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Another option STL-TOR

Created by: SammyT_51
Team: 2018-19 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Oct. 5, 2018
Published: Oct. 5, 2018
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
STL
  1. Liljegren, Timothy
Additional Details:
Nylander
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2018
2019
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the STL
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the DAL
2020
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the EDM
Logo of the SJS
2021
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
Logo of the TOR
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
23$79,500,000$66,766,666$2,550,000$5,582,500$12,733,334

Roster

Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,250,000$2,250,000
RW, LW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$11,000,000$11,000,000
C, LW
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$6,250,000$6,250,000
LW, C
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$2,850,000$3M)
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the St. Louis Blues
$758,333$758,333 (Performance Bonus$182,500$182K)
RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,500,000$4,500,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$2,100,000$2,100,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$787,500$787,500
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
LW, C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$863,333$863,333
RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD
UFA - 4
Logo of the St. Louis Blues
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,000,000$5,000,000
G
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,050,000$4,050,000
LD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$850,000$850K)
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$675,000$675,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$863,333$863,333
LD/RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$4,500,000$4,500,000
RD
UFA - 6
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$650,000$650,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$5,300,000$5,300,000
RW
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$3,000,000$3,000,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Toronto Maple Leafs
$675,000$675,000
RD
UFA - 2

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Oct. 5, 2018 at 2:29 p.m.
#26
Lets Go Blues
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Joined: Jun. 2016
Posts: 6,775
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Quoting: LoganOllivier
Nylander is 22 and has 2 full seasons of NHL experience under his belt scoring back to back 61 point seasons. In comparison, Kyrou is 20 years old and hasn't made the lineup yet. Could Kyrou become a 61 point player? Sure. Nylander however is already that and his best hockey is still in front of him. He's a star, not a 2nd round pick prospect.

Parayko is a very good defenceman, but he is 25 the middle of his prime. He still has a lot of hockey ahead of him but he's not likely to develop much more than he already has. Liljegren is an unknown but he's 19, an incredible skater and has a very high ceiling.

That alone is enough to make me not really want this trade.

From St Louis's perspective, their defence isn't as amazing as it used to be. Peitrangelo is a Norris calibre defenceman, no doubt. Parayko could be a top pairing guy on a lot of teams, no doubt. But after that, they aren't exactly loaded with high end defenceman. Their forwards are on the older side and their "window" of contention isn't exactly big. (I am not sold on them being anything more than a bubble team) so trading their 2nd best defenseman for a guy who won't likely be ready for a full season or two, seems like a terrible idea.


Not trying to make a huge argument, but the Blues have decided that they don't really believe in an "all-in window". We've quietly rebuilt over the last couple of seasons with the main goal of making the playoffs every year forever (we're not a huge market and that's how we stay in the black). Our older forwards are already being replaced by quality prospects, and we've got a pretty decent young core. It's not as young as, say, Toronto or Winnipeg, but we never went full tank/rebuild so we don't have those knockout, top-10 blue chippers to base the team around (aside from Petro, who's 28 now).

And don't hate on Kyrou. Not his fault he was picked 35th, and it has nothing to do with him as a player. Same as when I hear people write off his OHL MVP because he was D+2... nothing he can do but play his best hockey wherever he is assigned. And he's starting the season with Schwartz and Schenn on our 2nd line. You won't have to call him a "2nd round pick prospect" much longer. (He's also a better skater than Liljegren, had to get that jab in)
Oct. 5, 2018 at 2:33 p.m.
#27
Banned
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Joined: May 2018
Posts: 24,997
Likes: 7,855
Quoting: SammyT_51
Nylander is 22, Liljegren 19 opposite to Kyrou 2 and Parayko 25.. its a difference but if its between 3yr gap i dont think its a problem. Also Defenders peak later than forwards.


That isn't wrong, defenders do take a bit longer before they hit their stride but they also take a lot more punishment than most forwards so they do tend to run into injury issues more once they are over 30 than forwards do.

For the sake of argument let's say Parayko stays at or near the level he is at now till he is 32. The following things are issues that need to be kept in mind.

1) He'll be FA at 29 (4 seasons from now) and if he's the top pair guy, how much money is he going to want and what kind of term?
2) When he is hitting FA, so is Rielly and Kadri, are we going to sign all 3 to big long term deal? Kadri I think will take a shorter term deal and possibly Rielly as well.
3) What kind of a player is he going to be moving into his 30's (there is a very real risk of drop off in those years)

Now what about Liljegren?

1) If he doesn't play 10 NHL games this season, his ELC will slide another year forward meaning he has another 3 years of ELC ahead of him
2) When Parayko is potentially declining, Liljegren is just entering his prime.
3) After his ELC, the team will have far more power in negotiations. (Considering they will have so much tied up with thier star forwards cheaper controllable high potential players are paramount.)

So if we are looking at this from a long term perspective, its not the wisest move.
Oct. 5, 2018 at 2:37 p.m.
#28
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Joined: May 2018
Posts: 24,997
Likes: 7,855
Quoting: Chopper02
Only Toronto's defense gets older. Offense stays young. Defensemen don't hit their prime until age 28-32 so Parayko will grow even more. As a Blues fan i don't do it because they are in a win now mode, but it's a pretty fair deal for both teams. Besides, Nylander has put up 61 points playing with Matthews and company. Can he replicate it with anyone else? Probably, but who knows. Kyrou can just as easily put 60 up with Matthews.


Even you are correct that defencemen hit their prime at 28-32 (Look at the best defenceman over the past decade and most are in their mid 20's) then Parayko is hitting his prime when he hits FA. What kind of contract is that going to be? 8 years and 10 million? No chance I am paying him that kind of money. So he'll go test the market.

For me the age difference is the biggest sticking point, I think if you add a 1st round pick, then its a done deal but I am also 100% positive that ends the deal as well.
Oct. 5, 2018 at 2:41 p.m.
#29
Banned
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Likes: 7,855
Quoting: A_K
Not trying to make a huge argument, but the Blues have decided that they don't really believe in an "all-in window". We've quietly rebuilt over the last couple of seasons with the main goal of making the playoffs every year forever (we're not a huge market and that's how we stay in the black). Our older forwards are already being replaced by quality prospects, and we've got a pretty decent young core. It's not as young as, say, Toronto or Winnipeg, but we never went full tank/rebuild so we don't have those knockout, top-10 blue chippers to base the team around (aside from Petro, who's 28 now).

And don't hate on Kyrou. Not his fault he was picked 35th, and it has nothing to do with him as a player. Same as when I hear people write off his OHL MVP because he was D+2... nothing he can do but play his best hockey wherever he is assigned. And he's starting the season with Schwartz and Schenn on our 2nd line. You won't have to call him a "2nd round pick prospect" much longer. (He's also a better skater than Liljegren, had to get that jab in)


I won't disagree with anything you said here. Sounds all correct to me, nothing I wrote was meant as an indictment of Kyrou, its more that the overall trade creates long term issues that I wouldn't want to deal with. Most people post trades and think about what it does now and the next season but rarely do they think 3, 4, 5, 10 years down the road and in the salary cap world, you really should think that way.
Oct. 5, 2018 at 8:00 p.m.
#30
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Joined: Jan. 2017
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Quoting: LoganOllivier
Even you are correct that defencemen hit their prime at 28-32 (Look at the best defenceman over the past decade and most are in their mid 20's) then Parayko is hitting his prime when he hits FA. What kind of contract is that going to be? 8 years and 10 million? No chance I am paying him that kind of money. So he'll go test the market.

For me the age difference is the biggest sticking point, I think if you add a 1st round pick, then its a done deal but I am also 100% positive that ends the deal as well.


Parayko has 4 years left on his contract. That's plenty of time to be in the winning zone and wont take away from Toronto's window. If I'm Toronto and this offer comes through, I'd be stupid to not take it.
 
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