Why Dont We All Be A Team

Forums/Armchair-GM

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Created by: CoachCoach

Team: 2022-23 Detroit Red Wings

Initial Creation Date: Nov. 17, 2022

Published: Nov. 17, 2022

Salary Cap Mode: Basic

Description

CAP FRIENDLY TRADE: See a lot of Horvat/Miller discussion, thought I would dabble. Obviously something like this would never happen because this isn't a video game. However if it did happen, anarchy!

- Detroit gives VAN big Ras who is a local kid who has improved every season. 23 with RFA status. Detroit also gives VAN prospect Donovan Sebrango who performed well at the WJC and has been getting developed nicely in the AHL. Andreasson looked to be a big move this summer before SY pulled out the wallet. Looks great as a rookie in the AHL. Could be swapped out for another center/forward prospect (not named Kasper), just thought maybe VAN would like a younger NHL ready guy who is viewed as a prospect. The 2023 2nd is the higher of the two teams (STL or Detroit), and a 2024 1st.
- Detroit sends TOR Tyler Bertuzzi at 50% retention, Adam Erne as a Swiss knife in their bottom to middle 6, and Oesterle who looks to be doing well now that he is a bottom pairing D. The Wings also send out their 2024 3rd (via DAL).

In exchange, VAN sends the Wings Bo Horvat (retention or not). Horvat agrees to a 6-8 year extension for the money otherwise used for Bert.

In exchange, TOR sends the Wings their 5.5M in cap with Kerfoot and Holl, along with prospect Matthew Knies.

- VAN ships out J.T. Miller (50% retention), Luke Schenn, and a 2023 4th to TOR in exchange for Pierre Engvall (cap purposes), Nicholas Robertson, a 2023 1st, and 2024 2nd.

- TOR sends out all the favorites. Kerfoot replaced by Miller, Robertson replaced by Bertuzzi, Holl replaced by Schenn and Oesterle, and Engvall replaced by Erne. Cost of shedding cap and the upgrades is a 2023 1st, 2024 2nd, and Matthew Knies.

After the smoke settles, this is how it looks:

Detroit additions: Horvat, Knies, Kerfoot, Holl
Detroit subtractions: Ras, Sebrango, Andreasson, Erne, Oesterle, 2023 2nd, 2024 1st, 2024 4th

Vancouver additions: Ras, Sebrango, Andreasson, Robertson, Engvall, 2023 1st (TOR), 2024 1st (DET), 2023 (DET or STL), 2024 2nd (TOR)
Vancouver subtractions: J.T. Miller (50%), Horvat, Schenn, 2023 4th

Toronto additions: Bertuzzi (50%), Miller (50%), Schenn, Erne, Oesterle, 2023 4th (VAN), 2024 4th (DET)
Toronto subtractions: Kerfoot, Holl, Engvall, Robertson, Knies, 2023 1st, 2024 2nd

Trades

DET

Horvat, Bo
Miller, J.T. ($2,625,000 retained)
Schenn, Luke
2023 4th round pick (NYR)

VAN

DET

Engvall, Pierre
Holl, Justin
Kerfoot, Alexander
Knies, Matthew [Reserve List]
Robertson, Nicholas
2023 1st round pick (TOR)
2024 2nd round pick (TOR)

TOR

Bertuzzi, Tyler ($2,375,000 retained)
Erne, Adam
Miller, J.T.
Oesterle, Jordan
Schenn, Luke
2023 4th round pick (NYR)
2024 4th round pick (DAL)

DET

VAN

Engvall, Pierre
Robertson, Nicholas
2023 1st round pick (TOR)
2024 1st round pick (DET)
2024 2nd round pick (TOR)

Buyouts

Justin Abdelkader: $2,305,556
Frans Nielsen: $500,000

Retained Salary Transactions

Richard Pánik: $1,375,000 (50%)
Tyler Bertuzzi: $2,375,000 (100%)

Draft	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5	Round 6	Round 7
2023
2024
2025

ROSTER

LONG-TERM OUTLOOK

EMBED

TEXT-EMBED

ROSTER SIZE	SALARY CAP	CAP HIT	OVERAGES	BONUSES	CAP SPACE
23	$82,500,000	$76,428,889	$0	$3,857,500	$6,071,111

Left Wing	Centre	Right Wing
Kubalik, Dominik $2,500,000$2,500,000 LW, RW UFA - 2	Larkin, Dylan $6,100,000$6,100,000 C NTC UFA - 1	Raymond, Lucas $925,000$925,000 ($2,500,000$2M) RW, LW RFA - 2
Copp, Andrew $5,625,000$5,625,000 C, LW, RW M-NTC UFA - 5	Horvat, Bo $4,125,000$4,125,000 C UFA - 1	Perron, David $4,750,000$4,750,000 RW, LW M-NTC UFA - 2
Kerfoot, Alexander $3,500,000$3,500,000 LW, C, RW M-NTC UFA - 1	Suter, Pius $3,250,000$3,250,000 C, LW UFA - 1	Berggren, Jonatan $925,000$925,000 RW, LW RFA - 2
Smith, Givani $750,000$750,000 LW, RW UFA - 1	Veleno, Joseph $894,167$894,167 ($425,000$425K) C RFA - 1	Sundqvist, Oskar $2,750,000$2,750,000 RW, C UFA - 1

Left Defense	Right Defense	Goaltender
Chiarot, Ben $4,750,000$4,750,000 LD/RD M-NTC UFA - 4	Seider, Moritz $863,333$863,333 ($850,000$850K) RD RFA - 2	Husso, Ville $4,750,000$4,750,000 G M-NTC UFA - 3
Määttä, Olli $2,250,000$2,250,000 LD UFA - 1	Hronek, Filip $4,400,000$4,400,000 RD RFA - 2	Nedeljkovic, Alex $3,000,000$3,000,000 G UFA - 1
	Lindström, Gustav $850,000$850,000 RD RFA - 1
Walman, Jake $1,050,000$1,050,000 LD UFA - 1

Scratches	Injured Reserve (IR)	Long Term IR (LTIR)
Czarnik, Austin $762,500$762,500 C, RW UFA - 2	Fabbri, Robby $4,000,000$4,000,000 LW UFA - 3	Vrána, Jakub $2,625,000$2,625,000 LW UFA - 2
Hägg, Robert $800,000$800,000 LD UFA - 1	Zadina, Filip $1,825,000$1,825,000 RW, LW RFA - 3
Holl, Justin $2,000,000$2,000,000 RD M-NTC UFA - 1	Söderblom, Elmer $878,333$878,333 ($82,500$82K) LW, C RFA - 3
	Pysyk, Mark $850,000$850,000 RD UFA - 1
	Luff, Matt $750,000$750,000 RW UFA - 1

Nov. 17, 2022 at 4:50 p.m.

DeadWingsv2

PlusMinus is stupid

Joined: May 2018

Posts: 7,319

Likes: 7,154

yuck

Nov. 17, 2022 at 4:53 p.m.

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: DeadWingsv2

yuck

Haha yes it is

Nov. 17, 2022 at 4:55 p.m.

dannibalcorpse

we miss leo k

Joined: Feb. 2018

Posts: 6,014

Likes: 5,131

i mean, i love the chaos, but I think JT Miller is probably the most unmovable part of this deal. That extension might be a little heavy for Toronto going forward - even with the cap going up.

Nov. 17, 2022 at 5:08 p.m.

MoSeider53

Future Norris guy

Joined: Aug. 2022

Posts: 15,605

Likes: 8,625

Is this a freaking joke?

The first trade is brutal for Vancouver, And the 2nd trade is brutal for Detroit.

Detroit gives up tons of pieces for basically Horvat and Knies what a joke.

Vancouver trade, Detroit trades Rasmussen+Sebrango+Andreasson+St Louis 2023 2nd round pick Detroit gets back in return Miller @ 2,625,000+Horvat+Schenn+Rangers 2023 4th round pick. Ask me why Vancouver would ever consider this.

Toronto trade Detroit gets Engval+Holl+Kerfoot+Knies+Robertson+Tor 2023 1st round pick+TOR 2024 2nd round pick and Toronto gets Bertuzzi @ $2,375,000+Miller+Oesterle+Schenn+Erne+2023 ranger 4th round pick+2023 Dallas 4th round pick. So basically Detroit only gets Holl and Knies out of the whole deal. Pretty bad for Detroit.

And Vancouver gets Engval+Robertson+2 1st and a 2nd round pick.

No reason for Detroit or Vancouver to give up so much for so very little.

Nov. 17, 2022 at 5:24 p.m.

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: HockeyIsMyPassion61

Is this a freaking joke?

The first trade is brutal for Vancouver, And the 2nd trade is brutal for Detroit.

Detroit gives up tons of pieces for basically Horvat and Knies what a joke.

Vancouver trade, Detroit trades Rasmussen+Sebrango+Andreasson+St Louis 2023 2nd round pick Detroit gets back in return Miller 2,625,000+Horvat+Schenn+Rangers 2023 4th round pick. Ask me why Vancouver would ever consider this.

Toronto trade Detroit gets Engval+Holl+Kerfoot+Knies+Robertson+Tor 2023 1st round pick+TOR 2024 2nd round pick and Toronto gets Bertuzzi $2,375,000+Miller+Oesterle+Schenn+Erne+2023 ranger 4th round pick+2023 Dallas 4th round pick. So basically Detroit only gets Holl and Knies out of the whole deal. Pretty bad for Detroit.

And Vancouver gets Engval+Robertson+2 1st and a 2nd round pick.

No reason for Detroit or Vancouver to give up so much for so very little.

Someone can't read very well lol. First point, it is stated that this type of trade wouldn't happen as its not a video game. Second, It is a three way trade, but rather than put it up in the other forum, I made it an ACGM. To make it easy, there is a summary listed at the bottom of the description. Lastly, each team gets things they are going after "TEAM NEEDS" if you will. The individual trades aren't one after another

Obviously Detroit doesn't need or want Kerfoot and/or Holl. But If SY could get anything back at the TDL, I personally wouldn't mind biting that bullet to get Horvat and Knies. Horvat replaces Ras and Copp shifts to wing when Kasper is ready. Knies adds a different element to the forward prospect pool.

Obviously Vancouver is hoping to maximize returns on Horvat and Miller (unlikely they move J.T. with that new deal). Instead of seeing constant overpayments and gross underpayments, I simplified it and in return they get multiple RFA young players (Ras, Robertson, Andreasson), prospect Sebrango, Engvall for cap space, 2 1sts, and 2 2nds. I also mentioned that a different prospect could be subbed in as this is FICTIONAL and more about how fans view their team/player values.

Obviously Toronto doesn't need to go and get J.T. and Bert as they would most likely try and only get one, if at all, while going after a separate RHD. They are also getting rid of Knies, a 2023 first, and 2024 2nd.

Here is the clip notes for you:
After the smoke settles, this is how it looks:

Detroit additions: Horvat, Knies, Kerfoot, Holl
Detroit subtractions: Ras, Sebrango, Andreasson, Erne, Oesterle, 2023 2nd, 2024 1st, 2024 4th

Vancouver additions: Ras, Sebrango, Andreasson, Robertson, Engvall, 2023 1st (TOR), 2024 1st (DET), 2023 (DET or STL), 2024 2nd (TOR)
Vancouver subtractions: J.T. Miller (50%), Horvat, Schenn, 2023 4th

Toronto additions: Bertuzzi (50%), Miller (50%), Schenn, Erne, Oesterle, 2023 4th (VAN), 2024 4th (DET)
Toronto subtractions: Kerfoot, Holl, Engvall, Robertson, Knies, 2023 1st, 2024 2nd

Nov. 17, 2022 at 5:32 p.m.

MoSeider53

Future Norris guy

Joined: Aug. 2022

Posts: 15,605

Likes: 8,625

Quoting: CoachCoach

I don't need to read well when you post this mess, Detroit is still giving up far too much for Horvat, Knies, Kerfoot and Holl period.

Once again i make my point clear, Neither Detroit or Vancouver make those deal. it's just plain awful for both teams

Nov. 17, 2022 at 5:49 p.m.

MoreHitzSeider

Seiders on the Storm

Joined: May 2020

Posts: 9,890

Likes: 7,764

I'll need a few shots to get through all of this. 🥃🥃🥃

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:04 p.m.

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: HockeyIsMyPassion61

Whatever you say backseat lol

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:05 p.m.

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: MoreHitzSeider

I'll need a few shots to get through all of this. 🥃🥃🥃

Want a shot of Belfour whisky?

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:06 p.m.

#10

MoreHitzSeider

Seiders on the Storm

Joined: May 2020

Posts: 9,890

Likes: 7,764

Quoting: CoachCoach

Want a shot of Belfour whisky?

Eddie the Beagle? He was a mess. I suppose he still is. He's likely barking at fire trucks right now.

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:09 p.m.

#11

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: MoreHitzSeider

Eddie the Beagle? He was a mess. I suppose he still is. He's likely barking at fire trucks right now.

Absolute mess, but he made a decent beverage. Can't be doing better than D-Mac though, guy was living at Soaring Eagle Casino before he started doing podcasts.

Also, there is no way this team gets blown out 13-0, Cornell Ned if anything.

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:11 p.m.

#12

MoreHitzSeider

Seiders on the Storm

Joined: May 2020

Posts: 9,890

Likes: 7,764

Quoting: CoachCoach

Absolute mess, but he made a decent beverage. Can't be doing better than D-Mac though, guy was living at Soaring Eagle Casino before he started doing podcasts.

McCarty rubs me the wrong way. I don't know if it's his condescending voice. But he's the last person I'd ever listen to. Guy was a warrior for the Red Wings and I appreciated his willingness to go through a wall for his team. But off the ice it's a much different story. Guy should realize it's 2022 now. 1997 is over. I can't believe he's on a podcast now telling Red Wings fans what to think. He's ****ing annoying. 🤮

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:15 p.m.

#13

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: MoreHitzSeider

Oh its bad. He is that stern old guy at the bar that tries to instill wisdom to 19-21 year olds about back in his day. I tried listening to it once and couldn't get through it.

Nov. 17, 2022 at 6:38 p.m.

#14

CoachCoach

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2022

Posts: 2,737

Likes: 2,390

Quoting: dannibalcorpse

i mean, i love the chaos, but I think JT Miller is probably the most unmovable part of this deal. That extension might be a little heavy for Toronto going forward - even with the cap going up.

Yes agreed, this would be an "ALL IN" move for TOR. They would ultimately end up having to rid themselves of another contract that most likely they wouldn't want to. If they won it all however, would that soften the blow? Getting him, and Bert would be overkill and a little redundant.

dannibalcorpse liked this.

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