1. core is still more then good to compete.

2. next year we have more then 15 mil to work with

3. and if you manage to trade Pete you have almost 20 mil to build around this core for the next two seasons.

As a Caps fan I want to believe this is true but it isn't. Still a good team with a great coach. Wouldn't give up hope yet.

If I can counter - because I don't see how they can't.

They had 103 points last year - and 113 the year before(over 82 game season). Last year they were 10th in GF and 5th in GA. 3rd best PK unit and 2nd best save %. 7th in XGF, 9th in xGA, and 8th in GF%. It's hard to find teams that are this good all around. So they are basically top 10 in the league on both sides of the puck, with elite PK and goalie play - and have no glaring weaknesses.

They outplayed the ECF finalist Rangers team by a good margin in the first round. That was easily an ECF Pens team last year. And on top of all of this, they have a better roster this year than last. I'm not saying they are a favorite - but based on this info they are most definitely a contender.

The old stars you are referencing - Crosby scored at a 100 point pace, Malkin a ppg pace, and Letang just had the most points of his entire career and came 7th in Norris voting.

The way they can contend is by adding more of the youth to the lineup. Poulin, Puustinen, Hallander, O'Conner, Zohorna. We need more speed to surround our core. I think as is we can make a good run. Petrey I think will be really really good, massive upgrade to our D, which is absolutely stacked. Ty Smith I think could turn out great too. The issue is, I don't think we have enough speed to beat a team like the Avalanche. Which is why adding more youth could help and give us a better chance. Next offseason too we have a ton of cap space, we could get huge upgrades to compete 1-2 more years. It will be the offseason where we have the biggest chance to improve. Btw I don't think the Kraken would accept, but I love that trade.

The core looks good enough, the supporting cast doesn't

They haven't won a playoff round since 2018. How are you not giving up hope yet?

Do they have a better roster than last year? Also, no guarantee that those team statistics or even some of those individual statistics can be replicated

Their D-core isn't stacked, it's above average at best. Pens don't need anymore speed, they're already arguably the fastest team in the league

Letang Petrey Rutta on the right hand is stacked. And we are no where near fastest team in the league. No way are we close to the Avalanche or many of those teams. We are one of the oldest teams, we need to insert the youth.

Not denying the team needs to add youth, but Letang, Petry, and Rutta isn't stacked. Letang should be good, but I don't see him being a top 10 defender next season. I think Petry is a bit of a wildcard, and Rutta is just an expensive third pair defenseman that can step up into the top 4 in a pinch and hold his own, but he won't excel there. You can't tell me the Penguins don't play fast, they're always playing fast when I watch them

Yes - I would say absolutely they do. The forward group is basically adding Rakell and losing Rodrigues - that's better. Plus last year they didn't have Malkin for the first half of the year. The D core is adding Petry, Rutta, and Smith/POJ and losing Marino and Matheson. That's better as well.

Obviously there's no guarantee - but you could say that about literally every team then.

I mean, in terms of lateral moves, I'll tell you that I think the Calgary Flames are at best as good as they were last year, but not better. For the Pens, I have time for the argument that they incrementally improved, but I still don't know that it's enough to contend

Yeah I mean I'm not trying to say they had some amazing offseason where they drastically improved. The team is very similar but the small changes compared to last season do make them better - even if it's by a small amount.

As far as the contending part - I feel like I provided enough in my original comment to prove that they can. There isn't much more I can say. I guess we'll just have to disagree. I'm not calling them a favorite or anything, but no doubt a contender. They're arguably the 4th best team in the East. I consider that a contender.