Problems Solved to TML and MTL to keep Monahan

Forums/Armchair-GM

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Created by: Billy316

Team: 2023-24 Montreal Canadiens

Initial Creation Date: Nov. 5, 2023

Published: Nov. 5, 2023

Salary Cap Mode: Basic

Description

Toronto Trade is less about penny pinching and more about culture change.
TML needs it as much as MTL and sending out 2 guys who didnt defend your team sends that message.
Though on paper they loses Grit they gain Toughness as i believe the team rallies after that.
I think Dvo is just a gamble with the highest odds of paying off cap dump exchange wise
But if you want Armia instead that works or no trade then we're just in a position we have to profit on Monahan at the TDL rather then keep him.

Domi :
Short term- top 6 with Dach out
Long term -if we re-sign him 4th line center would be nice.

Reaves :
Short term- 13th forward/Bottom pair.
Long term- likely in Laval if he doesnt click with Pezz

We're not worse off
TML is better off
We add Grit so its not always Xhekaj Fighting and he can develop into a full player i know he can be.

McBain i want to grow a little and get better at faceoffs beside Evans.
By next years TDL Evans will be gone and McBain will be the Center.
He needs time to grow and when he can play 17 minutes comfortably we'll make room.
i figure 2 years at which point Dach should be back and doing well with McBain on his heels production wise.

Its another reason i like keeping Domi and Monahan short term
We're in no rush here as we still havent found a goalie yet.
Allens doing well but he's too old to build on.
Monty's good but i dont see a reason to build on him unless you think Primeau or Dobes is ready in 1-3 years.
Primeau , maybe i guess as weirded stuff has happened like Jose Theodore winning the Vezina
Dobes no way , he's been beat by a ECHL goalie we picks up and has drug the whole team down with 5 GAA
I'd trade for one but i see no solutions to this problem just more gambles.
I think Saros is the only one i'd outright pay to land at this point as he was built in a system where Goalies last and become solid Mentors elevating those they play beside.
I mean its the closest thing to a Sure Thing you can get.
But i dont see NSH entertaining that this year anyways

Lastly the one thing that might confuse people most
Why keep Pearson and Monahan rather then profit off them at the TDL?
Gallagher's Value is on the rise again as he returns to form as a player for the first time since Plekky or Danault Centered him Really.
I see what we'd gain trading them is worth less then what we'd pay to move Gally if he declines without them.
Risk wasnt worth the reward just yet.
Pearson i'd Bump for Roy after this year once he has a little seasoning.
He's a great special teams guy but a liability 5v5 so Monahan and Gally's the guys to work with him
That line could be fire and Roy can join Newhook and Slaf on 2nd PP giving us 2 units that are legit threats
McBain being the highest producing 4th line players i the league with 7pts in 10 games Roy on his Wing will be a friggin Gong Show im sure!

Trades

MTL

Additional Details:

TML Motivation:
-Motivates Bertuzzi
-Gives Bertuzzi more mins
-Gives them a Bulk FO C
-Dvo has Chemistry with Marner
-Risk vs Reward benefits TML

TOR

Dvorak, Christian

Additional Details:

MTL Motivations:
-Domi /Anderson line
-Reaves is a better option then Armia
-Mostly cause a rebuild team has no use for a bulk faceoffs Center alone and wants to re-sign Monahan if we did.

MTL doesnt Need to make this move but Domi was great here for us for 1 years, i'd love to give him the chance to see if he can for example carve out a niche as lets say 4th line Center with Pezz and Reaves

MTL

Additional Details:

Hits Leader who scores goals but is a low minutes guy if you want him to be effective its shorter more impactful shifts. (still growing just where he is at today)

Soderstom is a long shot but i have faith in Coach Houle's Defensive teaching ability and think after a few weeks there he'll understand what MTL wants from him. Odds are though we're looking at Xavier Oullette 2.0 but i gave faith he's more of a Kovacevic

ARI

Beck, Owen
Harris, Jordan
Ylönen, Jesse
2024 2nd round pick (COL)
2025 3rd round pick (VAN)

Additional Details:

-Conditional 3rd becomes a 2nd if Soderstrom plays 40 games or more this season in MTL. IF MTL makes the playoffs winning a Round with both McBain/Soderstrom skating 50% or more of the games then it becomes a 1st in 2025

Buyouts

Karl Alzner: $833,333

Retained Salary Transactions

Joel Edmundson: $1,750,000 (50%)
Jeff Petry: $2,343,750 (50%)

Buried

Joel Armia: $2,250,000 ($3,400,000)

Draft	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5	Round 6	Round 7
2024
2025
2026

ROSTER

LONG-TERM OUTLOOK

EMBED

TEXT-EMBED

ROSTER SIZE	SALARY CAP	CAP HIT	OVERAGES	BONUSES	CAP SPACE
23	$83,500,000	$71,991,248	$1,170,000	$5,117,500	$11,508,752

Left Wing	Centre	Right Wing
Caufield, Cole $7,850,000$7,850,000 LW, RW UFA - 8	Suzuki, Nick $7,875,000$7,875,000 C UFA - 7	Slafkovsky, Juraj $950,000$950,000 ($3,500,000$4M) RW, LW RFA - 2
Newhook, Alex $2,900,000$2,900,000 C, LW RFA - 4	Domi, Max $3,000,000$3,000,000 C, RW M-NTC UFA - 1	Anderson, Josh $5,500,000$5,500,000 RW, LW M-NTC UFA - 4
Pearson, Tanner $3,250,000$3,250,000 LW UFA - 1	Monahan, Sean $1,985,000$1,985,000 ($15,000$15K) C, LW, RW UFA - 1	Gallagher, Brendan $6,500,000$6,500,000 RW, LW M-NTC, NMC UFA - 4
McBain, Jack $1,599,999$1,599,999 C, LW RFA - 2	Evans, Jake $1,700,000$1,700,000 C UFA - 2	Roy, Joshua $835,000$835,000 ($57,500$58K) LW, RW RFA - 3
Pezzetta, Michael $812,500$812,500 LW, RW UFA - 2		Reaves, Ryan $1,350,000$1,350,000 RW UFA - 3

Left Defense	Right Defense	Goaltender
Matheson, Michael $4,875,000$4,875,000 LD M-NTC UFA - 3	Barron, Justin $925,000$925,000 ($275,000$275K) RD RFA - 1	Allen, Jake $1,925,000$1,925,000 G M-NTC UFA - 2
Guhle, Kaiden $863,333$863,333 ($420,000$420K) LD/RD RFA - 2	Kovacevic, Johnathan $766,667$766,667 RD UFA - 2	Montembeault, Samuel $1,000,000$1,000,000 G UFA - 1
Xhekaj, Arber $828,333$828,333 LD/RD RFA - 1	Söderström, Victor $863,333$863,333 ($850,000$850K) RD RFA - 1	Primeau, Cayden $890,000$890,000 G RFA - 2

Scratches	Injured Reserve (IR)	Long Term IR (LTIR)
	Savard, David $3,500,000$3,500,000 RD UFA - 2	Price, Carey $10,500,000$10,500,000 G NMC UFA - 3
	Harvey-Pinard, Rafaël $1,100,000$1,100,000 LW, RW RFA - 2	Dach, Kirby $3,362,500$3,362,500 C, RW RFA - 3
		Wideman, Chris $762,500$762,500 RD UFA - 1

Nov. 5, 2023 at 11:01 a.m.

Billy316

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Boooo! its crap , Everyone hates you! hahahahaa
I can picture the sheer amount of Chaos that is about to ensue
Always like that with Rival trades

Nov. 5, 2023 at 11:10 a.m.

GuyGuyGuy

Prime Primeau

Joined: Apr. 2023

Posts: 5,491

Likes: 2,181

Switch Domi and McBain and that’s about what the lines would be. I like the ideas tho

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Nov. 5, 2023 at 11:21 a.m.

Leafsfan98

Leafs going to Leafs

Joined: Dec. 2022

Posts: 10,068

Likes: 3,047

Leafs don't take that... Dvorak won't do anything as the goal of acquiring a 3C would be to make sure the offensive pylon (strictly talking about offence) known as David Kampf isn't handcuffing Knies and Domi... Not to trade away Domi and Bert will get his minutes... Just wishing Keefe goes 11/7 next game and rests him bc he is 100% playing through injury

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Nov. 5, 2023 at 11:21 a.m.

bwhsocal

Joined: Jun. 2023

Posts: 2,844

Likes: 834

STOP AZ is not trading McBain, he is at 4G3A in 11g (54 pt/82), playing solid D and PK, hitting and some fights. AZ loves his game and he is 23yo.

Billy316 liked this.

Nov. 5, 2023 at 12:03 p.m.

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: GuyGuyGuy

Switch Domi and McBain and that’s about what the lines would be. I like the ideas tho

I agree Short Term 100%
But the thing is McBain does struggle with the Center side of being a Center as well as the Minutes.
Right now he's succeeding cause they cut him back from last year and he's thriving big time there.
He's still young at 23 in his second year Pro in the NHL after 4 years at Boston College.
He just needs time to work on his conditioning/Stamina and his game defensively without the puck really.
He's a HUGE hitter and sometimes easily baited is all.
Beyond that he cant stand up and produce at the same levels vs top 6 NHL players right now as proven last year.

Give him a year or more with Evans and by the time Evans is ready he'll be Center Material Truly.

Domi is there to Eat **** in the Faceoff Circle until Newhook is truly good to take the role.
Newhooks Speed though is on full display at Wing while Hampered at Center ice
If McBain steps up then like Danault back in 2016 the spot is his and we'll demote or trade Domi like we did Desharnais.
I just want to be sure we dont pay a lot then bury him under the pressure

Nov. 5, 2023 at 12:08 p.m.

Kinger25

Banned

Joined: Oct. 2023

Posts: 2,981

Likes: 590

Leafs decline

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Nov. 5, 2023 at 12:10 p.m.

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: bwhsocal

STOP AZ is not trading McBain, he is at 4G3A in 11g (54 pt/82), playing solid D and PK, hitting and some fights. AZ loves his game and he is 23yo.

I totally get that but They're building deep
Cooley came in and he's gone from top 6 to 4th C
While he's thriving once a Connor Geekie or Josh Doan or even a Aku Raty maybe
Then his days at Center's done and he'll become just a checking forward similar to Jaskin anytime he comes to the NHL but is unleashed outside those leagues.
You gotta continuously push these guys development or your investment sours pretty quickly and ARZ has more then enough youth Centers they're building on

Nov. 5, 2023 at 12:15 p.m.

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: Leafsfan98

I get that
Do you think he'd score less then Domi and Reaves combined?
His offense dried up a bit in MTL but everyones does Burrows is a horrible PP coach

Dvo's shot attempts went way down
Just play him and he'll score its not like his shooting percentages are down he's just not being used.
If i didnt know any better you'd swear he ****ed one of the Coaches wives
Im not saying he's superman , he's not
Im just saying if you give a man a Hammer and he uses it as fire wood, he's likely an idiot.
ARZ played him on PP/PK and had him handle most defensive situations and still he was top 3 in scoring his final 2 years there.
He was a capable Goal Scorer who was f'd in a trade to our team
Its not like anyone's making a profit here on any side
Just odds at better success with a no environment .

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Nov. 5, 2023 at 3:01 p.m.

bwhsocal

Joined: Jun. 2023

Posts: 2,844

Likes: 834

Quoting: Billy316

cooley is killing on the PP (no surprise) but struggling on 5v5 (big jump from NCAA) and 4th or 2nd on AZ is about the same they dont have traditional 1-4 lines. the kid is good he will get it. Doan is a RW only, Raty is 1 year younger and small so he is not replacing mcbain and geekie is looking good but still 19. I dont see any problem w too much C depth, and bjugstad isnt going to around in current role for much many years.
BTW he is in 2nd year and is on pace for 55pts really that is a checking forward?

Billy316 liked this.

Nov. 5, 2023 at 4:32 p.m.

#10

Leafsfan98

Leafs going to Leafs

Joined: Dec. 2022

Posts: 10,068

Likes: 3,047

Quoting: Billy316

Get it... But Kampf would still be the 3C between Dvo and Knies now instead of Domi and Knies... The point would be to get a centre who isn't just worried about face-offs and defense, it would be to give Domi and Knies a scoring punch... Even if that's Monahan double retained to 400K (Bc they can afford him at that cost) if they even have the assets for that...

Nothing to do with any player they'd be acquiring, but the purpose would be to 'activate' that 3rd line, if you will...

But this is probably redundant as Tre will most likely go after 2 defensemen bc his 3rd line production shouldn't be his bigger concern... And have Minten and Cowan fill in next year and will most likely go:
Knies-Matthews-RW1
Minten-JT-Marner
Jarnkrok-3C-Cowan
Holmberg-Kampf-Reaves

Rielly-Lilly
McCabe-TDL D
TDL D2- Timmins

Woll
G2

With 28 million to spend

Billy316 liked this.

Nov. 5, 2023 at 5:15 p.m.

#11

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: bwhsocal

If he's doing it against bottom 6 players , yes he had a 4 point night
That doesnt make him a 55pts player in his 3rd multipoint night in 103 games
Pezzetta's had more Multi Point nights in a single year then McBain in his Career.
While a 4 point night versus Chicago Blackhawks

Raphael Harvey Pinard had a Hat Trick versus CBJ on pace for 50+ points for 36 goals
Is he worth more then McBain for doing more in 32 games then he did in 103?

I mean it seems like a weird way to look at things

Nov. 5, 2023 at 5:32 p.m.

#12

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

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Quoting: Leafsfan98

So its that you still think Domi can rebound
I get that , it makes sense to hold out hope
But he's not fighting for you guys like he did for us.
BUT he had no competition in his role like he does with Reaves and Bertuzzi.

So Bertuzzi is the one you want gone then ? and you need a RD?
What about a deal for Savard or Harris ?
That said WE Value both those players we just have too much Depth succeeding and need room .
So it would be Cap Dump for Player of Value.
Lets say Bertuzzi ,Middling Prospect and TML 1st for Harris or Savard and a pick

MTL can use Bertuzzi similar to Domi on Andersons line its just Newhooks now in a sink or swim situation at Center.
I'd Prefer it be Savard so TML finally has all Right Handers on a playoff run to prove i was Right and it makes a difference hahahaha

Nov. 5, 2023 at 5:39 p.m.

#13

bwhsocal

Joined: Jun. 2023

Posts: 2,844

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Quoting: Billy316

whatever bottomline is AZ is not trading McBain unless its a huge overpay (because they have no reason to trade him) and this proposal is not close to that.

Nov. 5, 2023 at 5:48 p.m.

#14

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: bwhsocal

whatever bottomline is AZ is not trading McBain unless its a huge overpay (because they have no reason to trade him) and this proposal is not close to that.

MTL's :
-Undisputed top Center Prospect bar none(you can have one of the others if you like)
-22 year old Top 4 LD with a few years experience who thrived during injuries at 20-22 minutes last year.
-Ylonen is a middle 6 guy like his dad who played in ARZ where Ylonen was born. He's been playing well and would thrive in a new location with more minutes
-2nd round pick in this years draft
-Conditional 3rd round pick in 2025 that could become a 1st round pick.

But if all you care about is Picks and youth talent from a system ranked deeper then yours isnt good enough
We'll gladly give up Picks and just get them back off players we flip at the TDL after they're pushed out by the players we'll keep from this deal.

We'll Overpay for McBain but he's not Petterson or PLD or Lindholm worthy as far as Returns
He's more on the Morgan Barron Level or Ivan Barbasev which is a cost i can live with

Nov. 5, 2023 at 5:51 p.m.

#15

Billy316

Thread Starter

Jesus Christ Is King

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 2,611

Likes: 745

Quoting: bwhsocal

whatever bottomline is AZ is not trading McBain unless its a huge overpay (because they have no reason to trade him) and this proposal is not close to that.

I mean i get it we had Ryan Poehling score 4 points a hat trick and the OT winner to boot on his Debut
We thought "he did it once , he'll to it a lot more" well we were wrong. We didnt invest in his right and kept him with a coach he hated until he melted down a bit.
New Coach and his game turned around but the progress was too little too late.

Keep playing McBain 12-13 minutes a night and he'll turn into a bum awfully quick

Nov. 6, 2023 at 9:07 a.m.

#16

Leafsfan98

Leafs going to Leafs

Joined: Dec. 2022

Posts: 10,068

Likes: 3,047

Quoting: Billy316

Domi competes well and he has chemistry, it's just that you have to work as a 5 man unit on offence and when one of the most important roles of that offence is only worried about defence, you're playing 4 on 5...

Bert's fine, just wish he'd fight but he's still trying to find someone he has chemistry with...
Klingberg would be the ideal guy gone IMO... Especially at his cap hit...
And Nylander's value is too high right now, I think we could trade out remaining chips for defensive help
And flip Nylander into depth...
Savard would be nice, but how long is he out for? I just remember being amazed by that play against Buffalo
I'd do Klingberg, a 1rst and Hirvonen for Savard at 50%. We could then flip some assets for Zadorov at 50% and have cap space to work with to flip Nylander into 2/3 players to push the depth to the next level...

MTL could use Klingberg as trade bait and I could see them flipping him at 50% come TDL, especially with the potential opportunity he'd be getting in MTL...
lol

Then Toronto could do

Rielly-Brodie
McCabe-Savard
Z-Lilly
Gio-Timmins

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