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Weber vs subban update

Created by: CaptainFlynnt
Team: 2018-19 Montreal Canadiens
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 7, 2019
Published: Feb. 7, 2019
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
For those still keeping track:

Shae Weber:
31 GP, 9 G, 11 A, 20 PTS, +17, 81 shots, 66 hits, 60 blocks
PK Subban:
37 GP, 4 G, 14 A, 18 PTS, +9, 92 shots, 30 hits , 42 blocks

Weber has the edge in 5 of the 7 categories, despite subban playing 6 more games.

This post is just for the people that think this trade was terrible, when in reality it is pretty even, and arguably a necessary change for the habs.

Another fun fact to consider, at the time of the trade:
- Subban had $58M remaining over 6 years ($9.667M / yr)
- Weber had $54M remaining over 10 years ($5.4M / yr)

Who do you think is the better investment?
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Retained Salary Transactions
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DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2018
2019
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2020
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Logo of the WPG
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2021
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
24$79,500,000$69,036,309$0$2,682,500$10,463,691
Left WingCentreRight Wing
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$5,500,000$5,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 5
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$3,900,000$3,900,000
C, RW
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,750,000$3,750,000
RW, LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$4,800,000$4,800,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,150,000$3,150,000
C, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,850,000$1,850,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,166,667$1,166,667
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,083,333$3,083,333
C
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$950,000$950,000
LW, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$839,166$839,166
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,300,000$1,300,000
LW, C
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$700,000$700,000
LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
C
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$650,000$650,000
C, LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$675,000$675,000
C
UFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
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$4,625,000$4,625,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$7,857,143$7,857,143
RD
UFA - 8
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$10,500,000$10,500,000
G
NMC
UFA - 8
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,100,000$1,100,000
LD/RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$950,000$950,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$900,000$900,000
LD/RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$748,333$748,333 (Performance Bonus$182,500$182K)
LD/RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$725,000$725,000
LD
UFA - 1

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Feb. 9, 2019 at 5:37 p.m.
#26
Billy739
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Joined: Dec. 2017
Posts: 6,590
Likes: 1,629
Quoting: CaptainFlynnt
man look at the habs drafting before bergevin, and more specifically look at the lack of draft picks (they were mostly traded away between 2007 and 2012).

You can't blame Bergevin for "wrecking" leblanc, look where he is right now.. I think most of the blame falls on the player.

Are you trying to blame him for drafting galchenyuk and hoping he would be a #1C? He admitted in an interview he wanted to draft Reilly, but he went with Timmins choice. He still turned Galchenyuk into a #1C (by trading him for Domi).

How do you know who made the decision on the McCarron pick? How do you know who made the call for McCarron to go to the CHL? I just dont feel the same way about you, dont feel like that's all on bergevin. Besides some picks bust, get over it.

"2012 -2015 were horrible years for building around youth and not all of it can be blamed on the draft . "

Yes it can, it takes about 4 years to develop a playe after they were drafted. That's the players from drafted from 2009-12. Lack of pick = lower probability of drafting good prospects, simple as that. Previous management didn't give Timmins much to work with.

Dont get me wrong, I really like what Bouchard in Laval. But what exactly has changed in Laval except for perspective? They are going to miss the playoffs again, and again they lack any sort of talent to actually develop. All of MTL's prospects are either still in juniors, college, or Europe.

So you blame the ahl development but let's be honest, they've never had any prospects of note really worth developing since bergevin has taken over. Does make you wonder what scherbak could have been though.


i know who made the choice to send Mccarron to the CHL because Marc Bergavin took responsibility for it when Mccarron won a Memorial Cup then later blamed 'altered development in the CHL' indirectly blaming Hunter for changing his development to become a Center a position he never played at a competitive level until Londons center went down first week of November and Mccarron was asked to step in leading to a full time job and eventual championship .

whatever way you see it , its clear you dont watch the Habs.com interviews and updates or you'd be working with all the same information i am .

Bergavin also said he was told by Timmons boss to take Quebec Major Junior All Star Mikhail Gregerenko but wanted a 2nd opinion so went to one of MTL tenured scouts and development personnel for a 2nd opinion at which point Timmons suggested a forward and a defensman in Galchenyuk and Reilly of which MB chose at a time we needed D in a top 10 stacked with D to go with a winger who had barely 40 competitive games as center .

i've watched Bergavin and even when i was Admin at #HOTH i spent 90% of my time explaining his moves and the big picture context but to be honest Bergavin came in at a time when Gainey's daughter died and Pierre Gauthier had been given control of no only Draft and Developmenet but in a GM capacity as Gainey fought through personal issues . Bergavin inherited Vezina winners , Norris Trophy Winners and Pure Goal Scorer's from Gainey's years drafting and if he couldnt step up and fix Gauthiers mess he never should have taken the job .

its kinda funny Gauthier went over to CHI around the same time and destroyed their drafting/development department as he's a toxic person who's outdated.

my point is simple , Bergavins had his time but it wasnt until Timmons was taken from over achieving employee to management did we even begin to succeed based on new players drafted. Bergavin isnt a GM he's to weak to make the big trades but he would be 100x the President that Molsons been as i think Bergavin is smart enough to hire good employee's he's just not someone capable of landing players like Timmons has more consistently each year he's given more power.

if MTL was smart they'd do what Stevie Y did in TBL with Brisboise but instead of having MB leave make him upper management. Timmons has been in MTL almost 2 decades he's the man to build a cup team for us
Feb. 9, 2019 at 10:18 p.m.
#27
Thread Starter
Habs
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Joined: Apr. 2016
Posts: 2,224
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Quoting: Billy739
i know who made the choice to send Mccarron to the CHL because Marc Bergavin took responsibility for it when Mccarron won a Memorial Cup then later blamed 'altered development in the CHL' indirectly blaming Hunter for changing his development to become a Center a position he never played at a competitive level until Londons center went down first week of November and Mccarron was asked to step in leading to a full time job and eventual championship .

whatever way you see it , its clear you dont watch the Habs.com interviews and updates or you'd be working with all the same information i am .

Bergavin also said he was told by Timmons boss to take Quebec Major Junior All Star Mikhail Gregerenko but wanted a 2nd opinion so went to one of MTL tenured scouts and development personnel for a 2nd opinion at which point Timmons suggested a forward and a defensman in Galchenyuk and Reilly of which MB chose at a time we needed D in a top 10 stacked with D to go with a winger who had barely 40 competitive games as center .

i've watched Bergavin and even when i was Admin at #HOTH i spent 90% of my time explaining his moves and the big picture context but to be honest Bergavin came in at a time when Gainey's daughter died and Pierre Gauthier had been given control of no only Draft and Developmenet but in a GM capacity as Gainey fought through personal issues . Bergavin inherited Vezina winners , Norris Trophy Winners and Pure Goal Scorer's from Gainey's years drafting and if he couldnt step up and fix Gauthiers mess he never should have taken the job .

its kinda funny Gauthier went over to CHI around the same time and destroyed their drafting/development department as he's a toxic person who's outdated.

my point is simple , Bergavins had his time but it wasnt until Timmons was taken from over achieving employee to management did we even begin to succeed based on new players drafted. Bergavin isnt a GM he's to weak to make the big trades but he would be 100x the President that Molsons been as i think Bergavin is smart enough to hire good employee's he's just not someone capable of landing players like Timmons has more consistently each year he's given more power.

if MTL was smart they'd do what Stevie Y did in TBL with Brisboise but instead of having MB leave make him upper management. Timmons has been in MTL almost 2 decades he's the man to build a cup team for us


We will just agree to disagree. I remember specifically an interview where Bergevin said he wanted to take Reilly but he deferred to Timmons opinion because he was just taking over as GM. He specifically said sometimes you have to trust the guys working for you.

What are you talking about, Bergevin is too weak to make the big trades? He has probably made the most blockbuster deals in the NHL since he has taken over. I listed all of the great trades he has made to build this roster.

It feels like you have something personal against Bergevin, you will choose to discredit his work when it fits your motive, but won't give him credit when it doesn't. Like you said he surrounds himself with good people (that's what a good GM should do), and maybe it's been a process to get to this point, but he was a 1st time GM when he took over.

I like the direction MTL is headed, honestly no GM will ever succeed in a market like MTL, there is no patience. Development of players takes 4 years, but the fans want the GM fired if he doesn't make anything happen in 3. This habs management always looks to the future and rarely overpayed in a trade, which is what I like.
 
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