pharrow

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I would be a great GM, hit me up NHL
Forum: Armchair-GM12 hours ago
Thread: Chicago tear down
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ChiHawk</b></div><div></div></div>

no one is suggesting the wheels come off at 32. That was never the point if you read it you understood that.
But the reality is the number of players 34+ playing at a PPG level 2.
There is typically a fall off, it's normal. Above .6 PPG there are 6.
That's not saying there aren't guys paying well at 34. But the drop off is there.
My point was never that he isn't playing well at 32. My point was when he's 35 on the last year of that deal. You aren't getting a 10 million dollar player. I don't know how you would even want to argue that.
As for the return. There are 2 1st there. POJ was a mid 1st round pick and is only a 20 year old prospect. And the other 1st.
I don't know why you don't see that. And everything else there other than Jarry is trade bait for picks.
I'm not going to sit here and argue that the return can't change. But you won't ever get a 40 goal young winger for him like some people have suggested. That's absurd.
Forum: Armchair-GM16 hours ago
Thread: Chicago tear down
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ChiHawk</b></div><div>This is so off it's not funny. If Chicago is rebuilding and in some crazy world Kane and Chicago agree to a trade, it STARTS with (2) 1st round picks and a A prospect. 110 point guys, on a crap team, don't grow on trees. You're asking for a top 10 player in the league and top 5 forward in the league who's going to continue to perform at a very high level for the duration of his contract. What you proposed here would be for a UFA rental of Kane.</div></div>

no what we are talking about is a guy who is going to be 32 in under 2 months. And to say he will perform good when he's 35 is nonsense. No one knows that and the odds of that being true are 50/50 at best.
Yes he's a good player, I stated that above. But I also listed a slew of other reasons that make it harder to get the return you are asking for.
As far as the 2 1st parts I agree, and I have included that in there. I don't know if you would get a truly A prospect for him on top of that. Simply because of the cap hit and the fact that he's going to playoff teams IF he were to go. Not many of the playoff teams really have the kind of prospect you are looking for. Those are usually on teams that are picking high not in the playoffs.
But limited pool of partners, with the cap hit, combined with the age does not make it the same as trading say a McDavid. It's just isn't.
Some people just don't want to admit that. It would be one thing is Chicago was in a cup window. Then the Reward to trade would never be worth it and an unrealistic expectation would be expected.
But there is no cup window here. If there is no cup window you have to ask yourself, at what point is it best for both the player and the franchise to move on it. Which is why they would do a rebuild.
Not that I'm saying they will choose that. I'm sure they feel like they can turn it around. But if you were to do that, and you're options were limited. I don't think you would find the return you think you are going to get. As I'm sure he'd want on a real contender and they probably aren't giving up what got them there. Most likely they don't have the prospect who is a top 5 pick or whatever.
Forum: Armchair-GM16 hours ago
Thread: Chicago tear down
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>hockeyfanatic05</b></div><div>I guarantee if someone was trading for crosby, you would demand a teams 5 best players and 5 1st round picks, and say anything less is stupid for pittsburgh. Thats how kane is to chicago. For once, stop being biased</div></div>

I have never said the Penguins would demand less, but that's because they HAVE a window and it exists BECAUSE of Crosby.
The deal here is chicago doesn't and you have to ask yourself whats left, and what is a realistic return.
Can chicago turn it around in 2 years, and the answer in this mythical ACGM is that they decide to do a tear down, like the chicago fan posted earlier.
We both know we could not trade Crosby for Pasta.
That's basically what he's saying. And I said that's total BS. And you would be an idiot to argue otherwise because Boston would not make that deal.
That's really a good comparable for his nonsense.
So please stuff it. No one is being a homer. Reality is no one is giving that up for a 32 year old guy. No matter what some delusional fan wants.
Forum: Armchair-GM19 hours ago
Thread: Pens with their Youth Lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>I don't care about other sports, they aren't hockey, the toughest sport to play. There's a reason only a couple players a draft play instantly in the NHL every year.

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quote:</div>You act as if playing in slower leagues makes you magically play faster. It doesn't.
You have to be dropped into the game to adjust to it's speed. It's always been that way.
There is no substitute for doing actually playing at the level. None.

You keep arguing nonsense. But if they are closing out the window, the chances are high they bring in their best talent fast. Period!
They have no reason to hold it back. None. What are they going to do, wait forever till the windows closed and say oh look we have these talented pieces to play now but who aren't superstar level talent capable of actually making a difference on their own. What ignorant thinking.</div>

So your argument isn't that they are ready for the NHL, it's "well you have to play them in the NHL to get them up to speed"? That's how you ruin development. You just play young guy to play young guys because of a window. Poulin and Legare would get a lot more from playing in league they can actually learn instead of getting owned in the NHL.

As a Caps fan I REALLY hope you guys to play them to early and screw up their development, but I'm telling you know it isn't smart. Wait until they're ready.</div></div>

I hate to break it to you but the "development" you speak of is mostly physical.
Believe me I watched it in the NCAA. We didn't play 80 games a year to get playing experience to adjust to this magical difference in game speed. Matter of fact, there was very little speed difference between the highschool and NCAA.
On top of it we played what 34 games a year. WOW.
A whole year 34 games.
Really works on getting use to that game speed.
Honestly, please move on. I'm done with you.
Players don't make the jump because at 18 most players aren't 210lbs.
They need to fill out their frame, gain muscle and strength and avoid getting thrown around and back checked to the ground because they are skinny little kids.
You know, like the same reason they don't get drafted into the NFL.
There are players though who are mature physically and are ready to actually play at that level mentally. As in can actually handle being a freaking adult.
Forum: Armchair-GM19 hours ago
Thread: Chicago tear down
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>LMAO If CHI was to ever trade Kane, which they won't, it would cost a loooot more. Dude just scored 110 points last season on a crap team. If PIT could afford him it would be Gentzuel+Poulin+Hallander+1st maybe even more.</div></div>

no it wouldn't and that's absolute nonsense. No team is giving up a young 40 goal scoring Gentzuel for 32 year old Kane.
Please, come back down to reality.
Be honest in your assessment. A. you have the problem of working around the NMC which limits your options. B. you have the huge cap hit and making it fit without dumping dead weight on you. C. he's 32 this year. How many more years you think you will get out of a 32 year old guy playing at a high level. Honestly there aren't many guys 34+ in this league keeping up. Most of them aren't nearly as good as they were in their prime.
So you won't get nearly that crack head return.
Like I said. It seems like you'd get a 1st and a 2nd for each of those 2 years. Because Kane at 35 probably isn't worth the 10 million cap hit he holds. Hell he might not be worth it at 34.
Forum: Armchair-GM19 hours ago
Thread: Discussion What is Galchenyuks true value
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>RoyalBlueSabres</b></div><div>The thing is it's not a win win. Vesey has more value he plays better defense AND has more goals. Chucky might have more prestige and was ince involved in higher end deals but that only matters so much. He is not doing anything now, he is weak in his own zone and not scoring. Coach doesn't like him pushes him far down the line up. So tell me where the value is. why would we trade someone better in both zones and who has been on the team all year and has known chemistry. Maybe they aren't good trading partners but certainly makes no sense to trade vesey for chucky straight up. Pens dont want him. So Sabres would also trade someone they dont want. The trade would be excess pieces on the roster</div></div>

That's just it, Vesey too has slipped down the chart too. Last I saw he's playing on the 3rd line now. Not producing much.
It's clear you like Vesey better than Chucky. That's ok. I'm not going to knock that. But you have 2 struggling guys and there really isn't much of a difference as far as production here.
So you don't want to take a chance on a guy that may turn it around and give you more. OK, that's fine. But that's the whole point of the penguins making a trade. They don't need a bottom 6 forward. Nor do they need another RD. If they flip him it's either to dump cap and get a pick, or to swap struggling players.
You got to give to get. If you don't think Chucky can produce more than Vesey for you right now, the real question I have for you is, why the hell would you trade for him anyway?
Forum: Armchair-GM19 hours ago
Thread: Pens with their Youth Lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>LOL dude you really think NHL speed of the game, not just physical speed, but processing the actual speed, is that same as it is in the QMJHL? Sorry, but you have no idea what you're talking about. AGAIN, give me examples of this. You've given me one out of thousands and thousands of players, and that player was a 3rd overall pick that had an amazing draft year.

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quote:</div>The penguins are sitting on two guys who could most likely fill in a role now. But the reason they aren't there is more of a numbers game. If they didn't have numbers they wouldn't be there in the Q.</div>

There is absolutely no way Poulin, and especially Legare, would be able to stand the NHL right now. If you really think so you are blind. They won't be able to handle it next year, let alone right now.

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quote:</div> So if they think these guys are going to help them win the cup and they don't have the numbers they would like, they WILL in deed move them over.
Believe me, playing with guys who are smaller, slower, and not as skilled as them, isn't exactly helping their development and not "preparing them for the speed of the game."
It's them basically tooling around down there waiting for their chance. This is a system that was designed for a time where athletes weren't training like they do now at 17 years old to make it to the pros. Times have changed. If you are both mentally and physically mature enough as a player is the real hold up.</div>

You're right! It is mentally AND physically. These kids aren't ready mentally. The QMJHL is a fraction of pro hockey. You can be as fast and physical as you want, but if you can't handle the actual mental speed of the pros, which they can't, you won't do jack in the NHL. Nothing is more important than IQ. If they were absolutely tearing up the QMJHL then maybe you'd have a case, but neither are, not even close.</div></div>

this is such nonsense.
there are 18 year old kids playing professionally in just about every sport.
You can look at high level college football that has 18 year old kids who adjust to the speed of the game. It's no different. They stick 18 year olds into playing high end college backetball and the only thing stopping them from going pro is the age limit.

It's every single sport. The thing that holds players back is they aren't developed physically. That's what holds people back in football, basketball, baseball, you name it. It's not the "speed of the game"
You act as if playing in slower leagues makes you magically play faster. It doesn't.
You have to be dropped into the game to adjust to it's speed. It's always been that way.
There is no substitute for doing actually playing at the level. None.
You keep arguing nonsense. But if they are closing out the window, the chances are high they bring in their best talent fast. Period!
They have no reason to hold it back. None. What are they going to do, wait forever till the windows closed and say oh look we have these talented pieces to play now but who aren't superstar level talent capable of actually making a difference on their own. What ignorant thinking.
Forum: Armchair-GM20 hours ago
Thread: Discussion What is Galchenyuks true value
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMTD</b></div><div><a href="/users/RoyalBlueSabres" target="_blank">@RoyalBlueSabres</a>
<a href="/users/Pharrow" target="_blank">@Pharrow</a>
<a href="/users/Skyraider112" target="_blank">@Skyraider112</a>
<a href="/users/Eli" target="_blank">@Eli</a>
I know Galchenyuk has been traded twice now, once for Domi and once for Kessel. That sounds like he has a lot of value to me or at least in Chayka and Rutherford opinions. But his value seems to have been tarnished in Pittsburgh.
So is he only worth a pocket of lint? Or can he be reclaimed? The answer lies in the middle IMO.
Over the last 5 years he and Reinhart have similar starts. Over that time Reinhart has 12 more goals, and about 20 more pts, about the difference this year alone.
As a Sabre’s fan I would want to give up as little as possible and trade shall we say extra players. Buffalo has 5 second pairing RHD, so I would want to send one of them. Buffalo also has at least 4 good possession bottom 6 forwards (Asplund, Girgensons, Larsson, and Okposo). Okposo is out because his salary is too high and he is too injury prone. Asplund is out because he cheap and IMO Betterall would not want to trade him. That leaves Girgensons and Larsson, either of them have more goals than Chucky.
So I am offering Bogosian and Larsson for Galchenyuk. I patiently await your ever constructive criticism.</div></div>

The penguins won't fill the contracts to 50/50 they have at least 1 possibly 2 players in the NCAA they want to sign and already have to figure out how to open that 2nd spot up.
I don't know why you wouldn't just do Vesey for him straight up. It's the most common sense move on both teams. Vesey takes up a bit of cap space and is doing basically nothing in BUF.
He like Chucky has a chance to turn it around on a different club.
The last thing the penguins need is another bottom 6 forward. They got more guys who can play that role than they can fit on the roster. Even with 4 forward injuries they are still fielding a decent team in the bottom 6. When those guys are healthy they have more forwards than they know what to do with.
As far as RHD. The penguins have 2 top RHD in Marino and Letang. They also have Schultz there. Why would they want to take on a heavy salary for a guy who would be 3rd pairing at best when the whole team is about to have cap issues. I mean hell they could be riding the bench behind all 3 of those guys.
That makes no sense. Honestly, you can probably move one of those defense man to WPG or TOR or DET. The penguins have about 4 million in bonus money looking like it might be due this year. I don't know that for sure yet, but it does look like it. They are basically pressed to the cap just as much as Buffalo. Kahun looks like he will get his bonus which I think is 20 goals. Marino will get his I think as well. That's the reason the penguins haven't put a single player on LTIR even though Sid, Jugs and Dumo are out 8 weeks and would all qualify. They are trying to keep the cap low for those bonus payments to not kick into next year.
The best trade here is Vesey for Chucky. Both teams win there. They take a gamble on a guy who no longer really fits. Vesey has a whopping 1 more goal than Chucky at 5v5 play but has played more games.
I don't see either player resigning with either team next year. It's a no brainer.
Forum: Armchair-GM20 hours ago
Thread: Pitts
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SammyT_51</b></div><div>No Liljegren in there. If he is not there this is very good deal imo.</div></div>

It's a homer TOR deal if Liljegren is in there.
What does TOR give up for a goalie playing great, a future top 4 LD, and a winger with at least potential?
Lets count the pieces shall we!
Kerfoot, ok it's a decent piece, not nearly worth MP but ok a decent piece.
A 2nd, could get you DeSmith, not Jarry atm though.
A bad goalie the penguins don't want and is a cap dump.
Ceci...yeah no thanks. Little more than a cap dump.
Bracco who is an undersized prospect who has not made the jump.
and Liljegren who hasn't really done anything.

Yeah, no Hard pass from the penguins
Who would be giving up a Defense man in their top 4. A goalie playing lights out, and a winger they can move elsewhere with out all this garbage attached.
Forum: Armchair-GMSat at 5:06 am
Thread: Pens with their Youth Lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>It's not about size. It's about processing the speed of the game. The QMJHL is the weakest of the 3 junior leagues, it is NOWHERE near professional level in terms of speed. Poulin is not ready and won't be ready next year. Protas is better than Poulin and if he isn't ready, neither his Poulin. Sure they could play him early, wouldn't be smart though, it's how you ruin a players development.</div></div>

It is not about "processing the speed of the game"
that is a myth spoken by people who have never wore skates.
The difference at the NHL and lower levels is the size speed and skill of the player.
You are talking about guys who have the size and speed, and the skill to be there.
Any adjustment to the NHL speed in not something that takes years to over come. It's a shock no matter at what point you are dropped into it.
PLD got moved over because he was physically mature enough to make that jump and his speed of play was there.
The penguins are sitting on two guys who could most likely fill in a role now. But the reason they aren't there is more of a numbers game. If they didn't have numbers they wouldn't be there in the Q.
So if they think these guys are going to help them win the cup and they don't have the numbers they would like, they WILL in deed move them over.
Believe me, playing with guys who are smaller, slower, and not as skilled as them, isn't exactly helping their development and not "preparing them for the speed of the game."
It's them basically tooling around down there waiting for their chance. This is a system that was designed for a time where athletes weren't training like they do now at 17 years old to make it to the pros.
Times have changed. If you are both mentally and physically mature enough as a player is the real hold up.
Forum: Armchair-GMFri at 6:40 pm
Thread: Gustafsson to WJC Confirmed
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Spleenmaster1002</b></div><div>IIHF rules say that European players can play in the AHL if they’re under 20 only if they’re 1st round picks Gustafsson was a second round pick.</div></div>

"Those basic requirements have held in place ever since. However, for young players signed out of Europe or collegiate players who give up their remaining NCAA eligibility in order to sign an NHL entry-level contract or AHL minor league contract, the minimum age to play in the AHL is 18.

For example, when the Flyers signed 2013 second-round pick Robert Hagg to an entry-level contract, he was 19 years old for most of his rookie season with the AHL’s Lehigh Valley Phantoms. Hagg was drafted from a Swedish team (Modo Hockey), so it was within the rules for the then-teenaged player to be assigned to the AHL."

The AHL does not care what their league says.
Their rules only make exception for the CHL.
If he is not under contract to play for another team. He is free to play in the AHL. As per the example of a 2nd round pick by the flyers above.
Forum: Armchair-GMFri at 5:42 pm
Thread: Pens with their Youth Lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>Still doubt it. Will have to give me some examples of a player jumping from the QMJHL to the NHL so quickly. Hell we had Protas put up 3 points in 2 preseason game and he plays in a harder league (WHL- which he was leading the league b/f WJC D1 tournament) but I know he isn't ready for the NHL this season or next. Extremely rare kids take the jump so quickly unless, like I said, they are elite.</div></div>

People take time to develop because they haven't matured. These guys are grown. Protas is 6'6 and weighed 210lbs. I'm sorry but that's thin for a guy that tall.
He should be 230 at least at that weight. So it's not surprising. To give you an idea Pavlychev for the penguins is 6'7 225lb, and still has room to grow. So I wouldn't be shocked that guy isn't ready. He's got 20lbs of mass to gain yet.
We aren't talking about guys here who have to grow into it. You are talking about guys who are dominating at their level. Poulin is putting up 1.5 pts per game. That's a really solid clip. To put it in perspective PLD for CBJ was putting up 1.15ppg his last year in the q and he made the jump at 19.
So lets not BS about what ready is. By 19 they have the skating skills, and the shooting skills. It's the physical maturity to fight for the puck that is usually holding guys back.
You have a closing window, and a team looking to finish out strong. If they think they can slide these guys in to the benefit of the team. They will, without a doubt.
They don't have to worry about the rest. It will figure itself out.
Forum: Armchair-GMFri at 3:41 pm
Thread: Pens with their Youth Lineup
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ClockReads2113</b></div><div>I just find it hard to believe any player jumping from QMJHL to the NHL in a D+1 season unless they are an elite talent. Poulin could very well be good but not elite. Think it will take a bit to get to the professional game.</div></div>

I think that is a poor way to look at it. There are some players who frankly are ready and will continue to develop at the pro level. I mean Légaré looked every bit the part in preseason and those were games that had NHL level talent in them. Yet he really stood out as being one of the best players on the ice. He's also fully developed physically. He's not a guy trying to gain weight and strength and that's a huge part of it.
You aren't talking about Hockey from 10+ years ago. Players are suppose to be on the ice by age 20. They get 6 months in the AHL and then called up. This isn't uncommon.
You are talking about players who will be 19 in in a month or two. It's not like they are currently all that far away from making the jump. They are already 6 foot 210lb guys. It's not like they are going to magically get faster. They will have a learning curve of the system, and I'm sure they will make mistakes along the way. But athletically, they are there. And when you need that talent boost to take those last couple of shots, why not. You have nothing to lose.
Forum: Armchair-GMFri at 12:21 pm
Thread: Saw someone else do this but Im gonna change it slightly
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Shibbal18</b></div><div>Teams will compete over him so even if NJ doesnt have leverage, a first will still be offered for him. Hes definitely not getting moved for scraps and a 2nd</div></div>

We'll see what teams will offer up soon enough. But this idea he's getting 2 1sts is nuts.
If he was a center, maybe you could make a case, or even a 1st pairing defenseman. But he's not. He's a winger. They don't have the same value. And his play sucks coming off of knee surgery.
Will he get a 1st, maybe. But teams didn't exactly pay out last year for wingers. 2 1st round picks were dealt last year, both for centers. And the excuses weren't about the available talent. Stone was talented and so was Panarin.
Both were having much better years and not coming off injury.
It is what it is. I don't think NJ is getting offers like people here want to assume or they have any leverage to make demands.