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Forum: Armchair-GMNov. 24, 2022 at 2:11 p.m.
Thread: Early Deadline possibilities
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Ledge_And_Dairy</b></div><div>Top 20 pick =/= top 20 prospects. A top 20 prospect is over multiple draft years and based on how those prospects have developed since they were drafted. In the most recent <a href="https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/" rel="nofollow noreferrer noopener" target="_blank">prospect rankings</a> Coronato was ranked 15th in the league.

Erik Brannstrom is a decent example but similar to him was Juuso Valimaki at the time. Who Calgary refused to trade for Mark Stone as a pure rental. That exact same situation applies here, Calgary can't re-sign Bert so he is purely a rental. Part of the reason Vegas moved forward with the trade was the allowance to talk to Stone and negotiate a deal and they were confident in being able to sign him without major cap issues. Now before you get ahead of yourself, Bert and Stone are not remotely the same caliber player.

Tippet is a decent prospect but he was certainly not in the top 50 by the time he was traded.

Where are you getting this GSVA thing from? Last deadline is very different from this deadline too. Last deadline he had term on his deal, this one he does not. That makes a substantial difference and if you don't get that look at the price Tampa paid for guys like Coleman, Goodrow, and Hagel vs what they paid for a similar caliber player in Nick Paul</div></div>

If I said deadline what I meant was in the offseason when red wings fans were mocking trades, so when only 1 year of the UFA was left. I agree bert would be more valuable if he had two years left but he does not.

You can find GSVA models via evolving hockey and or the athletic, though those are only some and both paid subscription. Particular picks also have their own expected GSVA or GAR. A 11th oa for example is ~5.7 as per the athletic.

Also, I am extremely reticent to accept Coronato as a top20 nhl prospect: there are many more names deserving of that ahead of him, and TheHockeyWriters is most certainly not my go too for prospect rankings.

He did not break Craig buttons top 50 https://www.tsn.ca/buffalo-sabres-d-owen-power-craig-button-s-annual-top-prospects-list-1.1784411

Whereas Scott Wheeler at the Athletic put him at 42.

Those are very; very stark differences, and probably explains our positions the best.

To me he is maybe a top 75-top 50 prospect. To you he is a top15. It is not that we have different values for Bertuzzi, it is that we are in different worlds for Coronato.
Forum: Armchair-GMNov. 24, 2022 at 2:01 p.m.
Thread: Early Deadline possibilities
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Mystaes</b></div><div>Erik brannstrom traded in 2019 along with multiple other pieces for Mark Stone, just off the top of my head. This was when brannstrom still looked good on his development path. Yes he was signed to an extension afterwards.

Top15/20 picks get traded all the time. Yes for UFAs. It really isn’t that rare.

Owen tippet - albeit further along his development path and not looking as good - was included for giroux when Florida had all the leverage from the nmc.

If you can’t remember top15 picks that go for UFAs then you are being willfully obtuse.

Coronato is a good top15 picked prospect but he certainly is not something so special that they aren’t moved in these transactions all the time. Overrating of prospects is a trap many people fall into.

Also again, the value of the pending ufa contract by gsva was equivalent to an 11th oa pick this last deadline. This is pretty fair value especially with retention thrown in.

The better argument would be that Calgary prefers to hold onto elc players, rather then a value standpoint, but as it stands Coronato probably won’t be a large contributor before they begin to drop off and exit the window. It will take several years of nhl play for him to become anything that will help the cup push.</div></div>

Top 20 pick =/= top 20 prospects. A top 20 prospect is over multiple draft years and based on how those prospects have developed since they were drafted. In the most recent <a href="https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/" rel="nofollow noreferrer noopener" target="_blank">prospect rankings</a> Coronato was ranked 15th in the league.

Erik Brannstrom is a decent example but similar to him was Juuso Valimaki at the time. Who Calgary refused to trade for Mark Stone as a pure rental. That exact same situation applies here, Calgary can't re-sign Bert so he is purely a rental. Part of the reason Vegas moved forward with the trade was the allowance to talk to Stone and negotiate a deal and they were confident in being able to sign him without major cap issues. Now before you get ahead of yourself, Bert and Stone are not remotely the same caliber player.

Tippet is a decent prospect but he was certainly not in the top 50 by the time he was traded.

Where are you getting this GSVA thing from? Last deadline is very different from this deadline too. Last deadline he had term on his deal, this one he does not. That makes a substantial difference and if you don't get that look at the price Tampa paid for guys like Coleman, Goodrow, and Hagel vs what they paid for a similar caliber player in Nick Paul