What are you talking about? What stats? I started with stats and you went on about how the Leafs played so poorly against those top teams. I mentioned how they beat Winnipeg twice and played even against Pittsburgh in a game they lost and then spanked the same team a week later. I don't know what you are getting at. TO's defence has been much improved and its not a huge weakness.

Huh? I wasn't talking about winning games. I wasn't talking about the offense being poor against top teams. I wasn't talking about the goalie playing badly against top teams. I wasn't talking about how much the D was affecting the team as a whole or their win loss difference. I was only talking about the defense as it relates to shots against and blocked shots. Toronto's goaltending is fabulous. The team is winning games and sits at third in the league. They are one of the top if not the best goal scoring team in the league, and they have a winning record against playoff teams. The defense is producing offense. I don't disagree with anything that you've said so far. All I was stating was that the D is not blocking a lot of shots and they are allowing an above average amount against playoff teams. And I used stats to back it. I'm sorry if I offended you, I just think that we've majorly misunderstood each other.

What are you talking about? I don't think you understand hockey much.

Explain?

Option 4. LD is great, RD sucks, and Andersen is having his best year ever (so far...consistency is his issue). If would move a LD to the right side would be much better.

You said TO has played poorly against playoff teams. Like Calgary, Winnipeg, Boston, Pittsburgh. That is a 6 game sample size (You also excluded Washington who they beat and Dallas who they also soundly beat before getting stoned by the goalie the 2nd time they played them) in those 6 games they won 3 times and lost 3. Against Winnipeg, they were the better team both games and took 2 games from them. Against Pittsburgh they had pretty well the same shots as pittsburgh but Murray stole the game that saw 1 goal scored when both goalies were on the ice (2 empty netters) and then TO spanked them. Against Calgary the Leafs had a flat performance so that isn't a great example, everyone has an off night. Even the Boston game you reference, TO outshot Boston heavily and Halak played out of this world.

You seem like one of the fans that clings to a couple of stats and use them to paint a way bigger picture than they actually do.

I think Hainsey sucks on the right side at this point in his career. Zaitsev is good and Ozhiganov looks serviceable. The left side could be one of the best in the game. Rielly is criminally underrated still, despite the season he's putting up.

Zaitsev is good without the puck. But is completely incompetent with it. I’d love to get rid of him. Have a top 4 of Reilly/Gardiner (both criminally under appreciated), and Dermott/Zaitzev. Let them play 45-50 minutes a game.

Dude, I never said that TOR has played poorly against playoff teams. My first statement also said that the sample size was too small and also said that the D, not the team as a whole, and not the D as it pertains to offense, was sub-par against playoff teams. I never even said that their D was bad. I said that it wasn't at the third in the league level that their standings and GA suggests. It's not even a big deal. The D won't effect them getting into the playoffs or going deep. I do think it could be the one thing to upgrade that would put their name on the cup, but they could win the cup with the D group that they have now.

Zaitsev is fine with the puck, he's simple with it and makes the smart plays. He's a fine 2nd pair defenceman. Gardiner is either overrated or underrated no one seems to see him as I do, which is a very good offensive player who just doesn't seem to want to do the hard things he needs to to be a good defensively. I wouldn't keep him beyond this year, it'll cost too much and he won't be worth it.

Your tone did not match any of this sentiment.

Yeah, cause I'm not a Leafs fan and also kinda resentful that they have been way luckier than the Canucks in many areas, which is beside the point, but I stated facts, which is what matters. BTW, are you a Leafs fan? Your name doesn't say, but you seem bent in that direction.

I absolutely love Gardiner, but I agree unless he takes a big hometown discount he’ll have to go. I disagree about Zaitzev though. Every time he gets the puck he just throws it up the boards or off the glass. Best case scenario he gives it to the other team in their own end. He almost never keeps possession for the aleafs, and often screws over Gardiner by put him in spots where he can do nothing but get in trouble. I agree Gardiner could be better defensively, but most of his issues arise from playing with guys he’s constantly having to try bailing out. Though yes, he has some stupid brain fart giveaways.

I wouldn't say luckier, they had a better plan for a rebuild than Vancouvers but the Canucks are okay. They have some really good core pieces, they just need guys to surround them. And not old overprice bottom 6 players.

They need to be bad for a couple more years and keep drafting well.

You have a major bias for Gardiner man. The guy is caught several times a day coasting away from his own net leaving guys wide open. Or he'll make some other really ill advised decision that forces Zaitsev to cover. Tossing a puck off the glass is a very smart play that prevents other teams of gaining possession in the Leafs zone and with the Leafs speed, if you can prevent guys from setting up, the Leafs can get on your and take away all space. Its a wise play, but very much not sexy. Gardiner doesn't bail out other defenceman, he is always the one needing to be bailed out. But what he creates with his style of play makes it fine.

I watch every Leaf game. Gardiner is the best D on the ice most days. He does have some bad plays, but is just a beast. Look at any of his numbers. This year hasn’t been up to his usual standard, but still a corsi god. Everybody but Reilly is ridiculously worse playing with anybody else. Puts up points better than almost any 2nd top scoring D on any team in the league. And normally when he is drifting from the front of the net it’s to cover somebody else messing up.

I disagree, I've seen him coast behind the night while Zaitsev battled with the puck carrier and then a little chip infront where an opposing player is sitting alone because Gardiner has drifted away has happened several times. He gets caught watching the puck more than any other player on the team. Dermott can get caught watching from time to time as well but Rielly never does, he's always moving towards where he needs to be. Don't get me wrong though, he's a valuable player and as much as I hate watching someone leave for nothing, he's a guy you keep and then let walk because he makes you a better team.

You should've been the advisor for Chiarelli, he could've used that wisdom lol. I've quickly found out that it isn't necessarily about what the player is worth as it is what a team is willing to part with for that player. Most people thought the Karlsson trade wasn't very good including me, but it was probably the best they were offered and it's happened to work out good so far. Dubas has to channel is inner Yzerman and get a Drouin/Sergachev type deal going. The problem is what Nylander is asking for. It takes a lot of destinations off the table and that's where the Canes get some leverage. Dubas just has to maximize what he can get whether its a 1 for 1 or Dman++.

The thing everyone forgets though, is that you can't lose Nylander for nothing because he is RFA, he can go to Europe for years but he can't play in the NHL without TO's consent. So let him sit if that's the alternative to a bad trade because you aren't losing him for nothing, he's just wasting his career.