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HeinousFulcrum

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Forum: Armchair-GMJan. 23, 2019 at 4:49 p.m.
Thread: Chiarelli is the answer
Don't understand the title of this one ... Chiarelli is definitely not the answer to anything. Detroit's next GM will most likely be Steve Yzerman.
Edit: Saw your comment that it was a joke :)

There is no way that Carolina is giving up Necas. That trade is just a non-starter.
Cam Talbot has not been very good for Edmonton and has been passed in the depth by Koskinen. I don't think Edmonton will want to trade for Howard when they just signed Koskinen to a new contract. If that trade would happen the 2nd round pick would not be included, it would be a one for one. Also, I don't understand the logic behind bringing a rental player back. Players don't generally come back to a team when they trade them at the TDL.
I don't think you are going to pry Hyman from Babcock. As much as he loved Glendening, he likes Hyman as much; plus he is much younger than Glendening.
I actually think the Montreal Frk trade makes some sense. A 3rd round pick would probably be pushing it, but not out of the realm of possibility.
I really want the Karlsson signing to happen. Detroit should make that priority number 1 if he doesn't sign an extension with San Jose. 11 million may be too low, but not much off the mark.
If Detroit were to draft third I think it would be between Podkolzin or Cozens. Nothing against Dach, I just see him being a tier below those two.
Forum: Armchair-GMJan. 23, 2019 at 1:19 p.m.
Thread: What would these players net
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>yanp007</b></div><div>As fan, it's your right!!
1- Zadina: Right now, he's under the expectations, with time maybe he will become a good player, I hope!! But actually, his defensive game isn't correct, he's a one way player.
2- Veleno: He was suppose to be a top10 pick, did you see him at the WJC?? He plays big against little and he plays little against big...
3- McIsaac: I'm not very sure about this one, I saw him 3-4 times this year and something is wrong about his game, but I canno't tell you what it is...

I'm living in Quebec, I saw this 3 prospects in arena few times... Maybe Zadina will understand something and progress, maybe McIsaac will developp correct. But you can forget Veleno, he plays the same than Louis Leblanc...</div></div>

I am merely pointing out that you said Cholowski is our only good prospect, which I think is not accurate.

1. I don't think Zadina is under expectations, just that we as fans have to temper our expectations of these players as they develop. A half season in Grand Rapids should not be determinate on whether he is a bust or not. You also have to realize that they may not be giving Zadina free reins to go out there and play the style of game that he is meant too. They are most likely teaching him other aspects of the game that he will need at the pro level, and those aspects are probably his focus at the moment.
2. I did watch Veleno at the WJC, but I'm not sure if you did. He was put in a very limited role on the 4th line and then moved up to the 3rd line as the tournament wore on as he was proving to be better than how they were deploying him. Most shifts he was driving his line and making plays happen. He was called out by the coach one game, and came back and had a very strong game in which the coach praised him for. If you've watched him play you'll notice that his puck protection, skating, and passing are all at elite levels. His goal scoring ability, which was a concern, has greatly improved this season. If you watched him this summer at the prospect camp, he was the best player out there.
3. McIsaac was a long shot to make the WJC team but he made it. I don't think 3-4 viewings is a very good measure for a prospect, and the fact that you can't tell what is wrong with his game is very telling. He is leading his team in points among defensemen and is over a PPG player.
Forum: Armchair-GMJan. 22, 2019 at 5:48 p.m.
Thread: What would these players net
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>yanp007</b></div><div>The future isn't very nice for Detroit. Zadina isn't the expected player for the moment. Cholowski is almost the only good prospect, I don't believe that McIsaac is a NHL'er... Rasmussen could be a 2nd liner, Hronek maybe a TOP4... This team is so old!!!!</div></div>

I definitely do not agree with your assessment that the future isn't very nice for Detroit. Especially for the reasons that you have stated. Cholowski is not the only good prospect that we have.

Zadina - He may not be living up to your expectations currently, however, he is a better prospect than any in our system currently. The jump from juniors (especially from the QMJHL) to pro leagues (even the AHL) is massive, and the majority of them need a bit of time at the pro level to develop. Zadina has the added benefit of being able to go to a Pro league over juniors, which helps his development exponentially. He is an elite level prospect.
Veleno - This kid is absolutely tearing up the QMJHL this year. He is a center with elite skating and playmaking ability. He has all the skills and tools to become a top 6 forward.
McIsaac - Can you please explain your reasons behind thinking he is not an NHL caliber prospect? He is producing at more than a PPG in the QMJHL and has improved every year he's been in that league. He is an excellent skating and has a good first pass. He also plays with a bit of a mean streak.
Rasmussen - I actually think the 2nd line would be overrating his ability. He is a 3rd line player that specializes on the power play. Detroit drafted him for the sole reason to stick him in front of the net on the power play and to retrieve and protect pucks.
Hronek - Had a great first pro year and is continuing that in the NHL. He will definitely be a top 4 defenceman on this team.

I'm not including Berggren in this list as he has been injured this whole year, but I think he is also a top 6/9 forward as well. Detroit will probably get a top 5 pick this year and there are 5 really good prospects to choose from there. Detroit also has a lot of cap coming off this year giving them lots of flexibility to shore up the defense in the next 2 years. These old players are also coming off the books over the next 2 years.

Detroit's future is very bright. There are holes to fix, but the core is already there and looking very promising.
Forum: Armchair-GMSep. 10, 2018 at 1:58 p.m.
Forum: Armchair-GMSep. 5, 2018 at 3:21 p.m.
Thread: Most likely opening day lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Jfstompers</b></div><div>as bad as the forwards look atleast theres room for some growth their. larkin is probably the player hes going to be now but mantha and aa and bertuzzi can still grow. plus maybe rass and zadina who I think makes this line up can chip in. the blueline is really the scary part. idk if any of the young dmen can make a difference but the 6 we have coming back are just not good. Old and tired and yeah green and daley have some life left and maybe are fringe second pair guys but Kronwall and ericsson are bottom pair at best. idk what to say about dekeyser. he looked ok 2 seasons in and then nothing. I can help but think hes has regressed more from a lack of quality coaching. we haven't brought a top 4 defenseman into the league in years.</div></div>
I think Larkin still has room to grow. He can get better in the faceoff as well as being better defensively, especially as he will be facing higher levels of competition this year with Zetterberg out. Mantha can be more consistent and Bertuzzi has to find his place in the lineup; Is he a top 6 or a bottom 6 forward? I think the jury is still out on him. I'm still unsure about Athanasiou's growth. He has flashes, but they are too far and few between. Detroit's defense is definitely one of the worst, if not THE worst, in the league. Which I consider that an asset at this point. Detroit has a couple defense prospects that I can see growing into a top-four role in Cholowski, Hronek, Lindstrom, and McIssac. However, Detroit needs game changers on defense, and they get them by drafting top five to ten for a couple more years. These aging defenseman we have will all be off the books in two to three years and Detroit can slowly bolster the back end with these prospects. So if Detroit is losing games because their defense is terrible I say great. Get higher draft positions for the next couple years. Draft a top 2 defenceman and sign another and they are set. Dekeyser to me is an enigma. I really hope he can turn his game around and be the player he was two to three years ago.
Forum: Armchair-GMSep. 5, 2018 at 11:53 a.m.
Thread: Most likely opening day lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Stevierebz</b></div><div>Personally, I’d love to see Z on the first line with Larkin and Mantha; I think if Larkin progresses from last year than that line would be very exciting to watch. But I completely agree with you on development, and that’s why I think it would be better for him and the team if he spent a year in GR polishing some edges.</div></div>

I think Zadina makes opening day roster, based on the fact that Zetterberg is probably done for the whole season. He usually plays RW I believe, so it will be interesting to see where he is inserted into the lineup. I do agree that a year in Grand Rapids wouldn't hurt his development, and bringing Svechnikov up to the NHL instead of being in the AHL for another year would be better for him.
Forum: Armchair-GMSep. 5, 2018 at 1:08 a.m.
Thread: Wings in 2018/19
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Larkinisking</b></div><div>You can disagree with me all you want on Vanek, It's already been reported that he wont waive this time. Hence why Holland gave him the full NTC for the life of the contract. Yeah the Nyquist for Leivo makes no sense from Detroit's perspective. Yzerman would never do Dotchin for Glendening Dotchin's value is slightly better. And Daley will net a 3rd rounder at the TDL next year.</div></div>

Lol, and I will continue to disagree, as it has also been reported the NTC should not be a major factor. It is there so he can control his destiny. He only has a 1 year deal, this isn't a permanent move for him and his family. I'm not saying he will for sure be traded at the deadline, but I am saying that it is not set in stone that he will refuse all trade offers. I agree, I don't see the Dotchin trade happening, but I still think it would be fair. I also agree Daley potentially could net a 3rd next years trade deadline.
Forum: Armchair-GMSep. 4, 2018 at 4:25 p.m.
Thread: Wings in 2018/19
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Larkinisking</b></div><div>Vanek wont waive this time, He's getting sick and tired of constantly uprooting his family. It's already been reported that he isn't waiving. So we retain almost half on Nyquist for Leivo whom we don't need. Yeah Nyquist value is more then Leivo. And you're not getting Dotchin for Glendening either. And Daley is worth his contract. No way Holland retains on him.</div></div>

As always I have to disagree with your opinion that Vanek signing with an NTC guarantees he will not waive it. It gives him the power to say yes or no to being traded. If he is presented with a trade to a top contender he will no doubt give it consideration. Saying with 100% certainty that he will not waive I think is a bit naive. I agree that the Leivo for Nyquist with Detroit retaining cap does not make sense at all. I think Glendening for Dotchin is actually a fair trade, although I don't see the point in it from Detroit's standpoint as Detroit has a logjam of defenceman, although a 6'3" right-hand defenceman is intriguing. Daley is not going to get a 2nd round pick, even with salary retained.
Forum: Armchair-GMAug. 30, 2018 at 3:35 p.m.
Thread: Win the Hughes lottery, trade to VAN
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>BStockHockey</b></div><div>I get what your saying here, VAN would have to pay a premium to move up in the draft. If you look at the best prospects at C right now the top of the list IS PETTERSON.... so what sense would it make to trade him for the no.1 pick?? I mean he just won the rookie of the year in the SWE Elite AND he won the playoff MVP for the winning team .... he is playing against men not college boys already .... so you are way off base thinking Petterson would be the price. You may be justified in going after 2 of VAN forward prospects plus their 1st but there is no way TWO TOP 5 PICKS are worth an NON GENERATIONAL player. He may be a top line centre in the league but nowhere is Jack predicted to be a TOP 3-5 in the ENTIRE LEAGUE....

Is he better than : McDavid - NO Crosby - NO Malkin - NO Giroux - NO McKinnon - NO Toews - NO Tavares - NO Bergeron - NO Kopitar - NO Seguin - NO Matthews - NO

Another thing that you are overlooking is his size ... he's 5'10 160lbs ... yes he will be able to add some weight but he wont be able to hang with the big centres in the league ... the NHL season is long and grueling and those 6'2'' 220 plus boys will wear you down .... just imagine him up against Kopitar or Malkin ??</div></div>

I agree that Petterson is currently one of the best center prospects, however, Jack Hughes is a better prospect than Petterson. I absolutely hate the generational player term that gets thrown around so often. Only Crosby and McDavid have been worthy of that title in the last couple decades. I agree with you that Hughes is not currently better than most of the players you listed, but he will be equal to or better than most of them. For me, the height and weight discrepancy get negated when a player has the skating, dynamic hands, and scoring ability that Jack Hughes has; Especially in today's NHL. So it's not an overlook it's a difference in perspective. Also, you wouldn't play Jack Hughes as a defensive center, you would play him in offensive scenarios and have Horvat play the defensive role more. Petterson is also not that big of a player. He currently sits at 6'2" and 165 lbs. He will put on more weight to his frame, but I don't think to the extent that it would really be a difference between the two. So, yes I can imagine Jack Hughes up against Kopitar or Malkin because I don't think the difference is that much between Petterson and Hughes in terms of what you are talking about.

Again I have to point out that for Vancouver to go after Hughes they have to give up a lot. There are really only 3 or 4 players that make sense for Detroit to give Jack Hughes up; Elias Petterson, Olli Juolevi, Michael DiPietro or Thatcher Demko, and Bo Horvat. Detroit does not need forward prospects that are not top 2 centers, so any other forward prospect is not a consideration.

Another trade proposal using Horvat:
Detroit receives Bo Horvat, Michael DiPietro, and VAN 2019 1st round
Vancouver receives DET 2019 1st OA.
Forum: Armchair-GMAug. 30, 2018 at 12:38 p.m.
Thread: Win the Hughes lottery, trade to VAN
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>csick</b></div><div>Franchise centre yes but youre trading a franchise centre and a top 3 pick for a franchise centre. I mean would u trade 2 top 5 picks for a 1st overall?</div></div>

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>BStockHockey</b></div><div>You are still asking too much. They would trade their 2019 1st and a prospect (Dahlen, Lind, Gadjovich) for 1st overall.... that's a top 5 plus a prospect to move up 2-4 spots .... anything more and you're dreaming. We are not talking about the McDavid draft here ... yes he's projected to be no.1 but not projected to be a generational player</div></div>
I think Jack Hughes will be more of a franchise center than Elias Petterson. Is he a McDavid? No, but he is a Matthews or Jack Eichel. He will be a top 3-5 center in the league, the most valuable position.
There is also a lot of assumptions being made here. First that Vancouver wants to get Jack Hughes and second that Vancouver will be in the 3-5 pick range. So if we are assuming that Vancouver wants to pry Jack Hughes from Detroit, it is going to cost them a lot. There needs to be an incentive here for Detroit to make this trade and give up a future top 5 center. <strong>This won't be an even trade</strong>, Vancouver has to give up more pieces for Detroit to even consider this. I understand both your points that trading down 2-4 spots isn't that much, and giving up too much to do so isn't worth the price, but that is the price to get the 1st overall pick and a future top 5 center in Hughes. Petterson has to be included in the trade.
Counter-counter proposal:
Detroit receives Elias Petterson and Vancouver 2019 1st round pick (3-5 spot).
Vancouver receives 1st overall pick (Jack Hughes), 2019 2nd round pick.
OR
Detroit receives Elias Petterson, Michael DiPietro and Vancouver 2019 1st round pick (3-5 spot).
Vancouver receives 1st overall pick (Jack Hughes), 2019 2nd round pick, 2020 2nd round pick.
Forum: Armchair-GMAug. 30, 2018 at 11:13 a.m.
Thread: Win the Hughes lottery, trade to VAN
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>csick</b></div><div>No way haha. Vancouver's first will likely be top 5 maybe even top 3. So to just get Hughes, you're trading 4 of probably you're 5 best prospects? No way that happens. Maybe Dahlen, 2nd, 2019 1st for 1st overall</div></div>

Where are the 4 prospects you're talking about? There are only 3 of them in this trade. Petterson is one of their best prospects, but they still have Boeser, Horvat and Hughes. I don't consider Dahlen to be in the top 5, and Juolevi hasn't really proven anything yet. Are you taking into account Vancouver's 1st pick in 2019?
I agree this trade doesn't happen and that Vancouver would be giving up too much. However, your counter-proposal is way too low for a franchise center. Here would be my counter-proposal:
Det receives Elias Petterson, Michael DiPietro, and 2019 1st round pick.
Vancouver receives Jack Hughes (1st overall pick), and 2019 2nd round pick.