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Pens71
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Forum: Armchair-GMSun. at 10:58 a.m.
Thread: Based on what DUBAS said today in his press conference
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>I think you are way to hard on Poulin but we'll see next year. I don't remember seeing or hearing anything saying he got benched. He could have just been banged up. He was only getting 9 mins a night and that game he had 5. and 4 less shifts. He it's not like he was catching penalties or turning the puck over either. But that was a tight game and it was a must win for them. So it wouldn't surprise me if Sully just didn't trust his younger players.

If Puustinen was a scoring machine we would know by now, he's 24. Kessel was playing at 19. They are not comparable.
Kessel was lazy, but he wasn't just a 3rd line player either. He was shifted back and forth and a PP specialist. I also did not say speed is why Kessel is out of the league not sure how you get that.
He's out the league because he got old and it was time to retire as his play declined.
There is no contradicting anywhere you just running with things that don't exist, like the why kessel isn't in the league. Again a few years ago Puustinen might have been a more impact player when the penguins were smoking people with speed. But that time is past. The game today is a lot faster than what it was in 2017. The players with speed got bigger. It's not just your 5'10 forward anymore. Teams want best of both worlds. You keep arguing hard for him to make some sort of excuse why he should be on the team, but most likely next year he will not be.
They need actual help on the ice, he doesn't provide that.

As far as Marchand is concerned... that is all there is to say about Marchand. He's a rat, that's all I'll ever say about Marchand. He's a rat.</div></div>

I am pretty sure he turned the puck over once and that's why he got benched. Not a reason to bench him imo and I agree that Sully doesn't trust young players. But he is going to have to this year, based on Dubas comments. we'll see with Poulin.

I thought you implied because he was old and lost his speed that's why he is out out the league,....because you then talked about how the NHL changed to a speed game. I still disagree with the idea that just because the penguins won with speed a few years ago and he wont be effective now because the league adapted is ridiculous. Sure he might not be as effective but you have to match speed vs speed. I would rather Puustinen who is fast, playing against other fast teams than Poulin isn't very fast.

Also, Puustinen and Poulin should not be on the team next year imo. But unfortunately, Poulin and Puustinen have to be on the NHL roster to start the year unless we traded one of them or sent them through waivers. So I have a feeling both will start the year on the team unless Dubas sends them somewhere, which I think is possible.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 6:00 p.m.
Thread: Jakey come back U can blame it all on Sully
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>That's what I was saying, if he's not in the NHL he has to go back to the CHL. He can not go to the AHL. Under 20 goes back to the CHL by contract with the CHL.

I totally agree with you on Pickering. if all things were equal..... but if the options next year are another year of Ludvig and POJ....what they got to lose?
I mean we already know that 3rd pairing will sink the team next year if nothing is done. The team is just out of time. If the option is to do nothing for the 3rd pairing in FA. To roll with what they currently have. Pickering is a better option than what they got. As we've seen it, and we know it's not working.

It's better for this team to get use to developing young players while giving them a chance now. Because in a few years they are going to be like CBJ.... draft and play because they don't have the talent on roster.
So they better start figuring it out now. As they won't have options in a few years anyway.</div></div>

The bottom pairing of Shea and St Ivany was pretty good for us down the stretch.....I agree about POJ and Ludvig, I would not use them at all. I would go St.Ivany and a cheap free agent with Shea as the 7th Dman.

I hear what you are saying about Pickering, I just think he needs more time. He needs to show me he is ready for NHL in WBS. He is slower than Yager in development, so don't rush him to NHL quite yet imo.
If he shows me he is ready in WBS mid way through the season, then yeah bring him up. I just wouldn't start him in NHL.

imo......Yager, Blomqvist, Ponomarev, St Ivany and Poulin should/will start the year on the NHL roster.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 5:53 p.m.
Thread: Based on what DUBAS said today in his press conference
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>lets get it right. You don't get bench when you only get 3 games.
He was only there on an injury call up. It's not like they were giving him a real chance to play. The second guys got health he was off the ice again. You can't get benched when you don't have a place to begin with.

Kessel and Puustinen have nothing in common. Kessel was a scoring machine. Puustinen is not. That is where that ends and why it's not even worth talking about.
You are talking about a different team at a different time. That was when the rest of the league was literally slow as snails and the penguins were blowing people off the line. Two years later when the rest of the league caught up....how was Kessel working out? Especailly when he was never playing defense. He wasn't. But he was feasting on the PP which has never been the same without him.
If he could have just played defense, but he didn't. Which is why a real top 6 talent like Kessel was on the 3rd line to being with. because they couldn't put him and Malkin on the same like as they were both too lazy to play defense. So lets not compare a guy who was a legit top 6 guy to an AHLer.

For the record Marchand is a rat and Sheary was back checked to the ground nightly. Which is why he is no longer here. He couldn't fight for the puck if his life depended on it. He did no dirty work.
I don't even know what Sheary you are talking about here because it sure as hell was never one that played for the penguins. Hell I use to call him the mop.... because he was always down moping up the ice with his face.

Which is why they don't need Puustinen on the bottom 6.

If you were talking about a team back in 2017 maybe he could have fit in being a faster player while the league was slow.... but that time is gone. You have to meet the standards of where the game is today.
Those smaller players are simply getting eaten alive when they have to play their own zone.</div></div>

you don't understand the word benched.....he was benched mid game!!! I am not talking about after 3 games. after 3 games he was a healthy scratch and then sent down to Wilkes barre. also, he doesnt only have 3 games in the NHL. He has 6 games under his belt and has shown nothing. He hasn't shown he is ready for the NHL in AHL either. They are only giving him a chance next year because he has to go through waivers next year. very overrated player.

and you said exactly my point on Kessel. Kessel was a scoring machine......thats what they are hoping Puustinen can be. All my point was is, not every player has to be a grinder type player and be a good bottom 6 player. So again, if he was too lazy to play defense, he was also to lazy to do the dirty work......and guess what......he was a part of the best third line in those playoffs.

So your only argument for Marchand is he is a rat.......lol.

And who cares if Sheary was back checked to the ice nightly, he also won puck battles and obviously it was enough to win a Stanley Cup with Sid.......also so would Poulin be knocked to ice on a nightly basis. Have you seen Poulin? Poulin is very weak on his skates. This argument of just because he is bigger is so bad.

Also, you just said the league has caught up with speed and that's why Kessel is out of the league. So why would we not have fast players on our team. You wanna have tall, slow guys on our team. I will tell you, that would not go well for us. So if Puustinen is fast like you said, then maybe thats a good thing and not a bad thing. We want to match other teams speed, not try and be big and slow. You completely contradicted yourself with the Kessel argument and then the Puustinen argument. Do you want a fast team? thats why Kessel isn't in the NHL anymore, because he lost his speed.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 4:27 p.m.
Thread: Jakey come back U can blame it all on Sully
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>he can not go to the WHL, he has to go back to the CHL per agreement.
It's basically a wasted year there for him.</div></div>

You knew what we meant......CHL.

All the other guy is saying is if he doesn't make the team, he has to go back to the CHL.

But I agree with you in terms of Yager.....He should 100% be on the Penguins roster next year. Let him figure it out with Sid showing him the way. I wasn't arguing for him to go back to the CHL.

In terms of Pickering and POJ......I am good with letting POJ walk. I think Pickering of any of the prospects needs time in WIlkes to develop before coming up. Yager is special.....but Pickering has shown he needs more time. Pickering should start in Wilkes imo.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 4:21 p.m.
Thread: Based on what DUBAS said today in his press conference
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>they didn't bench him they never even let him play.
This is the same kind of thought process that has had Shane Wright sitting in SEA. It's absolute mismanagement.
You clearly don't know what it means to give a young player a chance. To expect instant show me in 3 games or your nothing......... is just an awful take.

As for Pustinen, you go ahead, name all those 4'1 4th liners.
There aren't many and there is a reason for that. You have to have size in that role. It's a fight for a puck line, an energy line meant to wake the team up, do the dirty work type of line.
He offers none of that. Those small forwards, if they can't have the talent level to get into the top 6 on a team, become nothing but a burden because they just don't have what it takes to be on the bottom half of the roster. This team doesn't need another Connor Sheary in it's bottom 6.</div></div>

Yes, they did bench him. Sullivan benched him. He then was a healthy scratch and then sent back down to Wilkes Barre. It didn't help that he sat out for almost an entire year......so its not entirely on the penguins and the mismanagement you speak of. its completely different then Shane Wright and you know it. I am fine with giving him a chance in training camp......just will be disappointed if he makes the team, he isnt that great.

Now you say 4th liners lol......you originally said bottom 6. also you completely ignored my Kessel comparison......he was not a "fight for a puck guy" at all and look at that 3rd line. Not everyone has to be a "fight for the puck" line. You need different types of guys. Marchand isn't in the bottom 6 but he is a "fight for the puck guy" and he is the same size as Puustinen. Connor Sheary was a "fight for the puck" guy. He did a lot of dirty work for Sid and he is small.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 4:08 p.m.
Thread: Jakey come back U can blame it all on Sully
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Haymaker26</b></div><div>Yager is still 19, so if he doesn't make the Pens out of camp, he has to be sent back to the WHL. If that is the case, we can't call him up until his season in the W is over.

With Jake it's not a matter of "is he worth $9.5M" so much as it is "are we willing to spend $9.5M on one slot." Is Jake worth that money? Without a shadow of a doubt. Is it the best move to lock up that much cap space at 1LW given the team's current roster construction? Probably not. We can use that money to get a top 6 winger and afford an upgrade to the bottom 6 or defense.

Pens fans' doubt of Puustinen continues to confuse me. He had his ups and downs, but so did the wingers we pay $5M a year. Like I said, 1.96 points/60, which is better than DOC, Rakell, and every other bottom 6 player. His on-ice stats are stellar: 56.82 GF% (2nd among Pens F), 55.83 xGF% (2nd), 53.51 SF% (5th), and that's despite the team's shooting and save % while he's on the ice are near the team average. He's driven play remarkably well in a lesser role.

I don't really have a preference between Poulin/Ponomarev. Whichever 3 of them, Gruden, and Puljujarvi who look best in camp can fill out the 4th line. Certainly can't be worse than throwing Harkins, Nieto, and Acciari out there again.</div></div>

I know he has one more year of eligiblity with WHL.....but can't they send him to Wilkes Barre if they think he is ready too? honest question, not sure rules with WHL.

My point with Jake is, I think if Jake comes back with the penguins, it will be for less than 9.5 million. Only way he comes back is if he takes less than what the open market is giving him. He will absolutely get more from another team.....its just a matter of how much does he want to come back.

Puustinen is fine......you wanna look at all those stats....fine. But if you want a 3rd line who can be a scoring 3rd line who can help produce.....Puustinen on the 3rd line is not answer. 5 goals isn't good. we need better from him. Maybe I am willing to earn the spot next season. but we need more from him for sure.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 2:12 p.m.
Thread: Jakey come back U can blame it all on Sully
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Haymaker26</b></div><div>Full stop, this is far from the best this team could do.
I don't think Yager, Broz, or Pickering are NHL ready. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I imagine they'll all get a quick look at most.
Jack St. Ivany has been solid, much to my surprise. He plays a better physical shutdown game than the rest of our 3rd pairing options. Why replace young talent with a more expensive player that is only marginally better?
"Guentzel isn''t worth 9.5M" have you been living under a rock? He was worth that before scoring 25 in 17 with CAR. He's a superstar. That doesn't necessarily mean that bringing him back is the best move for the team: I want to pick up a shutdown LHD on a short term deal until Pickering is ready. But someone is going to pay Jake a lot of money this summer and they are going to be very happy that they did.

Ideal bottom 6 IMO looks something like:
DOC - Eller - Puustinen
Gruden - Poulin/Ponomarev - Puljujarvi
with Eller moving down to 4C later in the season if Poulin/Ponomarev look good.</div></div>

Agree that Broz, Yager and Pickering are not NHL ready. Yager might be a midseason addition but not to start the year. St Ivany should 100% be our 3rd RD pairing guy.

If we clear Smith's contract, I think we should absolutely try to get Guentzel back.......... 9.5 million is just a little to high for me though.

I don't like Puusty on the 3rd line.....He didn't do enough for me to think he has that spot secured.

And I would much rather have Ponomarev as our 4th line center than Poulin.....I think Poulin is overrated. Excited to see what Ponomarev can do. Saw him play in the AHL.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat. at 1:56 p.m.
Thread: Based on what DUBAS said today in his press conference
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>LuckyMoneyPuck</b></div><div>you are acting like he was ever given a chance to play and show anything. He gets 3 games a year because they refuse to play him. Which isn't because of his play but a lot of other reasons like him taking a year off which rubbed the coaching staff the wrong way. Fact is they mismanaged him from the beginning and you can already see the trade coming and success on another team.

But from what he's shown in the AHL he's clearly got greater potential to fill a bottom 6 role.

To say "just because he's taller" .... is really missing the point. It's not only he's short, but he is 120lbs soaking wet. He doesn't have the size to play that bottom 6 role.
You need to be able to win those puck battles to get the puck out of your end in those bottom 6 roles where you get more defensive starts. He's not built to do that.
Puusty belongs in the AHL. He's a prototypical not talented enough to be an NHL top 6, and too small to be an NHL bottom 6 player.
They are a dime a dozen out there.</div></div>

All I was saying was the games he has played, he hasn't shown anything. They benched him and sent him down after a couple games of not looking good. He hasn't taken advantage of his opportunities. They are going to give him a shot next season, Dubas said they will because he is has to go on waivers if he doesn't make team. Next season is his last chance. So we'll see what happens.

Look, I agree with you on Pustinen. I don't want him in our lineup......but to say just because he is small doesn't mean he can't be in our bottom 6. Phil Kessel isn't small but you think he went in into the corners and won puck battles and played at defensive starts.......he didn't. He was the most offensive minded guy on the team for us back then. Not everyone has to be grind type of player. You need a mix and match of players. If you have 3 grind type players, fine......but you will never score any goals. I am not saying Pustinen is Kessel at all.....but you need a guy who can shoot on your bottom 6 too. The argument of being too small and not a puck battle type guy is so weak and a horrible argument. Their are plenty of successful NHL players that are his exact size.
Forum: Armchair-GMApr. 19 at 1:35 p.m.
Thread: Based on what DUBAS said today in his press conference
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>fil97</b></div><div>in my opinion, reading through the line of what he said today, we need graves to go back to last years form because we are kind of stuck with him with his contract which will be tough to trade. I do believe he will trade smith, last year of his contract and easy to trade for a late pick to a rebuilding team that will flip him retained at the deadline. honestly he wasn't awful but at the same time we needed more from him in particular down the stretch. Blomqvist I agree will be the backup (I do believe dubas might try to trade jarry if Ned can resign for less, very difficult tho we'll see).
personally, I would stay away from debrusk. he is good don't get me wrong but I think we need more consistency and not having a similar player to smith, even if a bit better.
if you trade smith and not sign debrusk you have 12mil left on the cap which I would give to puusty and guentzel. I know not easy but I do believe bringing back Jake is a huge boost not only for the present trying to make the playoffs but also for the future rebuild in a couple of years.
imo 7x10m is a tough offer to decline.
have like:

Jake sid rust
bunting geno raks
o'connor eller puusty/yager
and your fourth line.


what about Koivunen : is he actually close to make the team or not really?</div></div>

yep, I agree with you. If we can trade Jarry for an ok return I think he does it. If we could trade Smith and get Guentzel back I would do that. My issue is I am not a fan of Puusty on the 3rd line, I would love if Yager could be ready and play 3rd line wing for sure. In terms of Koivunen, Dubas made a comment at the trade deadline press conference that its going to depend after the season on his status for coming over to the AHL or even NHL. We will know more close to training camp on him. I think Yager has a better shot this year, but I just stuck Koivunen there for now.