I wouldn't say 27 is old but 35 is the new 40 in the NHL.

Really?

At least once a day on here I'm reading 27 year old players "being on the downsides of their careers" or being "too old to fit our timeline."

I guess Johansson and Berggren have 4 years left before they retire after being rookies.

Lol I don't think it's true but some people on here are dumb, haven't you noticed?

Where did you read that in this thread bud

Is water wet?

One of your posts likely.

Go ahead and link that for me. I'll eagerly await where I said he's old.

If that's what it would cost Detroit then Id do it if thought he'd resign at a reasonable contract

"THE NHL: where 21 year olds need to be stars or they're busts and 30 year olds are dinosaur liabilities. "

"- Michael Scott"

- Capfriendly ACGM

OP, you're one of the Leaf fans on here I've seen that engages in some thoughtful discourse, so I'm wondering what a Marner trade that makes sense for both Columbus and Toronto would look like.

Some of the caveats from Columbus' end:
1) 4OA wouldn't be available, but a top-10 protected 2025 1st absolutely would.
2) Johnson would make sense to go the other way.
3) Columbus has a similar player signed long-term already in Gaudreau, and another expensive winger in Laine, so Marner is already redundant...but, even though JG isn't going anywhere, Laine might.
4) Werenski, Jiricek, Jenner, and Fantilli are untouchable, so if Toronto views one of those pieces as being necessary in a return, I think discussions end there.
5) Marner has to come with an extension (assuming he even waives), which would likely be 8x$12M?

To avoid getting into a Toronto-like situation, I think Laine should be going the other way, but he's not the centerpiece of the deal. I'm thinking something like: Laine, Johnson, and Ceulemans for Marner and a pick?

The thing is I can see Trelicing pushing heavily for Mateychuk especially since the Jackets left side is kinda full with Provorov & Werenski or that 4th overall pick to get Sam Dickinson or one of the other incredible D prospects,

So I would say Final deal would be

Mitch Marner 25% & a pick (you decide that) for Kent Johnson, Patrick Laine & Mateychuk or Pick #4, I’ll explain my philosophy with giving up Pick number 4 basically you have a stacked prospect pool & Mitch Marner is a Top 10 Winger in hockey at his best, which is the ceiling of almost anyone picked around that spot but another guy I can think of that also makes sense is Merzlinkins due to the Leafs goaltending situation

The biggest issue I'd have with that is that Provorov feels like the most-likely piece to be moved (i.e. "not a part of the long-term future"), where Mateychuk is penciled in as 2LD behind Werenski...forever. Would it make more sense to just send Provorov as part of that deal over Mateychuk? The Leafs would get a solid two-way 2LD that can play in all situations and stays healthy, who also fits the same age window/timeline of the core while Columbus keeps the younger guy who fits our timeline.

Columbus would retain half on Provorov, and I don't know that we even need retention on Marner if Laine is going the other way. I get the philosophy for 4OA, but 1) just because we have a stacked prospect pool isn't a reason to give away additional quality pieces, 2) you're already getting two pieces like that in Johnson and Laine in this deal (5OA and 2OA) and 3) I don't think this team is a Marner away from competing. There's so many pieces that still mature, we'd be looking at a 6ish year window starting in 2 years with both Marner and the 4OA selection.

Keeping Provorov and adding Marner would be win-now moves for a team that can't win now, given the age of half the roster. We still need maturation and growth to get there. I think if it got to KJ + Laine and Mateychuk/4OA, Columbus balks and just says send him elsewhere (which Toronto would very much have every right to do).

I could see KJ + Laine + Provorov (50% retained) for Marner + pick, probably anywhere from 2nd round to 4th round. Are we getting closer?

You’re Definitely closer & I understand your point so i’ll raise my own, what about Merzlinkins 50% retained?, I know he has what 2-3 more years, it would only be 2.7 in retention & he has shown the ability to perform at the NHL level previously, it's just that was 2-3 years ago but I think it is fair to place that on the team around him more than just his abilities as a Tendy & with Woll being a 50/50 & no real upgrade available unless the Leafs get Saros from Nashville for Mitch (which negates this whole thing lol), I think Merzlinkins would be someone Brad would look to acquire in this deal as well so

KJ+Laine+ Provorov 50%+ Merzlinkins 50% for MM + Liljegren + a 4th

I think the only flies in that ointment are that KJ is unlikely to be traded while recovering from major surgery, and Marner's own preferences.

Haha I like how we're inching closer!

Elvis is kind of a prime buyout candidate, he's a decent 1B who has shown flashes, but he's been inconsistent. Honestly, he is the type of personality that would THRIVE in the Toronto spotlight. The only hangups on retaining are that a buyout is ~$1M cheaper per year (minus year 3 where it's ~$200K more expensive) and we'd be eating up a retention spot for 3 years. Merzlikins you could have for free, but with retention it's probably a mid-rounder in value coming back.

That said, the more I think about it, Liljegren is a good offset for Elvis. He's more valuable than a retained Elvis, but also redundant on a Columbus team that already has Jiricek, Severson, Gudbranson, and especially Boqvist on the right side. If he's in the deal because of salary and value, I think that's fine, but he doesn't add too much to Columbus in terms of need. Columbus almost certainly moves him or Boqvist (or both) for additional picks.

Overall, I think KJ + Laine + Provorov @50% + Elvis @50% for Marner + Lilly + a 4th would work, anything else would really be tinkering around the edges. Now we just have to submit it to the rest of the fanbases for approval.

This, too. The trade would obviously be dependent on all 3 of Marner waiving for Columbus, KJ being healthy enough to start the season (and likely make training camp), and Laine being out of the NHL PAP. It would probably be a late-summer move when those 3 variables are more clear.

Then we’ll make a nice under the table deal to sign him after he gets bought out 🤣, think KJ + Laine + Provorov 50% + Elvis bought out & signed by the Leafs for 1-2.5 mil most likely for Marner + Lilly + a 4th would work

All this sounds good, so I'll go ahead and get the fax typed up to NHL Central Regsitry.

Shhhh it’s a secret