SalarySwishSalarySwish
Forums/Armchair-GM

Saw this proposed on hfboards by a Flames fan

Created by: Richard88
Team: 2020-21 Colorado Avalanche
Initial Creation Date: Feb. 21, 2021
Published: Feb. 21, 2021
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
COL
  1. Backlund, Mikael ($1,150,000 retained)
  2. Bennett, Sam
Additional Details:
This trade was proposed by a Flames fan here:

https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/flames-shake-up.2805742/

I added Pateryn and some retention to balance the cap.
CGY
  1. Compher, J.T.
  2. Pateryn, Greg
  3. Timmins, Conor
  4. 2021 1st round pick (COL)
Additional Details:
Caphits: $7.9m to Colorado and $4.425m to Calgary, so $3.475m net.

Obviously Colorado can't take on that much cap, especially given the term on Backlund's contract.

As such, Colorado add Pateryn ($1.175m caphit in the minors) to bring that difference down to $2.3m, and then Calgary retain half of that ($1.15m)
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2021
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
2022
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
2023
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the COL
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
21$81,500,000$80,370,554$0$5,000,000$1,129,446
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,571,429$5,571,429
LW, C
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$6,300,000$6,300,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$9,250,000$9,250,000
RW, C
UFA - 5
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$4,900,000$4,900,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$4,500,000$4,500,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LW, RW
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,500,000$2,500,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Calgary Flames
$4,200,000$4,200,000
C
NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$3,900,000$3,900,000
RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Calgary Flames
$2,550,000$2,550,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$874,125$874,125
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,850,000$2,850,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$4,100,000$4,100,000
LD
UFA - 4
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$880,833$880,833 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
RD
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$3,333,333$3,333,333
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$894,167$894,167 (Performance Bonus$2,500,000$2M)
LD/RD
RFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$5,000,000$5,000,000
LD/RD
UFA - 7
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$2,000,000$2,000,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$3,166,667$3,166,667
LD
UFA - 3
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$6,000,000$6,000,000
RD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 3
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$1,800,000$1,800,000
C, LW
UFA - 1
Taxi Squad
Logo of the Colorado Avalanche
$725,000$725,000 ($0$0$0$0)
RW, LW
UFA - 2

Embed Code

  • To display this team on another website or blog, add this iFrame to the appropriate page
  • Customize the height attribute in the iFrame code below to fit your website appropriately. Minimum recommended: 400px.

Text-Embed

Click to Highlight
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:15 p.m.
#1
KFTW
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jul. 2018
Posts: 42,102
Likes: 23,475
Bad trade for Colorado
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:20 p.m.
#2
Pop Pop
Avatar of the user
Joined: Feb. 2018
Posts: 14,425
Likes: 8,192
Bennet I think they should look at but I can't see a need for backlund.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:20 p.m.
#3
Brace for the Storm
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 12,840
Likes: 6,647
Quoting: csick
Bad trade for Colorado


Ya, I wouldn't give much for Backlund at this point and I'm sky high on Timmins.
If I'm Sakic this is a quick decline.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:23 p.m.
#4
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: csick
Bad trade for Colorado


Quoting: Jfstompers
Bennet I think they should look at but I can't see a need for backlund.


Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Ya, I wouldn't give much for Backlund at this point and I'm sky high on Timmins.
If I'm Sakic this is a quick decline.


Am I missing something with Backlund? His possession stats are the best in the league, and he's consistently put up 45-50 points while getting Selke votes the last 4 years. I know that he's 31 which might be off-putting due to the term remaining, but he's playing great this season, and with some retention it would be affordable at 3C.
VijayPatel11 liked this.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:31 p.m.
#5
Avatar of the user
Joined: Sep. 2020
Posts: 1,431
Likes: 852
I don’t really like this trade for the avs, understandable why a flames fan wants this, it’s definitely a better trade for the flames.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:39 p.m.
#6
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2019
Posts: 3,446
Likes: 1,805
Quoting: Richard88
Am I missing something with Backlund? His possession stats are the best in the league, and he's consistently put up 45-50 points while getting Selke votes the last 4 years. I know that he's 31 which might be off-putting due to the term remaining, but he's playing great this season, and with some retention it would be affordable at 3C.


No, your not missing anything. Supremely underrated. This is just an overpay. Compher and Bennett is a probably a wash with advantage Compher. Pateryn is an irrelevant cap dump. That leaves Timmons and a 1st for Backlund. Backs is probably worth one of those pieces and a 3rd/4th. Not both. If I’m Colorado I probably hold onto Timmins as well.
Byram-Makar
Girard-Timmins
Toews-Graves


Yeesh. Best D core in the league. Two Norris caliber guys, two guys who could be solid 1-2s and a 5-6 that consists of a 2-3 and a 3-4
Richard88 liked this.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 9:58 p.m.
#7
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: TheFlamingC
No, your not missing anything. Supremely underrated. This is just an overpay. Compher and Bennett is a probably a wash with advantage Compher. Pateryn is an irrelevant cap dump. That leaves Timmons and a 1st for Backlund. Backs is probably worth one of those pieces and a 3rd/4th. Not both. If I’m Colorado I probably hold onto Timmins as well.
Byram-Makar
Girard-Timmins
Toews-Graves

Yeesh. Best D core in the league. Two Norris caliber guys, two guys who could be solid 1-2s and a 5-6 that consists of a 2-3 and a 3-4


Thanks for your feedback, much appreciated.

Why wouldn't Backlund be worth a 1st + good young player? Is it merely his age and the contract? If it's the contract Calgary could retain to make it more balanced in terms of value if they wanted both assets.

I mean, I'm not trying to give Timmins away here, but I'm just curious why Backlund wouldn't have higher value at $4.35m ($1m retained). His possession metrics are 2nd only to Mackinnon right now among centers. Admittedly that's playing in a 3rd line role rather than against top line opponents as a 2C, but putting up those numbers as a 3C is still impressive and that's exactly the role he'd be playing with Colorado.

From what I can tell he's quite comparable in advanced stats to Danault who Avs fans lose their minds over. The only difference is that Backlund is a bit older and has a bigger contract. But if you get him at $4.35m x 3 wouldn't that be better value than whatever giant contract Danault wants to sign this offseason (eg. he rejected $5m x 6 already).

Btw, it's worth keeping in mind that Avs are right in their cup window now, so solving their biggest need at 3C is essential. Avs also have two RHD's in Barron and Helleson in the pipeline so the loss of Timmins would be manageable.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 10:35 p.m.
#8
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2019
Posts: 3,446
Likes: 1,805
Quoting: Richard88
Thanks for your feedback, much appreciated.

Why wouldn't Backlund be worth a 1st + good young player? Is it merely his age and the contract? If it's the contract Calgary could retain to make it more balanced in terms of value if they wanted both assets.

I mean, I'm not trying to give Timmins away here, but I'm just curious why Backlund wouldn't have higher value at $4.35m ($1m retained). His possession metrics are 2nd only to Mackinnon right now among centers. Admittedly that's playing in a 3rd line role rather than against top line opponents as a 2C, but putting up those numbers as a 3C is still impressive and that's exactly the role he'd be playing with Colorado.

From what I can tell he's quite comparable in advanced stats to Danault who Avs fans lose their minds over. The only difference is that Backlund is a bit older and has a bigger contract. But if you get him at $4.35m x 3 wouldn't that be better value than whatever giant contract Danault wants to sign this offseason (eg. he rejected $5m x 6 already).

Btw, it's worth keeping in mind that Avs are right in their cup window now, so solving their biggest need at 3C is essential. Avs also have two RHD's in Barron and Helleson in the pipeline so the loss of Timmins would be manageable.


Ok, if it works for Colorado, Calgary certainly isn’t rejecting it because I like it for Calgary as well. It’s just because of Backlunds age and to a lesser extent his contract term, not AAV that I don’t think he’s worth it. I think it’s just a better Danault. If you flipped him and Danault and Backs played in Montreal, then he’d be regarded as a god. Just market size and fan stupidity
Richard88 liked this.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 11:24 p.m.
#9
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: TheFlamingC
Ok, if it works for Colorado, Calgary certainly isn’t rejecting it because I like it for Calgary as well. It’s just because of Backlunds age and to a lesser extent his contract term, not AAV that I don’t think he’s worth it. I think it’s just a better Danault. If you flipped him and Danault and Backs played in Montreal, then he’d be regarded as a god. Just market size and fan stupidity


I'm more of a fan of the Backlund part of the deal than having Bennett there. Bennett just adds a bunch of unnecessary capspace to the deal to overcomplicate it.

Would something like Compher + 1st/Timmins for Backlund ($1m retained) work? Just gauging value here so please indicate if it's off. My sense is that Avs would need to add something extra for retention, without which this trade would be a non-starter because Avs can't afford $5.35m for a 3C. I would also guess that Calgary would rather want Timmins than a late 1st given their RHD need, is that correct?

Regarding Danault, he has some of the best possession metrics in the league so it's not surprising that he gets some fanfare. However, it certainly hasn't hurt him to play with Gallagher and Tatar, two other possession monsters. Backlund's possession metrics this season while playing on the 3rd line are immense (2nd only to Mackinnon in Corsi among centers in the league), and that would be a huge addition for Colorado. Others will disagree though given his age and term on the contract. I see it as a move that can fix the Avs' biggest weakness (3C) during their prime cup window.
TheFlamingC liked this.
Feb. 21, 2021 at 11:35 p.m.
#10
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Pond_Duck
I don’t really like this trade for the avs, understandable why a flames fan wants this, it’s definitely a better trade for the flames.


What is it about the trade you don't like?

Backlund is a very good 3C putting up numbers comparable to Danault defensively along with 5 straight 45 point seasons. Pretty much exactly what the Avs need.

His age and term on the contract aren't ideal, but manageable if you add some retention to the trade.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:52 a.m.
#11
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2019
Posts: 3,446
Likes: 1,805
Quoting: Richard88
I'm more of a fan of the Backlund part of the deal than having Bennett there. Bennett just adds a bunch of unnecessary capspace to the deal to overcomplicate it.

Would something like Compher + 1st/Timmins for Backlund ($1m retained) work? Just gauging value here so please indicate if it's off. My sense is that Avs would need to add something extra for retention, without which this trade would be a non-starter because Avs can't afford $5.35m for a 3C. I would also guess that Calgary would rather want Timmins than a late 1st given their RHD need, is that correct?

Regarding Danault, he has some of the best possession metrics in the league so it's not surprising that he gets some fanfare. However, it certainly hasn't hurt him to play with Gallagher and Tatar, two other possession monsters. Backlund's possession metrics this season while playing on the 3rd line are immense (2nd only to Mackinnon in Corsi among centers in the league), and that would be a huge addition for Colorado. Others will disagree though given his age and term on the contract. I see it as a move that can fix the Avs' biggest weakness (3C) during their prime cup window.


I think Compher + Timmins for Backs + Bennett is fair. RD isn’t a position of need this year, it’s a strength, but we do need a RD for the future once Tanev declines
Richard88 liked this.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 1:13 a.m.
#12
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: TheFlamingC
I think Compher + Timmins for Backs + Bennett is fair. RD isn’t a position of need this year, it’s a strength, but we do need a RD for the future once Tanev declines


For some reason I still think of Calgary as having a desperate need for RHD. With Anderson and Tanev they're pretty solid there, but yeah with Timmins they'd have a great trio on the right.

The issue with including Bennett as well is that it moves too much money to Colorado, unless there's 50% retention on Backlund.
TheFlamingC liked this.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 8:35 a.m.
#13
Avatar of the user
Joined: Sep. 2020
Posts: 1,431
Likes: 852
Quoting: Richard88
What is it about the trade you don't like?

Backlund is a very good 3C putting up numbers comparable to Danault defensively along with 5 straight 45 point seasons. Pretty much exactly what the Avs need.

His age and term on the contract aren't ideal, but manageable if you add some retention to the trade.

My problem is what the Avalanche are giving up not necessary what they are getting back.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:00 p.m.
#14
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2019
Posts: 3,446
Likes: 1,805
Quoting: Richard88
For some reason I still think of Calgary as having a desperate need for RHD. With Anderson and Tanev they're pretty solid there, but yeah with Timmins they'd have a great trio on the right.

The issue with including Bennett as well is that it moves too much money to Colorado, unless there's 50% retention on Backlund.


Yeah I don’t think they could swing a 50 retention on Backs, and they’d obviously rather keep Bennett if you guys were willing to do without including him
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:15 p.m.
#15
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: TheFlamingC
Yeah I don’t think they could swing a 50 retention on Backs, and they’d obviously rather keep Bennett if you guys were willing to do without including him


How about this:

Backlund ($2m retained) + Bennett ($1m retained) for Compher ($1m retained) + Timmins + 1st

($3.35m x 4) + ($1.55m x 1) for ($2.5m x 3) + ($925k x 1)

^ That's $4.9m for $3.425m (Avs take on ~$1.5m).

2020/21: $3m retention for CGY, $1m retention for COL.
2021/22: $2m retention for CGY, $1m retention for COL.
2022/23: $2m retention for CGY, $1m retention for COL.
2023/24: $2m retention for CGY

That effectively manages the retention through out the duration of the contracts, rather than just having an outright $2m retention for CGY throughout.

This season Avs would benefit from $2m net retention ($3m vs $1m, though the actual dollars are only 22% of that as it's at the deadline), but in next year and the year after it's only $1m retained effectively. Then in the final year when Backlund is 34-35 years old Avs would get an extra $1m off the books when Compher's contract expires, which builds some leeway into the trade to compensate for Backlund aging.
TheFlamingC liked this.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:41 p.m.
#16
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Pond_Duck
My problem is what the Avalanche are giving up not necessary what they are getting back.


How so?

The trade breaks down as:

Compher for Bennett

and

Elite 3C at near $4m AAV (due to retention) for late 1st + Timmins.

Avs solve their biggest need (3C) and also pick up a guy who brings physicality like no one else in the playoffs from the 4th line. All for the cost of Compher (a near capdump), a late 1st, and a RHD who is a bit redundant anyways given our top 4 and Barron/Helleson in the pipeline.

Maybe 1st AND Timmins is a bit overkill, but I'd gladly pay a little extra to ensure that we get some serious retention on Backlund.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:47 p.m.
#17
Dirty_dangles_37
Avatar of the user
Joined: Oct. 2020
Posts: 600
Likes: 206
avs could get better players for that and i hate bennet im not baised but you could easily get better players for that plus i kinda like are locker chem so I im thinking someone to help 1/2 second to win Stanley cause bennet would play 3rd
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:57 p.m.
#18
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Dirty_dangles37
avs could get better players for that and i hate bennet im not baised but you could easily get better players for that plus i kinda like are locker chem so I im thinking someone to help 1/2 second to win Stanley cause bennet would play 3rd

Who would you target with that package?
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:58 p.m.
#19
Dirty_dangles_37
Avatar of the user
Joined: Oct. 2020
Posts: 600
Likes: 206
Quoting: Richard88
Who would you target with that package?


ryan strome
Feb. 22, 2021 at 12:59 p.m.
#20
Dirty_dangles_37
Avatar of the user
Joined: Oct. 2020
Posts: 600
Likes: 206
Quoting: Dirty_dangles37
ryan strome


for less
Feb. 22, 2021 at 1:24 p.m.
#21
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Dirty_dangles37
ryan strome


Strome isn't a great fit on a checking line. $4.5m for another year is also bad value. Rangers can't move a C out as well given how weak they are at that position.
Feb. 22, 2021 at 1:33 p.m.
#22
Dirty_dangles_37
Avatar of the user
Joined: Oct. 2020
Posts: 600
Likes: 206
Quoting: Richard88
Strome isn't a great fit on a checking line. $4.5m for another year is also bad value. Rangers can't move a C out as well given how weak they are at that position.


he playes wing and can easily replace kadri when he is injured he would be cheep and we could add more to retain
Feb. 22, 2021 at 2:08 p.m.
#23
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Dirty_dangles37
he playes wing and can easily replace kadri when he is injured he would be cheep and we could add more to retain


What would you offer NYR for Strome (50% retained)?
Feb. 22, 2021 at 2:25 p.m.
#24
Dirty_dangles_37
Avatar of the user
Joined: Oct. 2020
Posts: 600
Likes: 206
Quoting: Richard88
What would you offer NYR for Strome (50% retained)?


compher timmins and 3rd
Feb. 22, 2021 at 3:06 p.m.
#25
Thread Starter
John 3 16
Avatar of the user
Joined: Apr. 2020
Posts: 9,570
Likes: 4,614
Quoting: Dirty_dangles37
compher timmins and 3rd


Ok. I don't think Strome is worth Timmins even with retention. Strome is a one dimensional 30-35 point forward who had an outlier year playing with Panarin. I think Avs could do better than him if they move Timmins.
 
Reply
To create a post please Login or Register
Question:
Options:
Add Option
Submit Poll