Apparently the core is staying intact

UFA	YEARS	CAP HIT
Spezza, Jason	1	$750,000
Coleman, Blake	3	$3,750,000
Goodrow, Barclay	2	$1,850,000
Hakanpää, Jani	1	$950,000
Perry, Corey	1	$950,000
Hyman, Zach	5	$4,250,000
Wennberg, Alexander	3	$2,850,000
Glendening, Luke	1	$1,250,000

ROSTER SIZE	SALARY CAP	CAP HIT	OVERAGES	BONUSES	CAP SPACE
21	$81,500,000	$80,666,450	$0	$0	$833,550

Left Wing	Centre	Right Wing
Hyman, Zach $4,250,000$4,250,000 RW, LW UFA - 7	Matthews, Auston $11,640,250$11,640,250 C UFA - 3	Marner, Mitchell $10,903,000$10,903,000 RW UFA - 4
Coleman, Blake $3,750,000$3,750,000 RW, LW UFA - 6	Tavares, John $11,000,000$11,000,000 C, LW NMC UFA - 4	Nylander, William $6,962,366$6,962,366 RW UFA - 3
Goodrow, Barclay $1,850,000$1,850,000 C, LW UFA - 6	Wennberg, Alexander $2,850,000$2,850,000 C UFA - 3	Glendening, Luke $1,250,000$1,250,000 C, RW, LW UFA - 2
Brooks, Adam $725,000$725,000 C UFA - 1	Spezza, Jason $750,000$750,000 C, RW UFA - 1	Perry, Corey $950,000$950,000 RW UFA - 2

Left Defense	Right Defense	Goaltender
Rielly, Morgan $5,000,000$5,000,000 LD NMC UFA - 1	Brodie, TJ $5,000,000$5,000,000 LD/RD NTC UFA - 3
Muzzin, Jake $5,625,000$5,625,000 LD NTC UFA - 3	Holl, Justin $2,000,000$2,000,000 RD M-NTC UFA - 2	Campbell, Jack $1,650,000$1,650,000 G UFA - 1
Sandin, Rasmus $894,167$894,167 LD UFA - 1	Hakanpää, Jani $950,000$950,000 RD UFA - 3	Vanecek, Vitek $716,667$716,667 G UFA - 1

Scratches	Injured Reserve (IR)	Long Term IR (LTIR)
Anderson, Joey $750,000$750,000 RW RFA - 2

Jun. 2, 2021 at 9:43 p.m.

#26

Joined: Apr. 2021

Posts: 190

Likes: 81

Quoting: aadoyle

Washington is a very good comparable as for years they could not either get past round 1 round 2 especially when they faced the penguins and rangers. The team did not have playoff success for a long time and fans started to doubt if they ever would. then in 2018 they got their **** together and won the cup

if we look at Washington before their cup in the last 10 years

2008 (Round 1 lost in 7 to PhI)
2009 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2010 (Round 1 lost in 7 to MTL)
2011 (Round 2 lost in 4 to TMP)
2012 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2013 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2014 (Did not make it)
2015 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2016 (Round 2 lost in 6 to Pit)
2017 (Round 2 lost in 7 to Pit)
2018 (Won in 5 vs. Veg)
2019-2021 (round 1 exits)

so in 10 years they had

1 not make it
4 first round exits in 7 games
1 second round exit in 4 games
1 second round exit in 6 games
and 2 second round exits in 7 games
with a cup in the end

Cool. We can all call it a great success if we chite the bed for the next decade and win ONE cup with this core.

Of course, the biggest issue is the fact that only two players spanned that designated time frame you allude to. So actually, you're proving a team has to keep making changes to win I guess.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 9:43 p.m.

#27

Sign_em_up000000

Joined: Jun. 2019

Posts: 4,002

Likes: 2,584

Quoting: Nylander88

Anyone that thought Nylander was a "playoff dud" was, is, and will always be a hater. That's fine.

2016-17 6 1 3 4 4
2017-18 7 1 3 4 -3
2018-19 7 1 2 3 1
2019-20 5 2 2 4 -3
2020-21 7 5 3 8 3

Career 32 10 13 23 2

Perhaps you're misunderstanding me here, I'm not saying Nylander's bad actually I've went on record here many times stating the opposite. My point was most deemed Nylander a playoff dud prior to this year and he changed the narrative, Marner and Matthews could do the same next year (although I thought AM did very well).

KingSalming21 liked this.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 9:46 p.m.

#28

KingSalming21

Joined: Apr. 2021

Posts: 190

Likes: 81

Quoting: Sign_em_up000000

Perhaps you're misunderstanding me here, I'm not saying Nylander's bad actually I've went on record here many times stating the opposite. My point was most deemed Nylander a playoff dud prior to this year and he changed the narrative, Marner and Matthews could do the same next year (although I thought AM did very well).

Maybe I am.

I admit I'm still not over that collapse. Maybe come training camp I'll be ready to look at our group and get excited again.

Sign_em_up000000 liked this.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 9:52 p.m.

#29

Sign_em_up000000

Joined: Jun. 2019

Posts: 4,002

Likes: 2,584

Quoting: Nylander88

You called him "'mister", like I'm supposed to have some sort of respect for the man. And all that has about as much to with his knowledge of running a hockey club as his player resume you introduced as evidence.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this part.

And yes, I agree, Spezza is awesome. And in the presser today Dubas stated that he and Keefe would have to sit down and discuss bringing him back. That tells you EVERYTHING you need to know about the people running the show here. They have to DISCUSS bringing Spezza, who already said he wants to, come back.

Agree with you here 💯 I couldn't believe he said that about Spezza and that he wasn't even considering a coaching change. This roster needs turnover I just think they backed themselves into a corner when it comes to making changes to the core.

KingSalming21 liked this.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 9:58 p.m.

#30

Sign_em_up000000

Joined: Jun. 2019

Posts: 4,002

Likes: 2,584

Quoting: Nylander88

Maybe I am.

I admit I'm still not over that collapse. Maybe come training camp I'll be ready to look at our group and get excited again.

Understandably so. Like I said I'm frustrated as he'll too, more or less just saying even if we want to see change there's nothing we can do because our FO doesn't agree with us. I can't believe Keefe is coming back after being out coached by an interim rookie coach in the playoffs! He needed to make adjustments and he didn't which is inexcusable and to me is very telling of how he handels pressure situations.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 10:20 p.m.

#31

BigAnderson

Joined: Nov. 2019

Posts: 221

Likes: 64

Quoting: Nylander88

What makes it a bad comparison is saying the Washington Capitals stuck with the same group of players and finally won it. I can find exactly two players that were together for the decade window you reference.

Holtby was there for 7 years when they won, Orlov 6, Carlson 9, Backstrom 11, Ovechkin 12. Kuznetsov and Wilson were both in there 5th. 6 current Leafs have been here for these 5 years and 4 of them were rookies that first surprise year they squeaked in to play the Caps, so it’s still very much a fair comparison

Jun. 2, 2021 at 10:27 p.m.

#32

KingSalming21

Joined: Apr. 2021

Posts: 190

Likes: 81

Quoting: BigAnderson

Holtby was there for 7 years when they won, Orlov 6, Carlson 9, Backstrom 11, Ovechkin 12. Kuznetsov and Wilson were both in there 5th. 6 current Leafs have been here for these 5 years and 4 of them were rookies that first surprise year they squeaked in to play the Caps, so it’s still very much a fair comparison

Then pick one of those years to say it took the core this long. You don't get to say it took a decade when the majority of the team was there five years. It's not a fair comparison to move the goalposts to fit your narrative.

Jun. 2, 2021 at 10:29 p.m.

#33

BigAnderson

Joined: Nov. 2019

Posts: 221

Likes: 64

Quoting: Dekes

Actually caps made it to game 7 and 2 of those years of the second round that’s 7 games farther then toronto has yet. Plus Toronto’s team is much better then what ovi had so that’s also another factor young ovi didnt have 4 all stars on his team like matthews does with, marner, nylander Tavares and Reilly and even muzzin is a solid defencemen probably plays top line for half the league

Tavares has been with the club three years, two of them shortened with covid and wasn’t there for all but 10 minutes of this series. Muzzin has been there for less than 3 seasons.
Young Ovi played with Backstrom, Semin, Mike Green, and Fedorov. They weren’t exactly devoid of talented players

Jun. 2, 2021 at 11:24 p.m.

#34

BigAnderson

Joined: Nov. 2019

Posts: 221

Likes: 64

Quoting: Nylander88

Then pick one of those years to say it took the core this long. You don't get to say it took a decade when the majority of the team was there five years. It's not a fair comparison to move the goalposts to fit your narrative.

Better part of a decade then since you want to argue semantics. It’s not like the Leafs core hasn’t changed over the last five seasons. Current core only been together for three seasons and two have been shortened by covid, Current coaching staff has never had one single full training camp. No one is denying they underperformed expectations but only reason to move one of the big 4 would be to move Marner out because covid screwed up that cap continuing to rise and that’s not that great of a reason just yet

Jun. 2, 2021 at 11:32 p.m.

#35

KingSalming21

Joined: Apr. 2021

Posts: 190

Likes: 81

Quoting: BigAnderson

Better part of a decade then since you want to argue semantics. It’s not like the Leafs core hasn’t changed over the last five seasons. Current core only been together for three seasons and two have been shortened by covid, Current coaching staff has never had one single full training camp. No one is denying they underperformed expectations but only reason to move one of the big 4 would be to move Marner out because covid screwed up that cap continuing to rise and that’s not that great of a reason just yet

3-4 years isn't "semantics", champ.

But you keep using this as some example as to why this collection of overpaid, no-heart players need coddling and more chances.

jUst wAIt UntiLNExT yEAr!!!!

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:22 a.m.

#36

BigAnderson

Joined: Nov. 2019

Posts: 221

Likes: 64

Quoting: Nylander88

3-4 years isn't "semantics", champ.

But you keep using this as some example as to why this collection of overpaid, no-heart players need coddling and more chances.

jUst wAIt UntiLNExT yEAr!!!!

You should just root for Buffalo then if you want to blow it up with new management, coaches, and players every 3 years. Reality is the first two years of this 5 year run of first round exits they overachieved, year 3 they pushed Boston to 7 without Kadri lost and Boston cruised to the finals before they were challenged by another team, last year they were bad and made coaching change mid season then covid flipped everything. This year they underachieved majorly by losing to Montreal but it still wasn’t a normal year or situation. It’s way too early to give up on this core group of forwards, unless someone comes with a can’t pass up offer.

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:27 a.m.

#37

DartGuy86

backcheck>paycheck

Joined: Oct. 2020

Posts: 416

Likes: 194

Quoting: Nylander88

That's because Shanahan/Dubas are either stupid or stubborn like the idiot coach that didn't lift a finger to turn around an anemic power-play that lasted for weeks.

*months

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:28 a.m.

#38

DartGuy86

backcheck>paycheck

Joined: Oct. 2020

Posts: 416

Likes: 194

All I know is my favourite childhood team, The Seattle Kraken, are selecting 2nd overall in the entry draft, and I'm pretty excited about it.

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:39 a.m.

#39

DartGuy86

backcheck>paycheck

Joined: Oct. 2020

Posts: 416

Likes: 194

Quoting: aadoyle

Washington is a very good comparable as for years they could not either get past round 1 round 2 especially when they faced the penguins and rangers. The team did not have playoff success for a long time and fans started to doubt if they ever would. then in 2018 they got their **** together and won the cup

if we look at Washington before their cup in the last 10 years

2008 (Round 1 lost in 7 to PhI)
2009 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2010 (Round 1 lost in 7 to MTL)
2011 (Round 2 lost in 4 to TMP)
2012 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2013 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2014 (Did not make it)
2015 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2016 (Round 2 lost in 6 to Pit)
2017 (Round 2 lost in 7 to Pit)
2018 (Won in 5 vs. Veg)
2019-2021 (round 1 exits)

so in 10 years they had

1 not make it
4 first round exits in 7 games
1 second round exit in 4 games
1 second round exit in 6 games
and 2 second round exits in 7 games
with a cup in the end

and in most of those years Ovechkin was scoring 50 goals a season

This is a great reminder, but at the same time, Their stars were still producing. Ovi's career playoff numbers are great, and 2012-13 was the only year he really underperformed. Lifetime he's got 135 points in 141 playoff games, 71 of them are goals. If the Leafs lost in 7 while Marner and Matthews were producing, we aren't having the same conversation, but you can't go quiet in the playoffs when you demanded 11mil per season in the loudest, most cynical hockey market in the universe. If you didn't realize the pressure that contract was going to put on you, you need to fire your agent and donate that **** to charity until you've earned it. They lost to a team that had 18pts less than they did in a shortened season, and they blew a 3-1 series lead. Screw these guys, #gokraken

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:54 a.m.

#40

Dekes

Dekesaladekes

Joined: May 2021

Posts: 3,020

Likes: 1,082

Quoting: BigAnderson

Tavares has been with the club three years, two of them shortened with covid and wasn’t there for all but 10 minutes of this series. Muzzin has been there for less than 3 seasons.
Young Ovi played with Backstrom, Semin, Mike Green, and Fedorov. They weren’t exactly devoid of talented players

i can agree with backstrom and green and semin but fedorov came to washington for the last 2 years of his career, he wasnt a star no more he was 38 then. But like comparison Matthews= Ovi similiar players, Marner>semin green=reilly both offensive dmen tavares> backstrom tavares is an experienced vet with a good 2 way game, backstrom was very young not as developed all around as he is today, Nylander> fedorov nylander out played him by a mile nylander was a young stud and fedorov was old and not as skilled as he once was. Now toronto also has muzzin, brodie, holl who are all top 4 dmen add along hyman, kerfoot, kapanen, johnsson, foligno through the years who all were very solid forwards. Toronto's team's through the last few year have been arguably some of the best teams not to make it out of the first round, not to mention 5 years in a row

Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:57 a.m.

#41

Dekes

Dekesaladekes

Joined: May 2021

Posts: 3,020

Likes: 1,082

Quoting: aadoyle

Washington is a very good comparable as for years they could not either get past round 1 round 2 especially when they faced the penguins and rangers. The team did not have playoff success for a long time and fans started to doubt if they ever would. then in 2018 they got their **** together and won the cup

if we look at Washington before their cup in the last 10 years

2008 (Round 1 lost in 7 to PhI)
2009 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2010 (Round 1 lost in 7 to MTL)
2011 (Round 2 lost in 4 to TMP)
2012 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2013 (Round 1 lost in 7 to NYR)
2014 (Did not make it)
2015 (Round 2 lost in 7 to NYR)
2016 (Round 2 lost in 6 to Pit)
2017 (Round 2 lost in 7 to Pit)
2018 (Won in 5 vs. Veg)
2019-2021 (round 1 exits)

so in 10 years they had

1 not make it
4 first round exits in 7 games
1 second round exit in 4 games
1 second round exit in 6 games
and 2 second round exits in 7 games
with a cup in the end

and in most of those years Ovechkin was scoring 50 goals a season

okay but even in those first 5 years toronto still made it to the second rd which is something toronto still hasnt done. I understand the loses against boston, bruins were an experience team with a core that has played together for a long time but columbus and montreal thats just embarrasing

DartGuy86 liked this.

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