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aadoyle
Hakuna Matata
Member Since
Feb. 13, 2020
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Toronto Maple Leafs
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Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 4 at 7:35 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>NorthernLeafsFan05</b></div><div>This is such a horrible take. We still have no idea what lies in store for Boucher. This Marner hate is just ridiculous, <strong>what does this team benefit by trading him</strong>? Just ride out the last year of JTs deal, this isn't the end of the world. Marner is the second best player on this team. Trading him would be a ginormous mistake. Can the team benefit from trading away Mitch? Absolutely, but does trading away Mitcth guarantee we will be better? Not even remotely. In fact, it's more likely we become significantly worse. There are ways to build out this roster even with Mitch.</div></div>
Cap flexibility to build a proper contender
Have we not figured this out 3 guys making double digits does not work and come next year unless something changes were gonna have 4
53% of our Cap is gonna be spend on 4 forwards.
We have enough of a sample for Marner to know he get yah to the playoffs but then fumbles in the big moments especially when things get physical
BOS series last season, FLA series, MTL series, CBJ series all taught us that
Trading him would not be a ginormous mistake thats the bad take here. Were so scared of change we would rather keep these guys and give them big fat contracts then try and trade them and explore something new
No no change is bad lets keep everyone around and give them more money despite the results
We are ****ED
As letting him play out this season and walk for nothing is what not to do 101 and after the Gaudreau situation Brad cannot let that happen again. He and the organization need to put pressure on Marner and his camp he does not want to waive fine have fun in the pressbox
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 4 at 5:18 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
Lane Lambert is being soon gonna be hired for an associate coach position with TML and Dean Chynoweth (PK coach) not expected to return
Meanwhile were still stuck with Boucher and Marner's camp has 0 desire to let him be traded and would rather have him play out the season and probs walk for nothing (0 desire to pay him 12-13m)
Yea the era of change is once again not gonna be on the core but everyone around them when will they ever learn lul
Now things can always change between now and July but if his camps tune does not change then Leafs need to play hardball. Sit him in that pressbox till he goes I want out
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 4 at 5:11 p.m.
Thread:
If you are reading this and your name is Matthew hello there
Spending assets to move a player is a no
That would be poor asset management 101
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 4 at 5:07 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Trickster</b></div><div>Rangers gonna hard pressed on cap, Schneider probably will cost less to sign so no.
I think Rangers will Lindgren, sometime back I was doing Lindgren for McCabe trades.</div></div>
Trading McCabe for Lindgren would be a bad move IMO
McCabe can play both sides and did well at it keeping him despite the age is the smarter move
Lindgren's success has been mainly due to who he's played with as Adam Fox is a good defender. Away from him results have been iffy
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 4 at 1:12 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>Marners camp just came out and said they won't be helping facilitate a trade.
So Uhh, yeah they are THAT petty</div></div>
Sit him in the pressbox the whole season or till he demands a trade
He wants to play that kind of game well lets play.
Has every opportunity to do good by TOR and himself and he just ****s it over not just once, not just twice, more times than I can count lul
Management should tell Berube to sit him till he relents and his reps agree to do a trade
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 4 at 2:09 a.m.
Thread:
we are unfortunately running it back
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>KingExLeafs</b></div><div>Too much money and term for Bertuzzi and Zadorov. Roy probably won't sign here. And Liljegren and Robertson are too soft and small to play on a Berube team.</div></div>
Thats not to much money and term for Bertuzzi
Bertuzzi wants a long term deal and if he's willing to sign that go for it thats a discount compared to what he can get in FA
As for Zadorov agreed besides TOR has 0 need for a LD its already set
Rielly
McCabe
Benoit
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 4 at 1:48 a.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMBL</b></div><div>Norris is injury prone, so that might be why they would likely want to keep Greig and he's someone who can help them now on a cheap deal. They know what they have with him, so better off giving something else than trying to replace him. They are probably drafting a RH defender and not a forward with the 7th OV , although if they get Lindstrom it's probably to replace Norris down the line if need be.
Also, they'll try to give the least possible, especially to their division rivals, Batherson + Chychrun is already plenty which will be required to get Marner but they aren't trying to build the Leafs' team. I could be wrong but that's just the way I see it, they are getting Liljgren so maybe they would be open to that. Staois also seems like the guy to take his time especially since he's new vs Dorion or McPhee/McCrimmon.</div></div>
There arent many RD worth being up there in the top 10 as u dont want another Boucher situation but who knows with them lul
Its tricky but as I said I think with Brady's comments, the teams wanting to get to the playoffs, and TOR desire for change something's there and it would not surprise me if we see something like I suggested
As we have seen before to try and promote change OTT has not been scared to gamble
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 4 at 1:42 a.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>oneX</b></div><div>He's already shown he's petty. The worshipper comment pretty much shows how full of himself he really is.
Can't put anything passed him at this point.</div></div>
I think yes Marner has shown it but that would make it on a whole notha level that nobody not even his father or agent would want him going there as it would ruin him
IMO I think both sides will work together on a move but its not gonna be July 2nd on the dot
Would not surprise me if its August or September we see something
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 4 at 1:29 a.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMBL</b></div><div>There has been reports or rumors that OTT wouldn't is trying to move one of Chychrun or Chabot which makes sense and I wouldn't be surprised if they are looking to move Norris. They probably would absolutely have interest in Marner and could be wiling to give up Batherson, but I don't see why they would also give Greig. It'll be two roster players for two roster players and some futures to balance things out. It could perhaps be Chychrun + Greig too instead as the main pieces but the 3 for Marner + Liljegren is almost too perfect for the Leafs, the only way it could be better is if Chychrun was RH'ed. OTT gets the best player in the deal and a RHD that they need but he hasn't proven he could be a top 4D yet so it's not like he's a perfect fit for them to give up an extra roster player that brings some value.
I think Vegas is the best chance for the Leafs to get a D+F combo if they are willing to move Theodore. It will likely turn out better for the Leafs (but also a lot better for Vegas) even if they are getting Theodore + Roy instead of Theodore+Karlsson.</div></div>
I think if you can get a sign and trade you could probs get Greig + Batherson and Chycrun for Marner (with ext) + Liligren and if absolutely necessary u throw in some guys rights u dont have plans for like SDA or something.
IMO even with Greig included I think its a win/win
As imagine
Tkachuck-Norris-Marner
Stutzle-Pinto-Giroux
Thats a solid top 6 for OTT
It kind of is like the
Schwidt + Huberdeau + Weegar for Tkachuck like deal
He came in a sign and trade and FLA basically gave up a nice prospect and at the time 2 nice roster players one of which also had 100 points lul
In this example OTT yes gives up something better than Schwidt but gets Liligren
I think with Bradey's comments OTT may bite the bullet. As if they draft Lindstrom this year anyway u can argue Greig's expendable
If not there are always backup options like VGK
As for what I would want if they want matching salary
Howden + Roy + Theodore or Whitecloud + Theodore + Roy I would be fine with
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 4 at 12:16 a.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMBL</b></div><div>What I meant about not rushing is more so locking in two top 4 UFA D. Signing one and getting one via trade (or waiting next year for another FA signing) is definitely the way to go. Timmins hasn't really had much of a chance but I don't mind moving off him if they get a legitimate top 4 offensive threat like Chychrun but I don't think you're getting a guy like that except via trade. Replacing him with Rifai for cap reasons is fine as well, but only if it's needed. There is Montour in FA but getting stuck in that contract is probably not worth it, getting their defensive anchor from FA is more likely to work out better.
As for the Marner to OTT trade, don't think Ottawa includes Greig in that trade so it's perhaps a close to ideal trade return for Marner but don't think it's realistic.</div></div>
Apparently OTT is looking to do a big splash on par with what we saw between FLA and CGY and its been something heard form Friedman and reporters who follow OTT closely and when we see how OTT been, new ownership, etc it makes sense.
I think if its a deal for a 90-100 point guy they can slot with Stuzle and Tkachuck I think they would not mind losing Greig as its not like he's Pinto or Stutle
As if we think about it Marner replaces his PK and they have Pinto, Stutzle, and Norris as their top 9 C's
If they can get a sign and traded Marner and Liligren they would be more open to include Greig
Plus they have the 7th OA and 25 OA pick this year anyway can always draft a C to replace him such as Cayden Lindstrom
If not OTT there is another team and its in the Pacific and likes its big toyz
VGK
And when you look at their history Marners up there
Trade for Patches, Stone, Eichel and apparently were 1 pick away from EK
In FA they signed guys like Pietrangelo
They lost R1 after going all in and Marner screams okay **** it we try again lul
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 3 at 11:46 p.m.
Thread:
With Marner on Team
To much for Brossoit
No to that Montour deal
To soon for Minten and Cowan
Like man that Dcore's gonna have no defense with Montour, Klingberg, and Rielly on it lul
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 3 at 11:44 p.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMBL</b></div><div>Would rather the Leafs draft in the first round unless the available talent at 24 OV on defense is similar to what they can get in the 2nd round. I like the idea of getting Gustavsson but I don't think Minnesota is going to be willing to take on Liljegren as he's arb eligible which could complicate their cap situation. If they are or if Robertson+ works then I would be for it. Alternatively, going for Talbot or Brossoit in FA would be a decent move if they can get them on a very cheap 2-year deal or a 1-year deal.
I do think Liljegren will get traded but it might not be right away. Personally, I would hope that they don't rush to fill the top 4 D spots with the best available UFAs. The Leafs absolutely need at least one UFA to replace Brodie but getting two guys just boxes them in and they'll likely still need defensive upgrades. This year is the year to get the defensively responsible top 4 D, next year FA would be the year to get the one with offensive upside. Of course, if they can acquire someone via trade that would be great too. They could maybe sign someone like Tanev on a short-term deal in addition to their big UFA signing, and maybe bring back Klingberg on a cheap deal, and keep Timmins since they'll need someone to move the puck. I would hate if they brought Edmundson back either on a cheap short-term deal. So maybe they could start the season with something like:
Rielly - Roy
McCabe - Benoit/Klingberg/Timmins
Edmundson - Liljegren
If an opportunity arises to acquire someone with Liljegren+ like Chychrun for example that has offensive upside, that would push Benoit/Klingberg/Timmins to the 3rd pairing which would not be that bad.
With Tanev instead of Edmundson the season-opening roster would probably look more like this:
Rielly - Roy
McCabe - Tanev
Benoit - Liljegren/Klingberg/Timmins
Leafs should be aiming to have a D-Core that is clearly better than their 2021-22 one that featured Rielly, Brodie, Muzzin, Giordano, Lybushkin, and the inexperienced pair of Liljegren and Sandin. Roy would be similar to Brodie (maybe a better fit for Rielly but I think 1 to 1 not as good), McCabe would be a the lesser version of Rielly, Walker the offensive version of Holl (decent bottom pairing guy that can be utilized on special teams that's forced into the top 4), Benoit would be a less experienced but more mobile version of Giordano, and Korczak is probably the next Liljegren/Sandin come playoff time that will get replaced by a TDL acquisition. At the time, a lot of people were saying that the Leafs were missing another top 2-D man, and I would agree that they needed another top-2 Dman or reliable top-4 Dman that can contribute offensively.
The year after they can try acquiring Rasmus Andersson who would probably be easier to get or if someone like Theodore makes it to free agency maybe they could squeeze him in. The bottom fix could also be addressed if need with someone like Scott Laughton at 3C if he's not traded this year. Patience is going to be key to the Leafs successfully re-shaping their team.</div></div>
Keeping Timmins is a no. Guys run his course here and its time to move on. He had 1 decent showing then meh. Rafai and that guy they brought from Europe can do the same at less cost.
And I argue you do need to rush things a bit. This is arguably a make or break offseason to start the era of change and for this team to finally make some noise and not just be regular season wonders. They got a 4 year window its go time
Cause while Matthews did extend times ticking to where if nothing changes by 2027 he may ask to be moved
As for Chycrun there is a way to do it heck involving more pieces.
If both sides are willing to bite the bullet there is a trade that can help TOR and OTT
Greig + Batherson + Chycrun for Marner + Liligren
TOR gets 2 forwards to replace aspects of Marner's game and a top 4 Dman who can shift Rielly to PP unit 2
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 3 at 11:29 p.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>NorthernLeafsFan05</b></div><div>You mean a near carbon copy of the bottom 6 we just used for an entire season? Dewars presence on the 4th line was a much needed surge and the kid 3rd line has it all. If you look back at the 2023 2024 season and conclude that our forward group was the issue, I've got it things to say:
1. You're straight up wrong
2. Look at teams like Boston. It's not about having elite talent all the way down the lineup, it's about having players that buy into your system.
This blueline is 100x better than what we iced this year. Roy would be the best partner Rielly has ever had. Walker would help our PK immensely in lieu of Brodies departure while also giving us some much needed offense. No idea why you think Vegas says no, Robertson is the best player in the trade and Korczak has no role on that roster as a young righty with no waiver exemption. I can see an argument against trading for Gus, but he's easily the best available option. Regardless, Liljegren will be traded (which I don't agree with, but it's going to happen).
There is no reason to move Mitch. I've had a lot of fun speculating and indulging myself with the large amount of cap space we'd get by trading him, but it simply makes no sense. The oldest member of the core 4 has one year left. Why would we trade our second best player to alleviate our cap situation when it'll resolve itself in one season? Ride out the precious ELCs of Knies and Cowan as well as Wolls crazy good contract. Mitch Marner isn't a player you trade just to make a move. He's a legitimate superstar and a huge part of this team's success.
Guys like Holmberg, Cowan, Knies, McMann, and Dewar are going to be real good under Berube. Holmberg is literally the exact kind of player we've needed for years. Cowan is extremely dynamic and fast, Knies is a beast, McMann is an excellent forechecker, and Dewar is a workhorse. They aren't the flashiest bunch of forwards, but they are really good. Better than you seem to think anyways.</div></div>
Only upgrade is the blue line but as I told yah 1000x over VGK will move Whitecloud over Korczak for cap reasons. If he's that cheap why would they be stupid and trade him when they can just move Whitecloud making 2.75m and whose 27 lul.
And as me and others have told yah on the other forms bottom 6 also not good enough
If we thought we had scoring problems this is just adding to it. Cowen coming wont change that lul
And there is a reason to move Mitch the<strong> bottom 6 lul </strong>
If we think Leafs are gonna do anything with that oh boy were even more screwed then we realize. Were gonna get to the playoffs and they gonna fall short thanks to it
We got 4 years to win a cup and this teams just gonna waste one of them
Move Marner better balance everything as keeping him and letting him walk is dumb and extending him is just entering the insane asylum
He's not gonna figure it out with a new HC lul, he's had years to do it with 2 different guys, this is him he gets yah to the playoffs and then when things get physical struggles
Berube wont like that
Look at teams who won the cup and look at their 3rd lines
TBL
Goodrow-Gourde-Coleman
VGK
Smith-Karlsson-Amadio
AVS
Newhook-Compher-O'Connor
Cowen-Holmberg-McMann aint anything close
And dont use BOS example as their B6 showed they can get to R2 then get beatup by a better B6 lul
To win teams need balance look at FLA and EDM balanced not top heavy lines
If TOR goes into next season with 4 guys in double digits eating a way at their cap space were once again gonna go no where. 9 years should have taught us that you cant win with 3 guys in double digits and if nothing changes were gonna add another
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 3 at 9:34 p.m.
Thread:
Marner For Martin
Lets be real we all know Canes are just promoting Tulsky. He already was taking more and more responsibility in Canes org and set up many of their trades
I dont see Canes have interest in Marner due to his extension demands and them not having the stomach to pay guys at times
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Jun. 3 at 9:28 p.m.
Thread:
Enough of this Tomfoolery
VGK rejects
No thanks to that Min trade
Jarnkrok probs goes for less as he's gonna be a cap out move
This team highlights why Marner's got to go
Thats a firable offense having that be the B6
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 8:41 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>ehh</div></div>
Is that a good ehh or a bad ehh
Or just using the classic Canadian expression for maybe we go for something bigger
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 8:31 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>RipNasty</b></div><div>Yes</div></div>
Well sadly then as I said before he's in for a very rude awakening from the rest of the league as that kind of attitude will get yah nowhere especially here
We all heard Berube "its about the team" and if he hears thats what Marner's up to have fun in the pressbox
Actually maybe thats best as then he will get sick of it and ask out himself lul
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 8:29 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>2nd</div></div>
Yea thats fair
But yea if they up for it Drury for Liligren would be something I think could work for both sides
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 8:25 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>Not a chance Carolina agrees to that</div></div>
Which one the one for one or the bigger one
Cause yea the last one probs is to much on our side
But I think the one for one was fair
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 8:03 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>Carolina would be a team in on Lily.
Not sure they have things that help us in return though, unless we are adding 23 to get Necas - who I am ambivalent about</div></div>
I wonder about Drury for Liligren
Drury to me feels like a breakout candidate and with some more mins could shine here as our 3c. He's good in the faceoff circle and I think there's something there
If not you could try for a blockbuster also involving Marner
If no blockbuster I wouldnt be opposed to something like Necas + Drury for 23 OA + Liligren as a tier below blockbuster trade
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 7:56 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>Who said anything about finding him a spot? He's getting traded
Depends honestly. I'm expecting something like:
Lily +23 to CHI for Jones (2 mil ret) and 67 (or 72)</div></div>
NGL I can also see that happening
Im in the mindset of 2 trades
Something like what we saw between EDM and CAR to where Liligren gets shipped out for some nice swiss army knife top 9 guy
OR...
He and Marner are packaged together in some blockbuster deal as to where idk but that would make for a crazy summer lul
But yea I think most of us can agree he's probs gone
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 7:49 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Random2152</b></div><div>All I'm going to say about Lily is that 2 things are true about him.
1) He's getting shipped out
2) If he were on another team, Leafs fans would be begging for a D like him and offering insane trades</div></div>
You want a pick for him or a player coming back kind of like Bear for Foegele
For me if we can get Hoglander I would be pretty happy
As for if were gonna beg for someone like him idk. As if Brad has his way his upgrade's probs coming this summer as to who idk
But im fully expecting 2-3 new Dman on this blue line next year as to who idk. Now if they **** up the replacement then yep we could see that scenerio
The Dcore I showed in my deal with the devil would be my ideal offseason but VGK is in on the big fish again Theodore coming then extending would arguably make Liligren a second thought
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 6:59 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>RipNasty</b></div><div>What's to stop him from saying, okay tough guy. Enjoy losing me for nothing.</div></div>
You really think he would be that petty to vilify himself more so not only in TOR but the rest of the NHL
Doing that will make other orgs look at him badly and ruin his rep especially with teammates
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 6:58 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>RipNasty</b></div><div>If Marner decides he wants to go, he will come with an extension. <strong>Why would he waive to go somewhere and not want to sign there</strong>? The whole "1 year of Marner" B's people use to lower his value to essentially pennies on the dollar is nonsense.</div></div>
Happens to a lot of NHLers
They go sure I can try this out, get traded, you know what they werent for me im gonna explore FA
Look at some TDL moves
Guys waive go somewhere then in FA end up elsewhere
Forum:
Toronto Maple Leafs
Jun. 3 at 6:12 p.m.
Thread:
Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Trickster</b></div><div>I remain unconvinced by you that Chychrun is good add.
He screams bad move from top to bottom.
I'd rather use the money Montour.</div></div>
So you say Chycrun screams bad move top to bottom but would rather spend on the older Dman Montour who is by all accounts and recentcy bias a FA overpay mistake waiting to happen
Montour's 30, worse defensively and is gonna want 6.5-7.5m x 4-5 years no thanks
Smarter move IMO is to spend the money on the younger player whose better defensively and who has put up similar offensive results
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