Forums/Armchair-GM

Pens Blackhawks MAF trade

Created by: LetsGoPens69
Initial Creation Date: Oct 27, 2021
Published: Oct 27 at 1:29
Team: 2021-22 Pittsburgh Penguins
Team Explanation
For the Pens to take on MAF, even at 50% retention, they would need to move a contract in return.

And Chicago can flip Zucker to a contender at the TD at 4.5M per, trade him in the offseason or keep him(his contract expires after next season) and if they arnt contending next season, trade him as a rental.

They can also flip DeSmith to a contender. His contract is expiring and either way, they will get the cap space this offseason.

Pens move Riikola, Ruhwedel and Lafferty to the AHL if they clear waivers and they’d be under the cap and at the 23 man limit.
Trades
1.
PIT
  1. Fleury, Marc-André ($3,500,000 retained)
  2. Gustafsson, Erik
CHI
  1. Zucker, Jason ($1,000,000 retained)
  2. DeSmith, Casey
  3. Gruden, Jonathan
  4. 2022 5th round pick (PIT)
Additional Details:
Zucker’s contract becomes 4.5M for the rest of this season and next season.
Buyouts
  • Jack Johnson: $1,166,667
Retained Salary Transactions
  • Jason Zucker: $1,000,000 (18.18%)
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2022
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
2023
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
TOR
2024
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
PIT
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
26$81,500,000$82,728,206$0$850,000-$1,228,206
Left WingCenterRight Wing
PIT
Guentzel, Jake
$6,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
PIT
Crosby, Sidney
$8,700,000
C
NMC
UFA - 4
PIT
Rust, Bryan
$3,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
PIT
Heinen, Danton
$1,100,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
PIT
Malkin, Evgeni
$9,500,000
C
NMC
UFA - 1
PIT
Kapanen, Kasperi
$3,200,000
RW
RFA - 1
PIT
O'Connor, Drew
$925,000
LW
RFA - 1
PIT
Carter, Jeff
$2,636,364
C, RW
UFA - 1
PIT
Rodrigues, Evan
$1,000,000
RW, C
UFA - 1
PIT
Aston-Reese, Zach
$1,725,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
PIT
Blueger, Teddy
$2,200,000
C, LW
UFA - 2
PIT
McGinn, Brock
$2,750,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
PIT
Dumoulin, Brian
$4,100,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 2
PIT
Letang, Kris
$7,250,000
RD
NMC NTC
UFA - 1
PIT
Jarry, Tristan
$3,500,000
G
UFA - 2
PIT
Pettersson, Marcus
$4,025,175
LD
UFA - 4
PIT
Marino, John
$4,400,000
RD
UFA - 6
CHI
Fleury, Marc-André
$3,500,000
G
NTC
UFA - 1
PIT
Matheson, Michael
$4,875,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 5
CHI
Gustafsson, Erik
$800,000
LD/RD
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
PIT
Lafferty, Sam
$750,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
PIT
Boyle, Brian
$750,000
LW, C
UFA - 1
PIT
Simon, Dominik
$750,000
RW, LW
UFA - 1
PIT
Riikola, Juuso
$1,150,000
LD
UFA - 1
PIT
Ruhwedel, Chad
$750,000
RD
UFA - 1
PIT
Friedman, Mark
$725,000
RD
RFA - 1

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Oct 27 at 1:32
#1
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,582
Likes: 4,696
Chicago could probably do better moving Flowers to someone willing to give Chicago something interesting. Zucker doesn't have much value to a team not contending and DeSmith is a rental that isn't worth anything to team not contending. If Pens want Flowers, which makes sense, they will have to find somewhere else to move Zucker or give something of value such as a 2nd round pick, prospect or younger player.
LetsGoPens69 and Wadejos123 liked this.
Oct 27 at 1:41
#2
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 372
Edited Oct 27 at 1:55
Quoting: ChiHawk
Chicago could probably do better moving Flowers to someone willing to give Chicago something interesting. Zucker doesn't have much value to a team not contending and DeSmith is a rental that isn't worth anything to team not contending. If Pens want Flowers, which makes sense, they will have to find somewhere else to move Zucker or give something of value such as a 2nd round pick, prospect or younger player.


Ya, i agree. If u read the description. The Pens can’t take MAF without moving a contract back. Even at 50% retention.

So all these ACGM with Chicago trading MAF to the Pens for draft picks won’t work without the Pens moving a contract out too.

And like the description said, the Blackhawks can try and flip Zucker at 4.5M to a contender at the TD, trade him in the offseason, or keep him and if they arnt contending next season, trade him at the deadline.

And flip DeSmith to a contender too. Getting a 3rd team involved might be a better option though. A lot of injured goalies so far this season; between Colorado, Edmonton, Calgary, etc.

But like I said in the description, either way, DeSmith’s contract is expiring and Blackhawks atleast gain that cap space this offseason.

I added Gruden and a 5th for Gustafsson(rental). But again, like I said, in my opinion, Zucker at 4.5M should be able to be flipped to a contender at the TD, this offseason, or next season if the Hawks arnt contending for atleast a 2nd round pick.
Oct 27 at 1:51
#3
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,582
Likes: 4,696
Quoting: LetsGoPens69
Ya, i agree. If u read the description. The Pens can’t take MAF without moving a contract back. Even at 50% retention. So all these ACGM with Chicago trading MAF to the Pens for draft picks won’t work without the Pens moving a contract out too.

And like the description said, the Blackhawks can try and flip Zucker at 4.5M to a contender at the TD, trade him in the offseason, or keep him and if they arnt contending next season, trade him at the deadline.

And flip DeSmith to a contender too. Getting a 3rd team involved might be a better option.

But like I said in the description, either way, DeSmith’s contract is expiring and Blackhawks atleast gain that cap space this offseason.

I added Gruden and a 5th for Gustafson(rental). But like I said, in my opinion, Zucker at 4.5M should be able to be flipped to a contender at the TD, this offseason, or next season if the Hawks arnt contending for atleast a 2nd round pick.


I did read the description and also understand the cap situation, but one trade doesn't have exist on it's own. Multiple trades can happen for the pens. The bottom line, the Hawks aren't getting anything of real value here and no, the Hawks aren't relieving cap space in this trade, they are taking on more going into next season.

Hawks don't need to flip anyone is my point, you basically are suggesting the Hawks don't have options at the TDL with only the Pens wanting Flowers and as such take on the responsibility of moving cap for the Pens; I don't buy that. Flowers is marketable as an asset to a playoff contender and Hawks will get offers that amount to a 2nd round pick or better and maybe have to take on an expiring contract but not additive cap beyond the season unless they see the player coming back having on ice value for the team. I can't see that with Zucker going on 30 years old for a Hawks team in complete meltdown mode and the Hawks up against the cap next year; Zucker at $4.5M is just not a luxury they can afford.

A 3 team trade may be doable but again, Hawks would expect to get a 2nd or better back for Flowers without taking on additive cap beyond the current season.
Oct 27 at 1:55
#4
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 372
Edited Oct 27 at 2:01
Quoting: ChiHawk
I did read the description and also understand the cap situation, but one trade doesn't have exist on it's own. Multiple trades can happen for the pens. The bottom line, the Hawks aren't getting anything of real value here and no, the Hawks aren't relieving cap space in this trade, they are taking on more going into next season.

Hawks don't need to flip anyone is my point, you basically are suggesting the Hawks don't have options at the TDL with only the Pens wanting Flowers and as such take on the responsibility of moving cap for the Pens; I don't buy that. Flowers is marketable as an asset to a playoff contender and Hawks will get offers that amount to a 2nd round pick or better and maybe have to take on an expiring contract but not additive cap beyond the season unless they see the player coming back having on ice value for the team. I can't see that with Zucker going on 30 years old for a Hawks team in complete meltdown mode and the Hawks up against the cap next year; Zucker at $4.5M is just not a luxury they can afford.

A 3 team trade may be doable but again, Hawks would expect to get a 2nd or better back for Flowers without taking on additive cap beyond the current season.


MAF has a NTC too, remember.?? So moving MAF to just any team, for something interesting(like u said) isn’t likely unless he’s ok with it(or the teams on his list).

So moving cap to accommodate the Pens and MAF’s NTC might be their only or best option. The Hawks getting value for Zucker(who has no trade restrictions) at 4.5M might be win/win.

Or just let MAF walk/retire this offseason and get the cap relief would actually be a win too. It’s a big contract off the books.
Oct 27 at 1:59
#5
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,582
Likes: 4,696
Quoting: LetsGoPens69
MAF has a NTC too, remember.?? So moving MAF to just any team, for something interesting(like u said) isn’t likely unless he’s ok with it(or the teams on his list). So getting Zucker at 4.5M might be win.

Or just let him walk/retire this offseason and get the cap relief would actually be a win too. It’s a big contract off the books.


Well his contract comes off the books anyway which was always the plan as the Hawks are headed into cap trouble next offseason. Which again, is why the Hawks can't take on $4.5M with the risk of it carrying over to next season. Flowers does have a NTC but I'm sure he would waive for Vegas (Lehner could get injured), Pens and maybe MTL (hometown if they surprise everyone and make it) or even Toronto. I'm sure he's got a list but it's probably not just the Pens.
LetsGoPens69 liked this.
Oct 27 at 2:03
#6
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 372
Quoting: ChiHawk
Well his contract comes off the books anyway which was always the plan as the Hawks are headed into cap trouble next offseason. Which again, is why the Hawks can't take on $4.5M with the risk of it carrying over to next season. Flowers does have a NTC but I'm sure he would waive for Vegas (Lehner could get injured), Pens and maybe MTL (hometown if they surprise everyone and make it) or even Toronto. I'm sure he's got a list but it's probably not just the Pens.


Sure, like I said, it’s a big contract off the books. I doubt he goes to Toronto or anywhere in Canada. Move his family from the states during this time. I doubt it. But maybe. I obviously have no clue what teams are on his list.

And Yes, I’m sure he’d be open to Vegas. But could Vegas fit him under the cap without moving out a contract too. Will be interesting at least to see if he moves and what for.

And anything can happen in the 1st 10 games of an NHL season. I wouldn’t say the sky is falling in Chicago just yet either.
Oct 27 at 2:14
#7
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,582
Likes: 4,696
Quoting: LetsGoPens69
Sure, like I said, it’s a big contract off the books. I doubt he goes to Toronto or anywhere in Canada. Move his family from the states during this time. I doubt it. But maybe. I obviously have no clue what teams are on his list.

And Yes, I’m sure he’d be open to Vegas. But could Vegas fit him under the cap without moving out a contract too. Will be interesting at least to see if he moves and what for.

And anything can happen in the 1st 10 games of an NHL season. I wouldn’t say the sky is falling in Chicago just yet either.


It's pretty bad in Chicago right now especially with the added issues off the ice coming out today and basically most of the front office fired. I'm on board with the Hawks moving any of the older players out including Toews, Kane, Fleury, etc. bringing in a new coach and rebuilding from scratch. This team has been mismanaged since Bowman took over. Mike Smith and Tallon built the core of the cup winning team that became arguably the best team of last decade, Bowman inherited it. Since 2017, when it was clear the Hawks needed to either rebuild or a major retooling, Bowman continued to grasp on to playoff dreams and a cup trying to retool with washed up vets. He was a horrible GM (see the Panarin trade, Teuvo trade, S Jones trade, etc.) and his inability to force to the organization to deal with sexual assault issue just further demonstrates that.
LetsGoPens69 liked this.
Oct 27 at 2:56
#8
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 372
Edited Oct 27 at 3:32
Quoting: ChiHawk
It's pretty bad in Chicago right now especially with the added issues off the ice coming out today and basically most of the front office fired. I'm on board with the Hawks moving any of the older players out including Toews, Kane, Fleury, etc. bringing in a new coach and rebuilding from scratch. This team has been mismanaged since Bowman took over. Mike Smith and Tallon built the core of the cup winning team that became arguably the best team of last decade, Bowman inherited it. Since 2017, when it was clear the Hawks needed to either rebuild or a major retooling, Bowman continued to grasp on to playoff dreams and a cup trying to retool with washed up vets. He was a horrible GM (see the Panarin trade, Teuvo trade, S Jones trade, etc.) and his inability to force to the organization to deal with sexual assault issue just further demonstrates that.


All seems legit and logical to me. Except arguably the best team of the last decade. Lol. I’d have to disagree there. Pens won 3 SC’s and missed the play-offs once in the last 15 years(lost in the play-in round in 19-20).

Although I will say Chicago prospect system is in much better shape. With Reichel and Dach alone. Plus the other Dach brother, Drew Commesso, Vlasic and the D-man they drafted early this year. Not a fan of the Seth Jones contract either though.

Luckily Pens have all their top picks for upcoming years. And Hextall/Burke seem adamant about restocking the system with “their type of players”. And not trading away top picks.

They would not move that 2nd round pick last year. Rumors were everywhere with teams asking for the 2nd round pick in return in trade talks and they didn’t move it.

And Tristan Broz was ranked as a late 1st round pick(ranked from 27-32 in most rankings). So getting him in the 2nd was a win I guess.

The player comp I saw was Kyle Connor. Which would obviously be great. But long ways off still; only 18. But 6’1-180 pounds is decent size for an 18 year old.

Although all those “prospect rankings” and “system rankings” and “winning the draft” every year is all speculative and indefinite. But making the play-offs and winning is definite and concrete.
Oct 27 at 10:35
#9
arky
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 4,244
Likes: 2,235
My biggest problem with Zucker if he gets hurt or does not play well in Chicago it does not allow the Hawks to get any value or any value at all if hurt. I agree that a better option is picks not a player with a hefty contract and Hawks could get burned while they trying to rebuild.
LetsGoPens69 liked this.
Oct 27 at 10:44
#10
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 372
Edited Oct 27 at 10:59
Quoting: mikearky
My biggest problem with Zucker if he gets hurt or does not play well in Chicago it does not allow the Hawks to get any value or any value at all if hurt. I agree that a better option is picks not a player with a hefty contract and Hawks could get burned while they trying to rebuild.


Ya, sure, that would be a risk with any player they would get in return.

The problem is MAF’s no trade clause. Accommodating Pittsburgh by taking a contract back might be their best option. Could be a win/win, especially if Pens are willing to retain.

Either way, chances of this happening are .000000000001% anyways.

It was just my response to all the ACGM’s from Hawks fans trading MAF to the Pens and just getting draft picks back in return.

It’s not possible, even retaining 50% salary. Unless they move a contract back, get a 3rd team involved, or make a trade with another organization prior.

But again, just letting MAF walk in the offseason would also be a win. That’s a big contract coming off the books. A lot of cap relief either way.

And also, Zucker has played full seasons in his last 6 seasons besides last season. (60 games in 19-20 shortened season b/ween the Pens and the Wild, 81 games in 18-19. 82 games in 17-18. 79 in 16-17, and 71 games in 15-16).

Basically full seasons in his last 6 of 7 seasons. I wouldnt exactly say he’s an injury prone player. And still just 29 years old.
 
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