He’s had 2-3 vezina caliber seasons.. will never have the best save % when you always have to face the most high danger shots out of anyone.. there is no bias there at all it’s literally just the underlying numbers that are there…

... and he retired two years ago.

Giroux has taken more than 1200 faceoffs this season. Pavelski's taken about 800. Not sure how many wingers typically take -that many- faceoffs.

Scheifele's defense is bad enough that yeah, guys like Hintz, Kadri, Hughes and all them rank better than Scheifele. GSVA combines both traditional and advanced metrics to assign a score to a player, 0 is a replacement skater, 1-2 is a middle 6 guy, 2-3 is a top line player, 3-4 is elite, 4+ is cream of the crop.

Scheifele's GSVA is 2.0. So at the tail end of the first line category - not even the top center on his own team, with PLD grading out at 2.2.

Here are some other GSVA groupings for centers this year:

2-2.99: Tage Thompson (2.0), Dylan Larkin (2.3), Claude Giroux (2.3), Sam Bennett (2.4), Anton Lundell (2.4), Josh Norris (2.2), Brayden Point (2.6), Anthony Cirelli (2.2), Nico Hischier (2.7), Brock Nelson (2.7), Andrew Copp (2.0), Geno Malkin (2.3), Evgeny Kuznetsov (2.6), Dylan Strome (2.1), Ryan Hartman (2.8), Joel Eriksson Ek (2.2), Ryan O'Reilly (2.3), Adam Henrique (2.7), Philip Danault (2.1), Jack Eichel (2.9), Tomas Hertl (2.4), Elias Pettersson (2.3).

3-3.99: Sam Reinhart (3.8), Steven Stamkos (3.3), John Tavares (3.1), Sebastian Aho (3.6), Jack Hughes (3.4), Mika Zibanejad (3.4), Roope Hintz (3.6), Joe Pavelski (3.8), Matt Duchene (3.7), Robert Thomas (3.1), JT Miller (3.3).

4+ : Patrice Bergeron (4.5), Sasha Barkov (4.9), Auston Matthews (6.9), Sidney Crosby (4.3), Nathan MacKinnon (4.9), Nazem Kadri (4.5), Elias Lindholm (4.5), Connor McDavid (5.8), Leon Draisaitl (4.2).

That's 42 centers with a GSVA higher than 2.0. If you want, I can be generous and just count Copp & Thompson as equal to Scheifele if you'd like? That still puts 40 above him. There's no one in those top two tiers (3+ GSVA) that would trade their guy for Scheifele one-for-one, and I'd argue that most of the guys in the 2-3 range would also not be traded straight up for Scheifele. He is an absolute black hole in his own end (10th percentile in defensive game score added - meaning 90% of skaters have added more value defensively than him this season.) He's not a stiff, and saying he's among the top 30-40 centers still puts him above like, 80% of the centers currently playing the game.

But he's not top 20, just like Hellebuyck isn't a top 3 goalie. They're very good players, but they're not in that top tier of superstardom.

Yea, that’s an easy no thank you if I’m in Jersey. Not overpaying like that for 3 overrated guys, even though they’d be quality adds. There’s no reason to accelerate our timeline like that. Trades like that are how perennial First Round exits are built

This is honestly so ridiculous I can’t tell if ur trolling or not.. so good on ya I guess…?

i mean feel free to bring any sort of statistic that shows Scheifele deservers to be considered a top 20 center in the league, because you've brought nothing to the table so far

Considering you have Tage Thompson ahead of him says enough about you

considering you can't be bothered to even read what i say, much less bring anything to the table to back up your opinion, says enough about you pal

and for what it's worth, Tage Thompson scored 38 goals (Scheif had 29) and had better possession numbers than Scheifele (54.4% CF vs. 50.3) while making about a quarter of Mark's salary. Buffalo wouldn't trade Thompson for Scheifele one-for-one in a million years.

again, i beg of you, bring one shred of analysis to back up anything you're trying to say here, one single statistic. until then your opinion is absolutely worthless to me.

Scheif had a down year and still had more pts.. before this year Thompson career high was 14 pts your absolutely trolling

I stand by what I said - Buffalo woudn't trade Thompson straight up for Scheifele in any possible universe. Thompson scores at nearly the same pace, drives possession significantly better than Scheifele, and actually can play at both ends of the rink, and he does it all with about 3 minutes less ice time per night than Scheifele. And that's before you get to the contract.

LMAO

gave you a list of 40 players that analytics show are more valuable than mark scheifele and this is all you got to come back with, huh

Scheif on a down year was over a ppg.. the list you gave was absolutely pathetic with 2-3 players not even playing center

i get it dude, you know nothing about hockey and can't bring anything useful to the table, have fun hanging out on my ignored list

Know nothing that I’m taking a player (with a down year) still producing more then the players you listed.. ya I’m the one the knows nothing when you listed wingers as a center and think Aho is better then Barkov