Lets be real. Arizona doesn't trade an elite goaltender retained for that

*An elite goalie who's over 30, a pending UFA, and VERY injury prone. But yeah, I do get your point. Just depends how much they value Jost

A) That's a lot to give up for Kuemper when you can just re-sign Grubauer.

B) That's a huge deal for Landeskog. I'd probably rather go the 4 x $8m route.

Grubauer would cost $6m+ for 5-6 years and I'm not sure Sakic wants to go there.

Danault woof, you want to give a guy who’s career high in points is 41 a 6x5.5 contract more AAV than RNH (yes less term) but talk about a bad contract. You could probably get Janmark for about half that and effectively get similar production. If you hate Compher’s contract this is just about twice as bad. Imo Danault is a dude you stay away at all cost unless the contract is $4M or less

In what universe has Kuemper ever been elite. Never won a Vezina, never made an all NHL team, made one All Star game and played for 3 different teams. He’s 31, a UFA in 1 year and has an extensive injury history.

Danault's 5v5 points/60 is in line with many very good top 6 C's. His totals are also limited by the fact he doesn't get PP time (nor should he tbf).

Never scored more than 13 goals. 2 seasons ever over 2.0 pts/60 for comparison Kadri has 7 seasons of MORE than 13 goals, and 7 seasons producing over 2.0 pts/60. My friend you are REACHING if you think he has produced comparable rates to other 2C’s. And at $5.5M he is an expensive a$$ 3C producing even less into his 30’s. Danault is not the answer for the Avs, to any question.

So because mario lemieux was injury prone, he isn't a top 5 player of all time? Also Kuempers stats have been elite the past seasons and should have already won a vezina. He has been discussed in it anyways

Youre judging a defensive C based on his offensive production. Though I do agree 5.5M is too much to allocate to him

Also I think @Richard88 said 5v5 P/60, not all situations. At 5v5 Kadri has 3 seasons of over 2.0 P/60 compared to Danault'2 2 seasons, but since Kadri came to COL he has been at 1.97 P/60 at 5v5 while Danault has been at 2.18 P/60 at 5v5 in that same time frame. The difference in all situations production is because Kadri gets nearly 3.5 mins of PP time per game while Danault gets an average of 1 min per game

Danault is not an adequate offensive weapon to be in the top 6 nor is he worth $5M period. One career 40pt season. If Danault is your 2C you are not a championship team because he doesn’t produce enough offense.

Did you really just try to use Lemieux as a comparison to Kuemper? What a joke. What kind of argument is should have won? What season was that, he has never even been a finalist Kuemper is good he is no where close to elite.

your argument was that Kuemper isn't elite because he had injuries. Its the exact same things. When Kuemper is healthy he is elite, and when Lemieux is healthy, he is a top 5 player. Your argument is that Kuemper isn't elite and you have nothing to back that

I have nothing to back it up? What not winning a Vezina, not ever being a finalist, not ever making an all NHL team isn’t enough? Never lead the league in any season in any major statistical goalie category. And when did I ever say he wasn’t elite because of injuries. I said he wasn’t elite AND had injury issues. If you can’t even be a finalist once in your career you aren’t elite. Elite is the best of the best. How many goalies regardless of contract do you take over him, 5, 10? Vasilevsky is elite, Hellebuyck, Gibson, Price, Rask. Is he good sure. Elite get real.

I'm talking about 5v5 production per 60 minutes. Kadri scores a tonne of his points on the PP, especially last year in the playoffs.

That’s fine Danault doesn’t score enough period especially for $5M+, and knowing Newhook is your 2C at worst in 22-23. Sorry big Rich I know you like him I just don’t or at least I don’t like him for the top 6 making anything remotely resembling $5M, I’d love him at $4M as the 3C.

He has 3 seasons over 40 points and 1 of those is over 50 points. I think he would be fine in the top 6, at 5v5 going from Kadri to Danault is a lateral offensive move so as long as you have someone to take Kadri's spot on the PP then I think it would be a good move for COL. You would just have to give up Kadri's goal scoring for Danault's defense, I think the style of play is the main difference here rather than the difference in quality of player. The price would have to be right though, I think somewhere between 4.5-5 would be fine for him in a 2C + PK role

Also Danault had the highest TOI of any MTL forward in the playoffs and they just went to the finals so I dont think its accurate to say he cant be a 2C on a championship team

A lateral move? Kadri is significantly better offensively, including better xGF AND xGA. Give me a break about MTL being a championship team, 1st in a normal year they don’t even make the playoffs this year, and then literally every damn thing broke right from them from Tavares getting hurt, to Schiefle getting suspended, to even Stevenson being hurt. Tell me how Danault leading them in TOI proves anything championship caliber that Carey Price wasn’t literally a billion times more important. Christ you guys want to drink the kool aid, and advocate for signing a guy that isn’t better than either the guy in the spot now or the kid slotted to do it and is a super star 3rd liner have at it. But there is no way you can convince me all you are doing is massively overpaying for a 3rd liner particularly in a flat cap environment.

I said its a lateral move in terms of 5v5 production, and thats being generous to Kadri, Danault has higher 5v5 P/60 in the last 2 seasons and scored the same amount of even strength points as Kadri this year in less games. I dont see how thats debatable. Of course Kadri is better offensively if you include his PP production, nobody is disputing that. Kadri had marginally better xGF and xGA but also played on the best regular season team by xGF% and xGA and the 3rd best team by xGF which boosts his stats a bit. In terms of individual play Danault is the better defensive player and has comparable (if not better) 5v5 production recently


https://imgur.com/a/CNH1hxO


https://imgur.com/a/zgNTs2m

The difference between them isnt very big, its basically swapping a goal scorer with PP time for a 2 way player with PK time. Aside from those special teams they produce the same amount

I didnt say Danault singlehandedly carried MTL, but he was one of their most relied on forwards. You can make excuses for why MTL went far but Danault played his shutdown role well and I dont think its fair to say a team cant be championship quality just because Danault is their 2C. If hes used to match up against other teams top lines hes very effective as long as you have someone else to slot in on the PP to make up the lost PP production. Writing off a team just because of 1 player doesnt really make sense. I think hes a lot better than what youre giving him credit for

But this is probably all a moot point anyway cause Danault will probably be out of COLs price range anyway

EDIT: pictures didnt work but theres imgur links for both of them. It basically shows that Danault has similar/better 5v5 production the past 2 years

And that’s my whole point. At BEST Danault is a lateral move that costs more than Kadri and blocks Newhook. And then the common answer ends up being well move him to 3C, yeah a $5.5M 3C that will work, no. In an uncapped vacuum world would he be a nice addition sure, but this isn’t that.

I would give Danault a slight edge over Kadri, but I agree its not really worth it considering how much extra it would cost to get him