Well it was rumored that Flyers asking price was 1st with 25% retention on Ristolainen and Canucks & Leafs being interested. But he was injured and couldn't be traded. So it'd be the 1st + something with 50% retention. Also I wouldn't be surprised if he gets traded during the off season.

That ask is a little high but I would potentially be willing to give up a first for him from EDMs perspective.
It's difficult to judge his worth cause he hasn't fit in well in Phili's system (at least statistically), I dont watch Phili so I wouldn't be able to tell why.

I still think he has value, he was pretty good in Buffalo when he was younger and I think matured his game in the right direction.
Would your side be willing to take cap back, namely Kulak/Ceci?

He had by far the best defensive season of his career just last year. He's not putting up 40 points but I would argue he's fit Tort's system quite well, maybe even saved his career.

If Philly's willing to retain on him that's probably the only realistic target from your list there. Everyone else is either not available with retention, not available at all, or way out of your price range

Could see them taking Ceci as part of the return, Kulak not so much, there is already more than enough LHD. With Ceci for one more year they don't have to rush with Bonk. Maybe something in range of -25 1st + Ceci <-> Risto retained would be close?

That's ridiculous. Ristolainen likely isn't even an upgrade on Ceci, he's more expensive and has a lot more term left. Why would Edmonton add a 1st?

I don't know how they've teached math for you, but Ceci with 3,25M is more expensive than Risto with 2,55M. And indeed he has term, that's why Oilers are adding. He's actually been good, since Torts and Shaw joined, and the cap is going up so could see that contract aging well. And like I mentioned earlier, there were rumors before TDL about Risto 25% retained getting 1st (or at least that was the asking price), but he was injured.

Yea that's where I have a lack of knowledge on him, it's hard to judge his defensive game when I can't watch him, why the drop in ice time though?

I think there are a few options, Zub, Risto and Faulk seem the most likely to me for their team to move them but you never know.
Even Spurgeon on Minny may be an option if we can find the right price, that team is young (at least the main guys are) and the 14M dead cap rn might incentives them to move some of their aging cast right now for some future picks/role fillers before they age out of their worth.

With that retention I may do it with Desh rights (he is a UFA so take it with a grain of salt) for 50% retained, ex. Risto 50% for Desh and 2025 1st.
I think with Risto retained keeping Ceci is better for us cause he has been pretty good in our lineup, plus Risto brings the physicality that we'd lose in Desh (plus Risto is a larger upgrade on Desh than he is on Ceci).

Risto (50%) for Desh (rights) + 2025 1st, maybe we also get a 4th-5th back but idk if I'd die on that hill.

Our d-lines are:
Ekholm-Bouch
Nurse-Risto
Broberg-Ceci

We can swap Ceci and Risto as needed depending on their fit with Nurse/Broberg.

Torts plays Ristolainen as a 3rd pairing defenseman, that's not worth a 1st even at $2.55M.

There are several clues as to how much Torts trusts Ristolainen.

5v5 TOI, 22-23: #5 among Flyers defensemen
5v5 TOI, 23-24: #6 among Flyers defensemen
On the fly starts/60, 22-23: #5 among Flyers defensemen
On the fly starts/60, 23-24: #6 among Flyers defensemen
TOI% v Elites, 22-23: #4 among Flyers defensemen
TOI% v Elites, 23-24: #6 among Flyers defensemen

He's a 3rd pairing guy, according to Tortorella.

But hey, there's a sucker born every day... I just don't want it to be Edmonton. Trading a legit 2nd pairing guy for an overpriced 3rd pairing guy is a Chiarelli move, and he got fired years ago.

Ristolainen just isn't worth a 1st. You can get better UFA defenders for just money.

Also, at 4v5 (PK), Torts played Ristolainen 2:04 per game last season but just 45 seconds per game this season. He doesn't trust him at all.

Cap dump.

Zub literally just signed an extension and is their only serviceable RHD.
Risto could probably be had but pretty unlikely they retain 50% with 3 years left
Faulk is a US born player with gull trade protection for another year, plus it's quite unlikely they would retain on him

[

Not sure that's a particularly good argument, he started the season on IR and Philly came out of the gates strong, when he came back they didn't want to mess with chemistry too much. Then he had a season ending injury

You must have missed the rest of the stats. Here, I'll quote it for you:



A $5M, 3rd pairing defenseman is a cap dump, plain and simple. But Philly fans think they'll get a 1st for him.

Yeah could be something like that also, just the general consensus in this site has been that Oilers should get rid of Ceci for 3rd or smth. So thought you're replacing Ceci with him.

He's been battling with injuries this season, started the season late november and it ended already in mid february, never really been full healthy this season. And it's true that Torts said something like Risto was very bad when he started there, but last year he also stated how he's the most improved player who was getting more TOI the longer season went. That first part of the season is dragging his avg TOI down.

But yeah, Risto at 2,55M is easily worth the 1st for the Flyers. Dunno if they just want to retain 50%, rumors were 25%-35% what they were ready to retain.

And yes Risto has bad reputation, which also affects your opinion about him, but everyone who's actually seen him play under Torts can see the difference.

I don't need to waste my time watching a mediocre Flyers club. Torts considers Ristolainen a 3rd pairing defenseman and that's enough for me. I respect his hockey knowledge.

Well he was top 10% DWAR player last season despite him being awful (according to Torts) at the start of the season. But he also improved A LOT. And his avg TOI was about 21min february - end of season while also having 60 CF%. And like said this season he's been battling with injuries.

But maybe it's just pointless to argue more about this if you genuinely think Ceci is 2nd pairing D. He's just weaker version of Risto, playing Top 4 minutes because you couldn't upgrade him at TDL. Ristolainen would also be better pair for Nurse, because Nurse seems to need more help in D-zone than Ceci can provide.

Talking to a couple of the STL fans on this site they see retention on Faulk as doable, really depends on his view of playing in the north cause of that NTC.

IDK about the Sens and Zub, I havent been able to gather a lot from their fans or anything around their team about the direction they're going.
Given he's 3 years left I wouldn't imagine him being on their no trade list, maybe just a costly guy to get.

I would rather keep Ceci than Desh, the consensus on this site with Ceci is really mixed but I still see him as a very effective 2nd-3rd pairing RHD and would like EDM's lineup more with him in it rather than Desh.

With Risto I have to somewhat agree with @CD282, paying a first straight across for him is a risk for us even with that retention.
I'm fine with it cause I still like Risto a lot and when I could watch him on Buffalo he was good (albeit 3 years ago), I imagine he improved in area's he needed to but IDK... I only watch Phili when they play EDM and Risto was injured all year.

Under that same logic Tort also saw him building towards a top dman cause his ice time climbed steadily since he came back from injury until his season ending injury in February.
I also wouldn't say Desh is a legit second pairing guy, he is a great 6th dman but hasn't solidified a 2nd pairing spot in any way.

This, like the other guys stats, is 100% false.

In his first 5 games this season, Ristolainen averaged 15:42 (5th most on the Flyers squad).
In his last 5 games, Ristolainen averaged 15:29 TOI (6th most among Flyers defensemen).

*all situations


Of course Desharnais isn't a legit second pairing guy. Ceci is though.

From February 1st to the end of the 22-23 season, Ristolainen played 15:32 TOI/GP at 5v5 (6th among Flyers defensemen) and posted a 45.60 CF%. Playing sheltered minutes. That's ugly.

In the situation of getting Risto I'd keep Ceci, Risto would be stepping in for Desh.

He's most certainly not worth a 1st then. That's an overpay for a 3rd pairing defenseman.

I'd rather sign Desharnais or someone relaticely cheap for 1-2 years and see where Wanner and Akey are at that point.