Yes, your other statements were opinions bud. What don’t u understand about this??

And I guess u have trouble reading too. Petterson 19.5 minutes in 2019-20. 2nd pairing minutes and I said multiple times why his minutes average went down last year.

This season the Pens basically had 2 2nd pairings. With Pettersson/Marino and Matheson/Ceci.

And when Matheson/Ceci got hot towards the end of the season. And were playing as good as any pairing in the NHL, they played a ton of 5x5 minutes. Marino got his minutes on the PP and PK. And it took Pettersson minutes per game average down.

Go look at game logs at the beginning of the season. One game Pettersson/Marino would play 18-22 minutes. The next night Matheson/Ceci would.

Until the end of the year and the play-offs when Matheson/Ceci started playing super well and got hot.

And rightfully so they got more minutes. Pettersson average 19.5 Minutes per game in 2019-20 and was paired with Marino all season on the 2nd pairing.

And speaking of Marino. His stats took a dive when they paired Matheson with him. And they go up with Pettersson as his pairing.

Again, long stick, long reach. Very good defensively, defensively responsible, barely makes mistakes, contributes enough offensively. Never a minus(-) in his career. Plus 39 for his career. Good analytics and underlying numbers.

Never gonna be a Point on a PP..?? again, that’s not his game.

Again, he’s very defensively responsible. Again, a plus 39 for his career. Has a good shot, joins the rush well.

Contributes enough offensively. His stats prove that and according to u, on 3rd pairing minutes.

Marino is asked to join the rush on that pairing. Not Pettersson. And Pens have Letang, a top 5 Point on the PP in the NHL still. And Marino on the 2nd unit PP.

I guess guys like B.Carlo, Nurse, Dumoulin, who are the bigger, more defensive side of their pairings are worthless too. Cause they will never be a anchor on a PP either.

It’s just gonna be an agree to disagree. And that’s fine man. U arnt convinced me he’s a bum. I watch every Pens game. He’s very good defensively, makes few mistakes and is still young with play-off experience.

Fans like u want the flashy guys, instead of the defensively responsible guys that contribute to winning teams. That GMs definitely value. Guys that make few mistakes and still contribute offensively enough.

I mean even see the J.Johnson contract, J.Shultz contract, Savard trade, Ian Cole trade, Zaitsev contract and trade, Ceci contract, Matheson trade, etc. even average/bad D-man have value in the NHL.

And if Pettersson made 3.8M, everyone would say it’s a good contract. It’s the 4 that throws people off. It’s 4.025M(4,025,000) not 4.2M.

I bet I can go back on you posts and see u wanting your GM to pick-up Gostisbhere, or A.DeAngello or Mete..lol.

I quoted you the TOI originally and fully understand that simple metric. You know your argument is flawed when you resort to personal attacks. The only opinion I said was what exactly? If you actually cared to read that post you’d see that I asked questions and provided context to them. You took the typical approach of you’ve seen player X more than me but then when I said I’ve watched him even pre-draft your argument crumbled. He’s never shown the ability to anchor a PP so again I ask where is this potential you speak of? How is he any different than someone like Ghostbear or Gardiner who were on waivers this year and actually fill a need for Detroit (LHD PPQB).

Yeah, I’m thrilled for a 15 pt pace 4M third pairing defender. That’s your argument?

“I guess guys like B.Carlo, Nurse, Dumoulin, who are the bigger, more defensive side of their pairings are worthless too. Cause they will never be a anchor on a PP either.”

Look at my avatar… I’ve been a huge advocate of two way guys or at least guys being competent in their own end. You resort to this retort because I asked where MP is going to grow instead of answering my question.

“ It’s just gonna be an agree to disagree. And that’s fine man. U arnt convinced me he’s a bum”

Never once called him a bum but rather a 4-5D currently and said I’d rather keep Bert over a package of lesser assets.

“ I mean even see the J.Johnson contract, J.Shultz contract, Savard trade, Ian Cole trade, Zaitsev contract and trade, Ceci contract, Matheson trade, etc. even average/bad D-man have value in the NHL.”

So now the argument is some GMs have made bad moves?

“ And if Pettersson made 3.8M, everyone would say it’s a good contract. It’s the 4 that throws people off. It’s 4.025M(4,025,000) not 4.2M.”

That’s your speculation, I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone say well if he made 200k less I’d love to acquire him. I think people are aware the difference between $9.99 and $10 is a penny…

“ I bet I can go back on you posts and see u wanting your GM to pick-up Gostisbhere, or A.DeAngello or Mete..lol.”
Good luck, only one you’ll see is Ghostbear with assets attached. Again resorting to personal attacks, do better.

Clearly I’m not in the “minority” based on other poster’s comments. I’m not saying that as a defense better rather maybe instead of trying to slander others you actually try to engage in civil dialogue.

Dude come on, the opinion comments were back when u said, “arbitrary like meaning lopsided”

I Replied “ in your opinion” go back and look man. U make no sense.

And again, You said, “ Just because he plays for your team doesn’t make him not mediocre and overpaid”.

I said “again, that’s your opinion”.

I even said “the only stat u stated was his minutes per game” and again for the last time, 19.5 minutes in 19-20, 2nd pairing minutes.

And I explained why they went down last season. Reread if u care. I wrote it twice already. Not writing and explaining it again if u don’t read it.

Go back and re read and look at the chain. I’m not repeating or explaining things to u over and over anymore.

It’s never ending. Agree to disagree man.

U just don’t get it. U say this or that is my argument when I clearly state what my argument is.

I mean, Again and Again, I keep repeating myself over and over. Read the comments 1st, then respond.

No It’s Not my argument. Like I said, D-men have value in the NHL. Even bad/averages ones. So young ones, with experience and 3 solid seasons probably do too.

And ya, I see now, u were definitely clambering for A.DeAngello and Gostisbhere..lol. That’s what I thought!! Lol.

Petterson was never put on waivers. And never will be.

He’s had 20 plus points in 2 out of the last 3 seasons. And was on pace for the close to that last season, with according to u, 3rd pairing minutes. But really just reduced minutes(u can read the reason why in my last post if u care, I’m not explaining it again).

And more points than Cholowski, Stecher and Dekeyser the last 3 seasons.

That’s contributing offensively while staying defensively sound, making very few mistakes. And staying a plus. Being a good pairing and continuing having good analytics and underlying numbers.


Its ok though. Its common.

Most people/fans want the flashy guys. Not the defensively sound guys, that make few mistakes, and still contribute enough offensively, that are critical to a winning team.

Right, Pettersson has nothing to do with the Pens success over the last seasons. And Detroit’s recent lack of, has nothing to do with defensively liabilities. They really wouldn’t benefit from accruing Pettersson.

Keep clambering for Gostisbhere, DeAngello and Mete, when literally no GMs in the whole NHL would touch them, for free.

It’s common to want the flashy guys that make careless mistakes, takes shifts off and are bad defensively. And the complete opposites like Pettersson are called overpaid and mediocre.

https://www.capfriendly.com/qualifying-offer-calculator/tyler-bertuzzi
Bertuzzi's qualifying offer is higher than your offer. He wouldn't take it. Also, Bertuzzi is better than McCann. He puts up more points on a much worse team.
Detroit could sign someone like John Merrill for half of Pettersson's contract, who would be roughly as effective.
Detroit doesn't need wingers. Legare wouldn't be above Raymond, Zadina, or probably even Berggren on the depth chart, so he's little to no value added. A 5th round pick is also basically no value added.
Hard pass from Detroit. They need offense, not defense. They only allowed 13 more goals than Pittsburgh this season, with a less talented roster. Your trade proposal addresses none of their needs and adds to their weaknesses.

Good deal. That’s fine. Look at Merrill stats/analytics and look at Pettersson. They are even in the same realm of a D-man. Not to mention the age difference. Pettersson offensive stats are even superior and according to you guys 3rd pairing minutes.

Cool, good luck. Everyone thinks they can do better with the cap space. That’s fine. I get it.

But u would have to trade for the player to, if they were even available or get that player to sign with Detroit. And most likely will have to overpay right now in order to get a quality D-man to sign in Detroit/not a contending team.

McCann has had back to back 35 point seasons and 32 points last year in 42 games. And he can play Center. Bertuzzi isn’t far above the player McCann is. They are very similar statistically. . And McCann has chemistry on that line already.

So, let's look at some statistics, then some context.
https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/frozenpool_compare.php?period=2020-2021:R:99&players[]=3925&players[]=4630
https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/jon-merrill
https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/marcus-pettersson

A quick peek shows Petterssson as better statistically. Look at their line combinations. Pettersson spent almost 60% of his playing time with John Marino, who could have a case made to have been better than any D iced by Detroit last year. Merrill's partners were Marc Staal at 25% time (a fringe NHLer), Patrik Nemeth 16% (a 5-6 Defensive D), Christian Djoos 11% (now playing in the Swiss League), and Filip Hronek 10% (a good middle pairing D who had a pretty bad year). Average TOI is 18:15 for Merrill and 16:29 for Pettersson. Add in that Detroit's style last year was defense at the cost of offense, and Pettersson doesn't look quite as far ahead of Merrill as you claim, in my opinion.

My main point here is that Detroit got enough quality out of Merrill for $925K as a middle pairing D. You could make the argument that Pettersson is better, but I don't see him being $3M a season better when you apply some context to the stats. Detroit is still going to be bad next season, so why not sign another player of Merrill's caliber and pedigree instead of trading assets to make your 2nd paring potentially somewhat better. Besides, Detroit has a ton of cap space, and can afford to overpay a few guys next season regardless. Yzerman convinced 5 UFAs to sign in Detroit last season, after the worst season in the salary cap era (Namestnikov, Stetcher, Greiss, Merrill, and Bobby Ryan). I doubt he'll have any trouble with that now.

McCann can potentially play center, but Bertuzzi is a regular 20 goal scorer on a team that doesn't play offense. 7 points in 9 games before his season ending injury. Maybe McCann had an outlier season, or maybe he had a breakout season, we won't know until next year. Until then, Bert's consistent production is more valuable than McCann, even if McCann can play 3C.

To be honest, I don't think the Pens and Wings make good trading partners. Wings are looking for young elite prospects and picks, which isn't something the Pens have. And the Pens are looking for better-than-complimentary pieces, which the Wings don't have enough of to part with.

McCann had 19 goals and 35 points in 18-19. Had 14 goals and 35 points in 19-20 and played Center on a bad 3rd line. He was the only playmaker on that line and had to make plays for his bad linemates at Center. It’s why he went down to from 19 goals the year b4 to 14 goals.

And he had 32 points in 42 games last season. He just turned 25 years old in May and is a year younger than Bertuzzi. Those are 3 very good season in a row for a young player.

McCann is actually just as proven in NHL. I don’t know what u are talking about.