Jul 5, 2017
2nd Favourite Team
New York Rangers
Jul 3, 1994
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<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>rangerfanatic14</b></div><div>Good thing your not the GM lol. Cant go backwards in time. Kreiders here for the long haul create a team for next year. And strome doesn't drive his own offense your right but he has chemistry with panarin and strome is cerebral enough to play with him. Strome is just a temporary solution until 2 years from now 2021 offseason when they have 30M in cap space can try and go out and get a true number 1 or 2 center to go with zibanajad for 1 2 punch and have chytil play 3C. Also you absolutely don't get rid of lemieux hes the only sandpaper we have his grit and toughness at a cheap price is an asset and every team has that type of guy and needs that guy. The other option?? Haley?? Absolutely not. And fast is a swiss army knife if they could keep him to kill penalties move up and down the lineup when theres injuries and overall good defensive forward that's a great player to have.. you try and keep fast for less then 2.4m. He shouldn't be playing with panarin in top 6 but that's cause we dont have anyone else this year. Hes a really good 3rd 4th liner that is extremely valuable to this team that's why they didnt trade him. Cant have 4 lines of all stars gotta have those fasts and lemieuxs to fill out the roster on cheap cap hits</div></div>
A 3rd of 4th liner is by defnition not really good or extremely valuable. This sort of thinking is what leads mediocre teams to be stuck in mediocrity. Having grit or sandpaper does in fact not do anything for you outside of measurable results - since any on ince impact would already be affected by that in any metric, even point totals. You don't need to replacehim with another rough guy for the sake of it, that's not how teams win.
The point is anyone can have chemistry with Panarin. You sell on Strome because he's not that good. The Ranger's aren't ready to compete, and you'll be disappointed again next year, because no team becomes good by holding on to the same dreadful veteran players that all of a sudden are having vintage seasons because Panarin drives offense. Sell them in order to surround Panarin with good players instead. Wink-wink nudge-nudge Kreider into re-signing instead, just make sure to get some kind of value from him.
This idea of prospects gradually becoming better is some sort of video-game based assumption or something that seems to creep itself into everyones minds. Players are usually great when they enter the league or shortly thereafter, they rarely have a steady progression towards their age 27-29 seasons and fall of at 30, it not only varies from that, but it doesn't even seem to be a smooth, general curve at all. Usually the ceiling holds for a while, but most players already peaked at 23. There is not much reason to believe Chytil will have some mentally satisfactory journey to finally becoming a 1st line C after 4-5 seasons in the league and more than that he's somehow more ready to play 3C a year from now rather than right now. I think he's probably an NHL player, but banking on some imaginary development curve is just baseless.
Stop making stupid signings. Teams like NYR shouldn't sign okay players for 4-5 million, and they definitely shouldn't sign Strome to any term. Even if trading Strome just meant that he wouldn't re-sign it'd be worth giving him away for free. The reason NYR even became bad was because they somehow credited guys like Staal, Stepan, Brassard etc. (who they luckily traded) for Lundqvist's peak. Losing Stralman, also at his peak, seems to be missed when analyzing why they fell off, but he was basically the one guy they should have kept. Thinking other mediocre players drive the team forward is a flawed way of viewing the league that will leave you in cap hell with a team bad enough to miss the playoffs and good enough to be the Minnesota Wild east and never get any actual talent back through the draft.
The best GM move the Rangers made in the last 4-5 years was trying to move for Pettersson in the draft. Besides the Zibanejad trade, and luckily the Fox and maybe DeAngelo deals, nothing else has even tried to help the team long term. Not even Panarin made sense for them, but at least he's philosophically a player you want to target at some point.
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Bcarlo25</b></div><div>Obviously this is all academic, because buffalo isn’t trading him, but this team winds up with Kuraly on the second line. Bleh.
Three firsts, a extremely good prospect in Vaakainanen, a real good prospect in Lauko, a mediocre prospect in shen, then a kid that scored 27 in 66 games in his second year, a center that had 73 points last season, and a cap dump seems like a bit much to me.</div></div>
He wouldn't be though, Bjork slots in well there, and Kuhlman still has some upside to play in the top 9. Kuraly isn't actively bad or anything either for a 4th liner
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>wabit</b></div><div>Koivu was fine for offense until really this year.
Here is the cap problem:
Kaprizov $3m (need to leave his potential bonus money alone)
Roslvic $2m-$4m (guessing here)
Soucy $2m-$4m (having a hard time pinning down his number)
There is too much dead cap between M. Staal and Russell. And you have Belpedio and Menell (800k each) that will need waivers next year. I'm not against trading anyone on the team for the right return, but stocking up on mid-late 1st round picks for current 22/23 yo NHLers isn't the way to do it. Trade the older players for the picks/prospects and build around the current young guys.
Fenton actually did a lot to put MN in rebuild year 3 or 4 instead of year 1. Granny and Coyle trades were good, Nino trade was bad (but understandable), and the Zucc contract was awful.
-Zucker ($5.5m) is the wing to trade, he's on a fair contract, but it's not good. He's also replaceable from in-house. Pick/prospects are fine.
-Fiala ($3m) is on a good contract and much more useful than Zucker. His game has improved a lot since the start of the season. He still does some dumb things, but not as often. He's as good of passer as Granny and a willing shooter (which Granny never was).
-Donato is on a fair contract, but if he's just going to be a 12/13 FWD, trade him.
-Dumba is at a sell low point right now. If you get a top-6 C for him make a trade, if not then hold on to him.
-Brodin is at a sell high point currently. Looking for similar trade to Dumba.
-Pateryn is on a fair deal, but he's not needed by MN. If something okay comes along trade him.
-Foligno is the last player I want to see traded. He adds so much to the team that isn't on the scoresheet. But if you get a nice overpay for him make the trade.</div></div>
I don't think Zucker gets you proper value back either, as he's also a play driver and solid in both ends. Maybe Fiala does turn it around, and Min is in a position to take that chance, but a first in this years draft holds very high value. Sure, you can trade more veteran players, but usually teams buy a bit too highly on potential in my opinion. The Wild has the issue with their best players being 2-way or play driving, while teams somehow still trade for points, and I think it's hard to get a proper return for Brodin as well.
I did a mock for the following year where I fit a FA signing of Craig Smith in even, although it might be a bit too generous I think being a bit drastic here has a point to it.
I kind of agree with your trade assessments, but I'd stay for calling the Granlund and Coyle trades good, rather than just fine.
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>wabit</b></div><div>Don't trade Fiala for a cap dump and a 1st that might turn out to be as good as Fiala. Fiala is the most dynamic wing the Wild have and he's finally learning how to play the NHL game.
Greenway is a guy to hold on to. He's cheap and at worst replaces Foligno in the coming years.
Dumba for a cap dump, a FWD that looks nice but isn't really anything special, and a mid-teens 1st; and to a Division rival, no thanks.
The cap starts to become a problem next year when you have to re-sign Kunin, Soucy, the goalie, and Kaprizov and you're paying $10m for d-men that aren't needed and are a downgrade.
JEE is already playing the 2C (shutdown line) position and has been since Koivu got injured earlier this year. The lack of PP time makes his ToI look low.
Koivu looks done as a hockey player. I doubt he waives his NMC and the return won't be good even if he did. He needs to retire this off-season, playing his whole career (1k+ games) all with just 1 team. He'll get his number in the rafters (it is the Wild afterall) and have a chance at the HoF due to his long NHL career and international play (WC gold and 2 Silver, OG Silver and Bronze).</div></div>
I took on cap dumps to be competitive after that point. I don't see the cap issue? And some easy 15 mil or so is coming off the books the year after? KK can only sign an ELC. Dumba is way inferior to Spurgeon but could probably fetch a better return, if you think you're winning a trade you should want to trade with your division rivals? I don't mind holding on to Greenway really, but I think he yields a better return than Foligno who's a defensive gem. Fiala is interesting, but he's had plenty of years to turn his dynamicism into production, and he doesn't look like he's really getting better. Atrocious defensive numbers as well, last time I checked. Koivu has no offense left in him, but he's never really been that good at it? I signed him to retire, but yeah idk if he'd play or even go this year.
I don't think you're really off on your points, but I think none of the reasons are enough to abandon the idea to trade any and/or all of the players mentioned.