Bonino to Avs and Kreider

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God no, that’s an awful trade for the avs. 0 interest in a cap dump trade especially giving up a very good prospect

Jul. 29, 2019 at 8:33 p.m.

#2

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Quoting: coga16

God no, that’s an awful trade for the avs. 0 interest in a cap dump trade especially giving up a very good prospect

I had a feeling you'd comment

I really wouldn't call it a cap dump, but ok. Bonino just netted 17 goals and apparently had some votes for Selke consideration (not that I would take that too seriously). I think he'd be a pretty good replacement to Soderberg and would allow the young guys to play wings if need be.

Also, where are you putting Meloche? You have Girard and Makar already up, Timmins in the system on the right side, and just drafted Byram and Helleson. And from what I heard from other Avs fans on this site, they were comfortable moving Meloche at the deadline last season, after not having the greatest '17-'18 campaign. You could certainly pick another prospect to move if you really love Meloche, but I think this gives the Avs even more center depth and gives you a vet who has a won a cup to go into that young locker room.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:01 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

I had a feeling you'd comment

I really wouldn't call it a cap dump, but ok. Bonino just netted 17 goals and apparently had some votes for Selke consideration (not that I would take that too seriously). I think he'd be a pretty good replacement to Soderberg and would allow the young guys to play wings if need be.

Also, where are you putting Meloche? You have Girard and Makar already up, Timmins in the system on the right side, and just drafted Byram and Helleson. And from what I heard from other Avs fans on this site, they were comfortable moving Meloche at the deadline last season, after not having the greatest '17-'18 campaign. You could certainly pick another prospect to move if you really love Meloche, but I think this gives the Avs even more center depth and gives you a vet who has a won a cup to go into that young locker room.

Moving Meloche for a Top 6 player...not a 31 year old 3rd liner player. you claim Avs need C depth but have Mack, Kadri, Jost, Compher, Kamenev, Bellemare on the roster right now, Bowers this year and Newhook on the way as early as 1 season and Saigeon is also in that mix. The last thing Avs need to be doing is adding Centres.

Avs have a lot of good Dman who are graduated from the system, but will lose probably a good one in the expansion draft like Zadorov, you aren't moving Meloche for an expiring player like Bonino who tops out as a 3rd line C but in reality isn't an upgrade over any of the Avs 3C options they currently have on the roster.

Bad move, bad fit, bad player for the Avs....bad trade

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:10 p.m.

#4

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Quoting: coga16

Moving Meloche for a Top 6 player...not a 31 year old 3rd liner player. you claim Avs need C depth but have Mack, Kadri, Jost, Compher, Kamenev, Bellemare on the roster right now, Bowers this year and Newhook on the way as early as 1 season and Saigeon is also in that mix. The last thing Avs need to be doing is adding Centres.

Avs have a lot of good Dman who are graduated from the system, but will lose probably a good one in the expansion draft like Zadorov, you aren't moving Meloche for an expiring player like Bonino who tops out as a 3rd line C but in reality isn't an upgrade over any of the Avs 3C options they currently have on the roster.

Bad move, bad fit, bad player for the Avs....bad trade

I thought that Bowers is going to need another year and Newhook might need 2. I thought that Jost and Compher may be better on the wings, and I was not sure whether Kamenev is in the starting lineup anyway.

I only picked the Avs as an example, because I thought if they wanted to bring veteran leadership in to take a run this year it could help. But the whole point of this was to move Bonino and acquire Kreider. I could probably do a similar move with other teams (off the top of my head the Wild or the Kings that may need another body).

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:13 p.m.

#5

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I mean yeah swap Carrier with your choice of Tolvanen, Fabbro or Tomasino and make the 2nd a conditional 2nd upon resign to 1st. and you nailed it.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:15 p.m.

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Quoting: coga16

Moving Meloche for a Top 6 player...not a 31 year old 3rd liner player. you claim Avs need C depth but have Mack, Kadri, Jost, Compher, Kamenev, Bellemare on the roster right now, Bowers this year and Newhook on the way as early as 1 season and Saigeon is also in that mix. The last thing Avs need to be doing is adding Centres.

Avs have a lot of good Dman who are graduated from the system, but will lose probably a good one in the expansion draft like Zadorov, you aren't moving Meloche for an expiring player like Bonino who tops out as a 3rd line C but in reality isn't an upgrade over any of the Avs 3C options they currently have on the roster.

Bad move, bad fit, bad player for the Avs....bad trade

And I would also look at the Kadri trade and note that trading for Centers can come at a steep price in this league, so I would not be shocked if a defenseman who does not have a top pairing ceiling is moved for a top 9 center. But I understand that you are not a fan of the trade and you are entitled to that.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:18 p.m.

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Quoting: Sagecoll

I mean yeah swap Carrier with your choice of Tolvanen, Fabbro or Tomasino and make the 2nd a conditional 2nd upon resign to 1st. and you nailed it.

A) Everyone you mentioned is likely off limits.
B) I doubt you get a first rounder for Kreider right now given that NYR have little leverage with the cap situation. I also think you could make the 2nd a conditional if you would like I think that's probably fair. I was actually thinking both 2020 2nds and the conditional, but I wanted to be a little more conservative. But I just do not think you get a first for Krieder outright at this moment in time.

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Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:22 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

A) Everyone you mentioned is likely off limits.
B) I doubt you get a first rounder for Kreider right now given that NYR have little leverage with the cap situation. I also think you could make the 2nd a conditional if you would like I think that's probably fair. I was actually thinking both 2020 2nds and the conditional, but I wanted to be a little more conservative. But I just do not think you get a first for Krieder outright at this moment in time.

I'm not sure the little leverage you speak of....we trade Namestnikov and Strome. We sign Deangelo and Lemieux. We have about 1-2 mil cap room when all is said and done...

In terms of value you're likely to pay a cost similar to Turris (it only makes sense to go after Kreider if you're resigning). Girard and Kamenev were both better ranked prospects than Tomasino when they were traded (you know that). I'm not asking for 2. I'm only asking for 1. It's not like we're just gonna give away a top 15 LW for below value lol.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:22 p.m.

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@moli92 are you up in arms about what I proposed?

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:24 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

I thought that Bowers is going to need another year and Newhook might need 2. I thought that Jost and Compher may be better on the wings, and I was not sure whether Kamenev is in the starting lineup anyway.

I only picked the Avs as an example, because I thought if they wanted to bring veteran leadership in to take a run this year it could help. But the whole point of this was to move Bonino and acquire Kreider. I could probably do a similar move with other teams (off the top of my head the Wild or the Kings that may need another body).

I wouldn't like it If they paid a 3rd round pick for Bonino straight up, never mind a 3rd plus Meloche. Bowers should make his NHL debut this season, chances are later in the year if injuries happen, and Newhook is going to be a 1 and done, Avs already want to try to get him under an ELC as soon as possible.

Sorry but its just a very misguided trade and over valuing Bonino

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:25 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

And I would also look at the Kadri trade and note that trading for Centers can come at a steep price in this league, so I would not be shocked if a defenseman who does not have a top pairing ceiling is moved for a top 9 center. But I understand that you are not a fan of the trade and you are entitled to that.

If you think Bonino is ever close to the same value as Kadri, you are out of your mind

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:30 p.m.

#12

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Quoting: Sagecoll

I'm not sure the little leverage you speak of....we trade Namestnikov and Strome. We sign Deangelo and Lemieux. We have about 1-2 mil cap room when all is said and done...

In terms of value you're likely to pay a cost similar to Turris (it only makes sense to go after Kreider if you're resigning). Girard and Kamenev were both better ranked prospects than Tomasino when they were traded (you know that). I'm not asking for 2. I'm only asking for 1. It's not like we're just gonna give away a top 15 LW for below value lol.

Don't you think they would have traded Strome and Namestnikov by now if they could have? I was saying to trade them when they dealt for Fox! Teams are not stupid they know what the Rangers need to do.

I also think what I suggested in the last post (the two 2020 2nds the Predators possess with a condition on a resign, plus a prospect) is a very good deal for someone who has only 1 year left on his deal. Second rounders are still good prospects, especially in an upcoming draft that is very deep.

And to put things in perspective, the Rangers tried to trade Kreider to the Avs for the 16th overall already, and it was declined. I know the Avs are not a team that will sacrifice a first rounder to win now (notice how I said they would not sacrifice a first rounder, but I do think they'd give up a third for an impact player), but I am not sure if any team is willing to trade their first rounder in this upcoming draft.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:30 p.m.

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Quoting: coga16

If you think Bonino is ever close to the same value as Kadri, you are out of your mind

Of course not. I am only saying Centers come at a steep price. Again, bigger picture is just moving Bonino and acquiring Kreider.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:31 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

Of course not. I am only saying Centers come at a steep price. Again, bigger picture is just moving Bonino and acquiring Kreider.

and you are trying to defend still how Bonino would be great for the Avs, which he is not

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:34 p.m.

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Quoting: coga16

and you are trying to defend still how Bonino would be great for the Avs, which he is not

It was only an idea. We can agree to disagree. If it bothers you that much I will find another team lol.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:35 p.m.

#16

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Quoting: rja

It was only an idea. We can agree to disagree. If it bothers you that much I will find another team lol.

You were there one who kept on trying to defend it and then go tag other Avs fans to see if they hate it too, don't act like I'm the sensitive one about this. Its not a fit my man and you dont have your ducks in a row when talking about the Avs needs and pipelines that's all

Jul. 29, 2019 at 9:37 p.m.

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Quoting: coga16

You were there one who kept on trying to defend it and then go tag other Avs fans to see if they hate it too, don't act like I'm the sensitive one about this. Its not a fit my man and you dont have your ducks in a row when talking about the Avs needs and pipelines that's all

I want to be clear: I am not offended and not trying to defend a thought that aimlessly popped into my mind today. I totally understand and respect where you are coming from. I just looked at the roster and thought that it could work; not that the Avs should do it. We are all good here and I thank you for your thoughts.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 10:20 p.m.

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Quoting: rja

Don't you think they would have traded Strome and Namestnikov by now if they could have? I was saying to trade them when they dealt for Fox! Teams are not stupid they know what the Rangers need to do.

I also think what I suggested in the last post (the two 2020 2nds the Predators possess with a condition on a resign, plus a prospect) is a very good deal for someone who has only 1 year left on his deal. Second rounders are still good prospects, especially in an upcoming draft that is very deep.

And to put things in perspective, the Rangers tried to trade Kreider to the Avs for the 16th overall already, and it was declined. I know the Avs are not a team that will sacrifice a first rounder to win now (notice how I said they would not sacrifice a first rounder, but I do think they'd give up a third for an impact player), but I am not sure if any team is willing to trade their first rounder in this upcoming draft.

why are you trying so hard to sell a package for 82 games Chris Kreider that is a good bit less than the cost of 22 games of Kevin Hayes?

It's OK man, you don't have to try to used car salesman this. It's a bad offer and we'll just move on and you'll do better next time.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 10:26 p.m.

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Quoting: Sagecoll

why are you trying so hard to sell a package for 82 games Chris Kreider that is a good bit less than the cost of 22 games of Kevin Hayes?

It's OK man, you don't have to try to used car salesman this. It's a bad offer and we'll just move on and you'll do better next time.

First, look at previous offseasons; you'll find that the price does not change much from the beginning of the season compared to a deadline. Prices are pretty rigid.

Second, you're getting another pick in the trade compared to Hayes, who is a Center, and Centers typically yield more. If NYR could get a first for him that would be great; I just think teams recognize that this upcoming draft is talented and deep, and that the NYR are above the cap. If anything changes then yes it's certainly possible they could grab a first for Kreider (and if you sift through all my posts you'll see that I truly believe he's worth a first), but as of now the Rangers are in a predicament, and everyone knows it.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 10:30 p.m.

#20

UpsideDownQue

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Quoting: rja

@moli92 are you up in arms about what I proposed?

I dont think its terrible. By the trade deadline if we have some injuries up front I think Bonino is definitely an option, but I dont think Sakic would give up Meloche + a 3rd rounder. I think Meloche is definitely expendable since we have multiple young RHDs in the system ahead of him plus EJ, but if we were to move him I think we could get a better impact player for that package.

I think Bonino would fetch a return similar to Colin Wilson a few years ago (I believe it was a 4th rounder). I would be willing to do a 3rd rounder for him since Bonino > Wilson (Bonino plays all situations and has more experience in playoffs), plus we could maybe add a lesser prospect if you retained some salary.

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Jul. 29, 2019 at 10:31 p.m.

#21

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Quoting: Sagecoll

why are you trying so hard to sell a package for 82 games Chris Kreider that is a good bit less than the cost of 22 games of Kevin Hayes?

It's OK man, you don't have to try to used car salesman this. It's a bad offer and we'll just move on and you'll do better next time.

As an example in recent years of value rigidity, compare what the Devils traded for Marcus Johansson on a July 2, and see what they got back in return at a deadline. Similar to what NYR did with McQuaid.

Jul. 29, 2019 at 10:38 p.m.

#22