Habs are not paying to help a rival, they neether do it for free. They don't need wingers, especially not your worst top 9 overpaid winger

Montreal doesn't need Kubalik, they decline.

Kubalik 45 pts last season would have been 2nd on the Habs, he also outpaced a bunch of their forwards

He has averaged 24 goals per 82 games in the NHL, Monahan (due to his time in Calgary) and Caufield are the only ones who tops that. Gallagher actually has the same average but Kubalik doesn't make 6.5 AAV, he makes 2.5 and is UFA after the season

It's not that he's bad or anything but Tkachuk, Giroux, Batherson, Tarasenko, Greig and Joseph is a lot of competition (with Jarventie already waiting for a spot). Joseph is one of the best skaters in the NHL, ELITE on the PK and pretty good defensively, on the forecheck and with fire in his belly to bounce back this season. He's more needed than Kubalik who is the odd-man out because Pinto is part of the core going forward (which shows how bad Dorion is at his job)


This you don't know... You don't want him as a fan but maybe Montreal's management want him, to either use him this season (and make the PP more dangerous) or pump and dump him for the deadline

"This you don't know" arguments don't make sense on here because they're applicable to literally both sides of every proposal. You also don't know how desperate Ottawa may be to clear cap space. I could also say that Ottawa would want to move a 2nd to get rid of Kubalik so that they don't jeopardize their relationship with Pinto and just say "this you don't know" if you challenge that. I wouldn't though, since that's just wishful thinking.

I can infer from reporting, and from the actions and comments of management and coaching that Montreal wouldn't want him because they've worked hard to move/get rid of players with a similar profile and have been pretty clear of how they want to use roster spots.

We don't talk for the teams, we share what we think they should do or not. it doesn't look like you're grasping the difference based on this post.

And well, doesn't look like Dorion is desperate at all. Nobody really knows what's in his head, he's a weirdo

And who did they move with "similar profile"? He's better than a bunch of guys on the current roster but with their cap hits, looks like you're stuck with them

...if that's your response, then I'm not sure you could have misinterpreted my post more.

Hoffman and Pitlick. And being better is irrelevant, since Montreal is in the middle of a rebuild and doesn't care about rentals right now.

I didn't word that well, I mean when I talk I try to let it show that I am voicing what I think should be done and not that I know what the team is going to do, of course it depends on context. Your "Montreal doesn't need Kubalik, they decline" made it seem like you knew exactly what they have in mind, which is impossible to tell for anyone of us.

Hoffman I can understand but Kubalik is a better overall player now, both ways. Pitlick is barely a NHL player, despite a good season in 2021-22

And while you're right that Montreal doesn't want rentals, this is not really a rental situation, more like a "pump and dump". If a team could get Kubalik for a 7th for example and could sell it at the deadline for a 3rd (or even better) while using him this season, it's not a bad thing at all. I would want my team to do these things in a rebuild

If Kubalik could actually worth a 3rd or better, then I would too. But Its very hard to imagine a player like Kubalik returning a 3rd or better at the deadline.

Teams also know that every day that passes, the higher Pinto's AAV for this season gets and the closer we get to the December 1st deadline, there needs to be a better reason than maybe upgrading a late pick for a mid round pick. Especially since the list of teams that are in a cap position and budget position to facilitate a trade isn't long and other teams want cap flexibility too.

Problem when talking with me is that I am a very facts oriented person.

Just last deadline :

Jaycob Megna ($762,500) for 2023 4th round pick (#123)
Tyler Motte ($1,350,000) for Julien Gauthier + 2023 7th round pick (#215)
Nino Niederreiter ($4,000,000) for 2024 2nd round pick (WPG)
Marcus Johansson ($1,100,000) for 2024 3rd round pick (MIN)
Pierre Engvall ($2,250,000) for 2024 3rd round pick (NYI)
Luke Schenn ($850,000) for 2023 3rd round pick (#89)
Gustav Nyquist ($2,750,000) for 2023 5th round pick (#156)
Lars Eller ($2,415,000) for 2025 2nd round pick (COL)
Shayne Gostisbehere ($4,500,000) for 2026 3rd round pick (CAR)
Teddy Blueger ($2,200,000) 2024 3rd round pick (VGK)
Mikael Granlund ($5,000,000) for 2023 2nd round pick (#46)
Curtis Lazar ($1,000,000) for 2024 4th round pick (NJD)
Zack MacEwen ($925,000) for Brendan Lemieux ($1,350,000) + 2024 5th round pick (LAK)
Vladislav Namestnikov for 2025 4th round pick (WPG)
Jordan Greenway ($3,000,000) for 2023 2nd round pick (#64) + 2024 5th round pick (BUF)
Oskar Sundqvist ($2,750,000 2023 4th round pick (#117)

And more...


Pierre Dorion messed up, as always. I'm telling you how much I'd be pissed if he pays anything to move Mathieu Joseph, for exemple, who is an excellent bottom-6 forward and Elite on the PK.

The minute he signed Tarasenko is the minute he should have moved Kubalik for whatever he can get. We have no way of knowing that but maybe the fool declined a 3rd round pick offer or even worse, he could have gotten that pick directly in the Red Wings trade.

...if you're a facts oriented person, then rely on them and not opinion.

-Schenn and Gostisbehere (who I'd remind you was also moved with a 2nd to clear cap) are D-men
-Nino Niederreiter, Marcus Johansson, Pierre Engvall, Lars Eller, Teddy Blueger, Curtis Lazar, and Jordan Greenway are better, more complete, play a more in-demand play style for buyers and/or play a more valuable forward position

People don't look at that list and think that Kubalik is worth a 3rd or more at the deadline, they look at it and think he may be worth a 4th or 5th round pick. And most teams that have the room to make a trade already have guys who can return that. There isn't a real reason to make that trade.

I'm not sure what you're expecting here, that teams will do Ottawa a favour in the hopes that there's a GM who will make a Granlund-type mistake?

That is... exactly what I just did?


Well, with these completely off-based, unrealistic opinions... there's not much to do here. Kubalik is one of the best players in that whole list. He's easily worth a 3rd/4th at the deadline an maybe more depending on the market at that moment and how this season has gone until then

By the way Nino hasn't topped Kubalik's production from last season since 2016-17

...I'm getting a read on what facts you're relying on if you think Nino not topping Kubalik's production means anything.

Kubalik is a rush scorer who doesn't really do much else. Teams don't pay for that. If Ottawa values him to the degree that you are alluding, they will keep him.

Because he's a biggest name here and hasn't even produced more pts than Kubalik for years... it's not a list of big names and yet they returned picks. It's not far fetched to imagine a player like Kubalik returning a 3rd or better... of course depends on the market and the season Kubalik has.

Unfortunately, it seems that Dorion values Kubalik too much as he's not really needed as the Top-9 is more than full when Pinto is in there (and he should be moved for whatever to make space for Pinto)

Tkachuk - Stutzle - Giroux
Greig - Norris - Batherson
Joseph - Pinto - Tarasenko

Kubalik is not perfect but teams are always looking to add scoring depth at the deadline, it's ok if you don't believe it

For cheap? Sure. But they tend to want players do things other than score. And the players on the list that returned more than late round picks do more than just score.

Ok not sure where you got your scouting report on Kubalik but he's not a bad player in other aspects of the game, defensively, physically, playmaking, etc... he's an average player with an above average shot and scoring touch. The guy has averaged 24 goals per 82 games in the NHL (which is more than anyone on the Habs except Caufield and Monahan, due to his Calgary days)

If a player like Vladislav Namestnikov has returned a 4th round pick multiple times at the deadline, so can Kubalik. Same for Marcus Johansson, etc

And also for "want players do things other than score", being a Habs fan you should know that this is not entirely true, Caufield wouldn't be a NHL player if he didn't have his scoring touch