anybody who thinks this team won't be competitive has awful hockey knowledge. this team isn't flashy or "sexy" but this team mucks and grinds, all day. depth smokes buffalo and ottawa's all day every day and if you disagree you're wrong. read the username.

Sabres scored 56 more goals than Detroit and had 11 more points. They are behind Ottawa&Buffalo by a wide margin.

Wishful thinking. Detroit sold at the trade deadline and were tanking after Rasmussen got injured.

Wide margin? Child, please. 😁

Ottawa and Buffalo aren't perfect hockey teams.

Yeah Detroit didn't improve at all. 🤔

Yes it’s a wide margin Sabres went 4-0 against Detroit scoring 24 goals, Ottawa went 3-1 scoring 20 goals. Sabres and Sens have star players in their lineup Detroit doesn’t.

Yeah, that was last season, but this team has made some big upgades this offseason.

You are crazy.

They have one top line forward, two top 6 forwards then a bunch of overpaid third liners to round out the forward corp.

Seider has been inconsistent, Walman is a #1LD who was worthless two seasons ago and have about 60 solid games to his name. Then you have 5 overpaid D behind them all of whom are probably considered cap dumps.

Both goalies were in the bottom 5% last year.

This is a team more likely to finish dead last than make the playoffs

It's unfortunate CFACGM doesn't suspend posters for horrible takes. This is embarrassing.

+2500 to finish dead last. +230 to make the playoffs. Man the bookies are hard wrong if your take has any merit. Look, I think they’re somewhere in the middle of where the argument lies here. Easy out I know to say that, but it’s the truth. they’re improved from last year and should be closer to Buffalo and Ottawa than last year, but likely still behind them. I like their chances of being decent, of playing above mid, potentially making playoffs. But truth is, this argument isn’t settled through words.

I will though take a bit of offence with couple of your points. 5 defence are overpaid - so what? For a team that has no cap issue, how does this affect their performance? Being overpaid doesn’t make you a bad hockey player. Bobrovsky is overpaid, almost won the conn smythe. Both goalies in bottom 5%? Using what metrics?

Wild take and just a terrible analysis.

Using sv%.

And you are saying it's a middle ground then also stating that they are likely still behind Buffalo and Ottawa. So who are they better than? Toronto? Tampa? Boston? Florida?. Maybe Montreal. The odds of them making the playoffs are ridiculously low and odds makers are always way off on hockey. Vegas had and still today has horribly low odds of winning. Toronto and Edmonton are always top 3/4 but never go far.

I have no idea how you are filtering the goalies to come up with bottom 5% - like I’m sure there’s a way if you just delete most of the ones below them…

Hey mate, you gotta actually play the hockey season to see who is better than who. One argument was that Detroit smokes Buff/Ott bc of depth. The other argument was that Detroit has a better chance of finishing last than making playoffs, lmfao. Anyways, I think Detroit will place above Montreal in the standings, one of Buffalo or Ottawa, and maybe Boston. My opinion is a fringe playoff team. I’m not going to use extremely insane and actually wrong in to your case, ‘facts’ and analysis. Instead I’m just pointing out that both your arguments are insane. But you asked who they might finish ahead of, there is my answer.

And ok, if the bookies are terrible at setting markets in hockey, you must make a killing because you are so smart? Like f**k dude who do you think you are. Vegas was pretty close to always in top 5 shortest odds down the stretch last year. Right now they are 6th shortest but it’s marginally longer than the teams shorter than them. It’s not easy to repeat anyways but please tell me how you would set the market right now? Let’s not forget that bookies will shorten odds on teams that are heavily bet, aka Toronto, to minimize their exposure. Oh ya, and Edmonton? Easily gave Vegas the best run of anyone in last playoffs. They near undoubtedly were the 2nd best team and would have won had it not been for Vegas.

You can make 33 cents on your dollar for Detroit missing the playoffs right now. That’s a lot better f*cking value than any bank will give you so go do it then pal. But let’s circle back around to what the ACTUAL argument was and what my point was. You’re telling me that Detroit has a higher likelihood of dead last, than of making the playoffs. My point - just look at the odds, they don’t agree, I don’t agree, no one else would agree with that ludicracy. But if you’re so sure, go make some coin off it

Are using statistics on a team before a massive offseason roster turnover, which was around 33%? Turn your brain on next time before responding.

Are you factoring in players' salaries in comparison to their skills? Shows how narrow-minded you really are buddy. Yikes. You should probably put a cork in it before I embarrass you to the masses. Don't make me have to reply again.