consistency season to season. But, Dorion would be setting himself up for disaster if he doesn't commit long term to Tkachuk. He's 20 years old. Has two 20 goal seasons under his belt, can keep up physically, is a p***k to play against, has leadership qualities to him, draws all the penalties and is a beauty off the ice. How many of those guys listed above have played a full NHL season? Do you think all those guys are going to be worth their potential? If anyone has earned his contract so far, its Tkachuk. 8x8 is more than fair. The cheaper the better. If he signs for less than that, feel free to call me out because I would love to be wrong in this case.</div></div>
When did I say "let's bridge deal this young star". Quite the contrary, I want to lock him up long-term, hopefully to an 8-year deal. You should relax with your sarcasm. I agree, he has leadership qualities and does all those great things that you say, I freaking love Brady, but not at 8 x 8. This discussion is going nowhere, and I will say again that this is just what I think, so take it easy
This is a poor trade on many levels. Ottawa does not need another offensive minded LD, or any other LD to begin with. The Sens have Chabot, Brannstrom, and Wolanin. How about Rasmus Andersson, Jakob Pelletier, and a 2020 1st round pick for Tkachuk and Zaitsev. Andersson can then be the RD that Chabot needs, Pelletier can develop hopefully into a strong RW, and the Sens add another 1st rounder in a strong draft, while moving Zaitsev's contract. I still don't like this for Ottawa, maybe Dube needs to be added as well, but something like this is more reasonable to get Ottawa to even consider moving their best forward. <div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Green4D4Again</b></div><div>In a few years, Ryan will no longer be paid by Ottawa, freeing up 7.25 million. Anisimov (4.55) and Gaborik's contract (4.75) are gone after next year. If a CBO is used, Zaitsev will be gone. That frees up another 4.5 right away (21 million total). Even at that, Zaitsev is our only competent RHD right now so I think he'll stay put. Point is, I don't think paying players will be a problem down the road. I think hitting the cap floor will be the issue. I also find it funny that apart from White and Chabot, that those 4 guys are the highest paid on the team. It's a wonderful problem to have when you have a solid prospect pool.
Tkachuk drove the majority of the play this year (as a winger) so I think the talent is there to get away with paying him 8x8 (which isn't a lot when the cap is going up in a few years). Imagine what he could do with an actual top talent center that isn't Colin White or Chris Tierney? Two 20 goal seasons as a 20 year old is nothing to scoff at.</div></div>
Trust me, that cap space will be gone quickly when Batherson, Norris, Lafrenière, Brannstrom, Formenton, Byfield...etc are all going to eventually earn lots of money. The team shouldn't overspend, to make sure they have enough space to sign as many players as possible in the future so they can stay as competitive as possible for as long as possible. Again, in my opinion, Tkachuk is not worth $ 8 million right now, maybe after 5 years he will be. That's my take on this
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>jassan28</b></div><div>Unpopular Opinion: Brady should be paid 8 million if signed at 8 years because his ceiling is better than 9.5 million dollar Mark Stone</div></div>
Not sure his ceiling is better. I think Tkachuk is better than Stone in hitting, crashing the net, shooting a lot, and in skating, but Stone's defensive game, takeaway expertise, his shot's accuracy and release, and the fact that he's in his prime, I think, make Tkachuk's next contract non-comparable to the one Stone recently got.
Again, Chabot got paid $8 million to play 30 minutes a night, he is extremely talented, calm, and potentially the team's captain. Tkachuk will get paid big, just hopefully not as big as Chabot. Ottawa will need that cap space in a few years.
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Green4D4Again</b></div><div>You also forget that he has the same agent as JG Pageau, Erik Karlsson and Mark Stone (Newport Sports Management). All of which are now gone. The agent is also not a fan of either Pierre Dorion or Eugene Melnyk and was not a fan of the handling of 2 out of 3 of those clients (Karlsson and Stone). He'll get 8+ and an offersheet isn't out of the question. Or, they sign him to a 2-3 year bridge deal similar to his brother and then ask for more. Or they walk him to arbitration and then we have a similar situation with Stone.</div></div>
If he wants more than $ 8 million, as much as I love him, the team might as well trade him because he is not worth more than $ 8 million (though he might be in 5 years). His agents won't ask for $ 8 million because his agents aren't stupid. I'm not sure which other team would offer sheet him over that money either. And you can't compare Tkachuk to Karlsson, Stone, or Pageau, they're all very different players and situations. Ottawa signed Karlsson long-term to $6 million a year, and Karlsson was better. Pageau is turning 28 years old this year and is an awesome third line centre, Stone took years to develop and was really good when he was 24 years old, and by the time he was traded, he was in his prime and wanted to capitalize on the highest deal he could long-term. Brady is 20 years old and has yet to surpass 45 points after two seasons. Brady shouldn't be paid over $8 million, more than what Karlsson or Stone were ever paid when they were on the team. His brother, Matthew, has produced more points and his contract made sense. Tkachuk's will too, as long as it isn't over the amount you're saying