Edited Oct. 20, 2022 at 7:20 p.m.
Quoting: dannibalcorpse
-This Chicago trade is something. First off: I don't see the Hawks putting all their trade eggs in one basket unless it's a significant overpay. Besides Kane, you have Max Domi & Jack Johson in here - both veterans on 1-year deals that are trade bait, so if you want them & Patty Kane in the same deal, you're paying full freight. It's not Costco.
Using the Giroux template for Kane misses the fact that, if he plays up to last year's numbers, he's a much more productive player. Giroux with full retention got a 1st, a 3rd, and a younger roster player with a 5th and two warm bodies going back, so that's the floor here - I'd argue that you can upgrade the Owen Tippett part of this deal to a strong prospect if Kane is above a PPG pace again by the deadline.
Max Domi fully retained would probably get back a mid-round pick and a lottery ticket prospect; Jack Johnson probably gets one or the other.
The only prospect with any real value here is Adam Ruzicka, who projects out as a bottom-6 guy. Pospisil & MEP project as 13th forwards; Phillips is small enough that it's very unlikely his AHL production translates to the NHL, Mackey is already 26 and not someone you can really consider a prospect anymore. This is a classic quality over quantity type of trade and Chicago passes - just delete everything that isn't Ruzicka & the picks, add one of Zary/Coronato/Pelletier, and then you've got a conversation. This isn't anywhere near it, though.
-This deal is awful for New York, for a few reasons that I would admittedly not expect a Flames fan to know offhand. The Islanders are committed to their top-4 the way it is at this point, regardless of how you feel about the skill level of their players - Adam Pelech/Ryan Pulock is the top pair after both of them signed big extensions, and Alexander Romanov/Noah Dobson is the second pair, full stop. Dobson is worthy of that RD2 spot now, and with the assets devoted to acquiring Romanov (the 13th OA pick + a 3x$2.5M extension), there's a vested interest in seeing those two 22-year-olds build chemistry together. If they acquired Oliver Kylington, he's most likely headed for their 3rd pair, which isn't the best use of assets for the team - especially one that has Robin Salo locked in at $800K this year and next. I don't care about how you feel about the talent level of those players right now; this is one of the rare moves Lou Lamoriello has made with an eye towards the future and it doesn't make sense to break it up after 3 games.
Beyond that, the value doesn't make sense. Mayfield for Kylington makes some sense in a vacuum, but it's also not a move the Islanders need to make. To throw in Beauvillier with 2 years of full retention on this makes even less sense - even in an off season last year, Beau was more productive than Rooney. And lastly, if the Islanders do hit the point where they're moving guys like Mayfield or Beauvillier at the deadline, it's going to be for futures - and there's just not enough of that here.
Thanks for commenting, I appreciate your well thought out and measured response, without the insults & chastising I've been getting on this one lol.
I don't think CHI has much leverage once Kane decides which Team he's willing to waive to go too, but maybe he gives 2-3 and there's a competition to drive up the price.
Depending how Domi performs this year, he could go for more, but for now I'm banking on it being a 3rd Round Pick like last year. I could easily see Jack Johnson being a throw in if CHI is getting a potential long-term replacement in Connor Mackey. D-Men typically peak between 24-32 years old, so he's got 6 years of peak play left in him yet, so to me he's a great asset and I don't really want to give him up. If Hanifin will cost too much to re-sign, we may be able to turn Mackey in to a Top-4 LD ourselves, he's that good in my eyes.
Hard to really tell or know whether their play will translate from the AHL to the NHL, especially when they aren't given an opportunity or when they are, they get bottom feeding minutes on what most consider a "Checking Line". Put Ruzicka & Phillips in the Top-9 with some talent and see what they can do then. I'm not claiming these guys to be the next Gretzky, Gaudreau or DeBrincat for that matter, but there is room in the NHL for small players and Phillips is 5'8 165lbs, not the 5'7 140lbs CapFriendly has him listed as, I wish they'd update that info. Every time he's played for the Flames, he's been dangerous offensively. He might be more of a Power Play Specialist, but he is playing against Bigger Guys in the AHL too. In the one & only NHL regular season game he was given, he had 2 great scoring chances. He deserves a shot, but I do understand he has a lot going against him
Fair enough on Romanov, I would have suggested sheltering him at 3LW and lining Kylington up with Dobson, but if not $2.5mil for a 3LD isn't terrible. Injuries do happen as well, so it's nice to have depth in case
What's NYI's plans for Mayfield, maybe they re-sign him, otherwise I was thinking they rent him out for an asset and re-sign him through Free Agency. Meloche has good size & speed and will be a very good 3rd Pairing Shut Down D-Man in my eyes. At just 25, he has 7 years of peak play left in him. I don't really want to give him up, because he could be our current Gudbranson or future Tanev replacement, but Michael Stone deserves the spot more and you gotta give to get, so to land Mayfield I felt offering a 2nd and a replacement would be attractive. Maybe he is worth more like a Chiarot package.
As for Beauvillier, he's been in Trade Rumors for awhile now, so I thought NYI might be open to moving him to make more room for other guys coming up. He's not amazing, but he's not bad either. I would think he & Kylington have similar value at around $2-2.5mil/yr each, but NYI would have to be compensated sufficiently to convince them to retain for another year, as that's not very common
In any event, I'm just trying to have fun here and discuss hockey. I do learn and it helps me determine players values. Of course I'm going to try and defend or support my position and we all know & value our teams players & prospects more than others. That should be known and is to be expected.
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Pelletier,
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