You're still right, they're going to lose someone, and you're right, Fowler would be a good guy to go after...but you're still making the mistake of thinking that quantity will get you quality. You're throwing 3 B- or C prospects plus a second round pick (Likely also a B-/C prospect) for a top pairing dman. It's not enough. Again, if the Leafs make this offer, there's 29 other teams that will offer more.

Everyone seems to be giving Hyman more credit than he deserves.

What I'm giving them is 4 controllable assets as they need young guys with control. They already have $71M committed next year. 3 B level prospects and a 2nd round pick isn't a slouch of an offer for ONE player who will want in excess of $6M in 2 years which they won't be able to afford.

Tell me who would give up more and who has more when the Leafs have one of the best farm systems. As well I'm giving them 3 young FORWARDS, they don't need defense. I'm giving them 3 forwards who could be 2nd/3rd liners. They already have all their first line forwards locked up for a few years.

I'm not sure why they won't be able to afford it? Ritchie is the only fwd that isn't locked up long term? Bieksa and Stoner are both UFA's after next season which clears up over 7 million in cap room.

If you think about it, the Leafs actually don't have one of the best farm systems any more. They graduated all of their top prospects and are left with a bunch of so-so prospects.

Bob Murray is one of the best GM's in the NHL. He's not an idiot.

Who offers more? Everyone.

Again, throw in another person.

You're thinking 2 years from now but they can't afford what they have right now for next year, so how do you get past that? They have $2M of cap space for 2 forwards and a backup goalie. Go for it.

...Plus the $6.9ish million that they have by putting both Depres and Stoner, neither of whom will likely ever play again, on LTIR.

They've also already got a handful of cheap, young B/C guys that can come up: Kerdiles, Kossila, Sorensen, Etem, Kase, etc, not to mention Sam Steel, who absolutely raked in Regina this year, or Max Jones.

You're weakening a contending teams roster significantly, and filling none of their holes.

Edit: I'm not saying that they aren't going to move one of their defencemen. What I'm saying is that they aren't going to go out take a garbage offer just to move a guy.

ANA passes on that trade. there would be 29 other teams with better offers than that for Fowler. Yeah you say the Ducks have $71M but they only need to fill 3 roster spots at most but they will probably carry 22 players for a lot of the year like they did this season. Also, they don't need controllable guys when Jones, steel, etc are all better than what you are giving up and they are in win now mode - not 5 years from now. AND LASTLY, you're forgetting that they are losing someone to Vegas and that person has a cap hit of over $2M at a minimum. So in reality we are looking at $4M for three roster spots - that's two ELCs (Etem/Kase) both under 700k and then the rest is for a backup goalie. You did the math wrong so stop trying to argue it lol. When need to put a paragraph on why the Ducks should take the deal then you're already going down the wrong path.

Edit: I'm not saying that they aren't going to move one of their defencemen. What I'm saying is that they aren't going to go out take a garbage offer just to move a guy.

This is a good point. They could move Vatanen, dump(for lack of a better word) 4.875 mil and still have Fowler, Lindholm, Theodore, Montour, Manson and any other defensmen. The Ducks trading Fowler is a possibility, but they could also resign Fowler and trade Theodore in a year or two as well which gives the Ducks all the leverage. I feel like a good starting point for Fowler would be Kapanen and a 1st.

So who do the Ducks lose? If not a d-man then they lose Silfverberg your 2nd highest goal scorer from this past year. You will replace them with 2 ELCs and who? Eaves is also a free agent. He had 11 goals. That's 34 goals I have taken out of your lineup. The 3 that I say will give you just the 22. So you will lose $3.75M on the cap if you don't trade one of the other d-men or you just lose a d-man and have cap room but end up weaker. What I am giving up is 3 players where all 3 are controllable and cheaper and make up for what you will lose.

So you will end up losing one current guy let's call it Fowler for nothing. So you will now need 1 dman, 2 forwards and a backup goalie and will have $6M to do it with. Yeah you will have enough money but you're not going to get anything on the market which means all internal rookies who haven't proved anything at the NHL level.

So you get rid of Vatanen. You will still have $44M tied up of your cap to just 7 players. You now need another 15 at just $30M, good luck getting a winner together knowing that 4 of the guys you have to sign are Fowler, Montour, Theodore and Manson. I've pretty much capped you out.

What would the trade have to be to get Cam Fowler. Anyone? Nylander, Marner, Auston, Reilly, Zaitsev and Gardiner are all off the table.

I'm still not sure where you're getting that they're going to lose Fowler for nothing? Nobody here has said that they aren't going to trade someone, we've all just said that your trade is garbage. For some reason you can't seem to grasp that.

So tell me a trade that makes sense that gets one of the d-men out of Anaheim. The Ducks cap prospects going forward are poor at best.

the Ducks have zero motive to move Fowler unless it's for Nylander or Marner honestly. Maybe a deal revolving around Kapanen but even then it's probably a stretch unless you ar ewilling to pay more than the Leafs would like. You could probably do nylander for Fowler straight up or Kapanen and a pick for Vatanen otherwise the Ducks will be moving one of them for an established forward like Duchene, Johannson, etc. in another one for one swap that makes sense for them to compete now.

I could see the Ducks giving up a 1st to Vegas before taking that package back for Fowler/Vatanen. Yeah 3 guys could contribute 20 goals but why not get one guy that can contribute that by himself. The other question you ask is what would it take? I personally wouldn't do it unless its Marner or Nylander - zero interest in the defenseman that are off the table and obviously Matthews is out. No interest in JVR. it's going to be one of the young forwards or they are just going to find a different trade partner. Plenty of teams need top-4 defenseman and have na abundance of forwards - WPG, COL, MTL, ARZ, BUF, TBL, DAL, etc. I'd rather do Fowler for Ehlers, or Vatanen for Reinhart before I'd do that trade above. Even Vatanen and a pick for Duchene would make more sense if they lose Silfverberg or Vermette.

I would take Vatanen. Just didn't think they would give him up since they are the same age and Fowler is going to cost a lot more. Vatanen will never be worth more than $5M/year so it's fine. I have a cost controlled blue line of Reiley, Gardiner, Vatanen and Zaitsev at under $20M. As a Leaf fan, I win.

They aren't taking Fowler for that junk. Offer something of value first. Here ANA, take a bunch of quality pieces and we'll take the quality. LOL

I'm giving them 3 cost controlled forwards and a 2nd round pick for 1 player. What I am trying to do is keep them a contender for the next couple of years.

They can't keep everything because of their cap situation and only have $2M to sign 3 players.

They will still get a better offer for him. He's a top 4 defenseman. 29 other teams would beat this deal with ease.

No they won't because these are 3 guys who are ready for NHL action. Most will give up guys who aren't ready for the NHL. They're all guys with the potential to be second line forwards.

Lmfao. Yes they will. Get out of LaLaLeaf land if you don't think there are teams out there that wouldn't beat this deal with ease.

Your deal for the Bruins is better true, but it cripples you going forward. There wouldn't be anything you could sign long term because you have too many long term cap hits.

I'm not even talking about the Bruins. Plenty of teams would beat this. Teams don't want crap for quality.

You have to remember, you can only trade them YOUNG players since they are capped out and they have to be controllable for a while because they will be capped out for a few years.