Needed the 1st from TOR to acquire Meier ($8-9mil/yr would be the max I recommend) and with Chychrun and Sandin (who is very Young and should continue to improve) coming in, we can afford to move Weegar. I'd have done a Trade with OTT instead, but TOR has better NHL Ready Replacement Players in Holl and Sandin

I want Looch gone. Kerfoot would be a good Playmaker and Defensively Responsible LW for the 4th line. With Dube & Duehr, it'd be more like a 2nd/3rd line imo

I believe ARI is concerned about Chychrun's injury history and reliability and are finally ready to pull the pin on something. Hanifin is young enough to build around or valuable enough to flip next season, so it might appeal to them to just move Chychrun so they're done with that hanging over their heads

Doesn't have to be the Oilers, but it's debatable whether assisting EDM to acquire Ghost and taking a 5th away from them to so would really be "helping them" lol

Huberdeau is from Quebec and has had previous success with Dadonov, Hoffman and is Good Friends & Trains with Drouin. The Prospects need a Leader who can help them through the inevitable slumps and adversity they will go through, someone who has done it before and they will respect, they can't lead themselves and won't respect Hoffman, Dadonov, Drouin or Gallagher like they will Huberdeau.

It's very simple to look at Huberdeau's struggles this season moving to a new team and to dismiss his last season and rest of his career. He's clearly uncomfortable and might be better suited in Quebec or back in the Eastern Conference. His style of play isn't physical, so there's no reason he won't be able to play and produce all the way up to 37, like Malkin, Ovechkin, Kejci, Pavelski and so on.

Dach would have to jump from 0.65PPG to 1.00PPG+ to score as many points as Huberdeau will this season, and that's IF Huberdeau maintains his 0.70PPG pace. Huberdeau is far more likely to jump to 1.00PPG than Dach is. My assumption is that MTL will do everything possible to bring PLD in when he becomes a Free Agent and in the meantime, bringing in Huberdeau might convince Drouin to stay on a very Team Friendly contract. MTL probably moves Dvorak but re-signs Monahan on a discount to get his value up to hopefully get a 1st for him, which isn't happening this year. If CGY sent Coronato in the deal, that's another Centre they can build around who is both Younger and Arguably Projected to be better than Dach

Coronato, Roy and Mesar will all be in the NHL next year and full time by the next season after that. They have the Size, Skill and Draft Pedigree to suggest their guaranteed NHL Players. I mean they're all more likely to be in the NHL than Farrell, Kidney or Beck, so the same could be said of those guys not being "Guarantees". The lines I wrote out were more for next season or the season after.

Weegar is worth more than a late 1st, a 3rd pairing UFA defenseman (Holl), an undersized fringe defenseman (Sandin) who won't last in the NHL and a low end prospect (Villeneuve). Make it Tanev for Holl and the 1st (Toronto can keep other 2) and sure. Holl wouldn't even be strictly necessary but Toronto will need to move some salary out and Calgary is going need someone to replace Tanev this year anyhow so it might as well be Holl.

We don't want Farrell if we don't have Coronato, so I originally sent French Canadian Jakob Pelletier, but you complained about him and suggested Coronato. So I provided you the option of Coronato instead if MTL sent Owen beck instead of Farrell, which actually probably works better. CGY gets the Bigger Albertan Right Shot C in Dach and MTL gets the More Valuable East Coast Born Right Shot C/RW in Coronato to play with their LW Prospect Farrell and all the other LW's they have: Caufield, Slafkovsky, Huberdeau, Hoffman, Heineman, Tuch, etc. I do find it funny you pointed out Pelletier's size considering MTL's Best Player = Caufield is Tiny and one of their "Top Prospects" in Farrell isn't much Bigger. We like Bigger Players too, but there's something special about Pelletier, his two-way play reminds me of Johnny Gaudreau or a Left Shot DeBrincat, so we're more than happy to keep him

The Best comparable to Huberdeau is Johnny Gaudreau who signed for $9.75mil x 7 years. I'll concede Huberdeau got 1 year and $750k more than he probably should have, but he's also Bigger and More Consistent than Gaudreau and CGY seems to have to pay a Premium to Sign Top Talent, so it is what it is. I'd say Josh Anderson is the one who's over paid by $1.5-2.5mil. He's a 3rd Line Winger who's only produced 0.40-0.46PPG over the past 3 seasons, which is worth more like $3-4mil/yr. Given Anderson's injury history and style of play, I bet he becomes Lucic 2.0. Lucic's effectiveness and play dropped off significantly after 28, so you're going to get way better years and production out of Huberdeau over the next 8 years than we likely get out of Anderson over the next 4. 0.40PPG Players = Josh Anderson aren't worth a 1st+, without $1.5mil+ in retention. Anderson's currently worth maybe a 2nd and Boeser would be a much better target for a similar price without retention.

Svechnikov, Marchand and Stamkos are simply terrible comparisons. One was a 21 year old RFA and the other 2 signed their contracts 6-7 years ago. To your point though, $10.5mil/yr is not going to look nearly as bad 7 years from now; it's comparable to Stamkos signing for $8.5mil. The Cap and therefore Salaries on New Contracts go up over time, it's called Inflation

The bottom line here is you seem to think Huberdeau is garbage all of a sudden now because he's struggling in CGY, yet Josh Anderson hasn't been a very good producer and you value him as much as Dach, which is wild. You, like many MTL Fans, WAY OVER VALUE Your Players and Prospects and Under Value Every Other Teams. I think it's you who really needs to #🧂 on this one 🤣 Take Care and See You Around!

I might be over valuing Sandin, but he was a 1st Round Pick and seems to be playing well for his age both with the Leafs and Internationally. I guess my hope is that's he's better than Kylington and would become a future Chychrun/Hanifin replacement as well. I'd be fine/happy with Tanev for Holl + 1st + Villeneuve. I'm 100% with you on Tanev getting older, not being reliable enough for us and using his cap hit elsewhere

I disagree with just about everything you wrote here.

To begin with Gallagher is likely the only player you mention in your first paragraph that will be part of the team next season so Huberdeau's relationship with them is quite irrelevant. Also MTL have plenty of veterans who have earned their respect. Suzuki (you know the guy wearing the C on his sweater), Caufield, Gallagher, Anderson, Evans and Armia have all been to the Stanley Cup Final before while Edmundson, Savard and Allen have won the thing. Leadership actually seems to be more of a problem on the Flames than the Habs at the moment.

Secondly, maybe this is just a bump in the road and Huberdeau can go back to his previous form. Maybe he can't and this is the beginning of a massive decline. Either way that is a very bad bet for a rebuilding team to make.

Dach and Huberdeau are literally 4 points apart that is far from an insurmountable task. Also Dach's career trajectory seems very similar to Huberdeau's own at the same age and while Huberdeau doesn't play physical, Dach does. Should also be said that there doesn't seem to be any interest on either side for Drouin to stay in MTL. He's had his chances and I think everyone would like to move on. As for Coronato, I don't where you get that projection from but he certainly doesn't project better than Dach.

Finally I have no idea where you got the idea where you are pulling these ideas from. Coronato is being significantly outscored by Farrell on the same team I'm at a loss about how he projects as having more impact potential. Coronato, Mesar and Roy are listed at 5'10, 5'10 and 6' respectively so size isn't exactly a huge positive in their favor and their pedigree is fine but not of much greater significance than the others you mention. By the way just about every prospect report I have seen or heard has Farrell and Beck over Roy and Mesar so I once again have no idea where you are taking your information from.

In conclusion it seems like any trade dealing Huberdeau to MTL would be of much greater benefit to Calgary than the Habs and see no reason why that would be advisable from my perspective.

Of course you don’t. You’re probably one of those guys who think Josh Anderson, Edmundson, Monahan and Hoffman are worth 1st Round Picks. There’s no interest in any of those guys, nor Dadonov or Drouin, so MTL Fans won’t get anything close to their expectations for those Players

Things could change if Huberdeau played out the season in MTL. Maybe Dadonov or Drouin stick around for super cheap and you’re definitely stuck with Hoffman and Gallagher. Edmundson’s career is over and Monahan isn’t healthy enough to be Traded this season, so you’ll have to sign him to a value contract to see if you can get something for him next season.

Dach hasn’t really lived up to his Draft Pedigree and has had a slow start, whereas Coronato’s future looks bright and he could step in and out produce Dach from the get go. There’s more to hockey than just stats and scoring btw and projecting how a guy will do in the NHL vs. In Junior or College is another consideration, but I’m happy to review and be educated by these Prospect Reports if you’re willing to share them

I appreciate your opinion and hesitation on Huberdeau, but the overall package is fair and worth consideration for both teams. It’s not like CGY wouldn’t be taking back a massive gamble in Anderson or giving up promising Prospects in the deal either. Agree to Disagree!? 🤨

I think you miss the point, let's break this trade into parts
Huberdeau vs Dach both scoring at similar pace, Dach is younger, cheaper, not even in his prime yet, plays a more valuable position, plays physical and is better defensively. Dach is simply more valuable of the two.

Anderson vs Pelletier/Coronato, Anderson is bigger, proven at the NHL level, is on pace for 20+ goals, has a decent contract (overpaid by 500k to 1 mil) and will only be 32 when his contract expires vs 38 of Huberdeau. Anderson is the better player right now.

Farrell/Beck vs Ruzicka this isn't even close as far as prospects go, both Habs prospects have way higher ceilings and higher floors as well. In fact Farrell and Beck's floors are higher than Ruzicka's ceiling, it's like comparing Coronoto to Mysak, simply ridiculous. Habs prospects are both better

Kidney vs nothing in return, hmmm this one is soooo hard to guage! Would you rather have a middle 6C prospect who is tearing up the QMJHL or would you rather have nothing?! We all know Kidney is way better than nothing

So broken down into parts every part has the Habs giving up the better player and then they also give up Kidney for free. That's how ridiculous this offer is, it's rather insulting! If you can't see that then you need to go back and learn a few more things about hockey

Dach is more Valuable than Huberdeau, but Huberdeau is WAY WAY more Valuable than Josh Anderson

Coronato and Pelletier are Much Higher Rated and Projected Prospects than Beck and Farrell and Ruzicka is Greater than Kidney

Dach =< Coronato + Ruzicka
Huberdeau >= Beck + Kidney + Josh Anderson

The point is you significantly over value Josh Anderson (by a ton) and MTL’s Prospects and then you Under Value Huberdeau, Ruzicka, Coronato and Pelletier. Ruzicka and Pelletier have both conquered the AHL and have actually made it to the NHL putting up similar offensive numbers to Dach…. None of Farrell, Beck, Kidney or Coronato for that matter have done so yet. It’s significantly different going from Junior or College Hockey to Professional AHL or NHL Hockey. I know that much.

Go ahead and put your Players and Prospects up on a pedestal and believe they are the next coming of Christ for all I care, but the overall package is fair and worth consideration for both sides, hence why I posted it. Sorry, but there’s nothing I can really do about your feelings or you feeling insulted, that’s all on you and under your sole control

Ok... so first of all a player is simply worth what somebody is willing to pay for them. I don't know how GMs value the players you mentioned but if insiders like Friedman, Lebrun and CJ report the asking price on a player I tend to view that as close to their value (I've rarely heard them say a guy is priced at a 1st and the return ends up being less than a 2nd+). If another team shares this view then the trade happens, otherwise clearly the team that most values him is his current team. Nobody thought Ristolainen, Chiarot, Savard, Coleman, Goodrow, Hartman, Griffin Reinhart and many others were worth 1st round picks and yet it only took one GM to make it so. Our opinions don't always align with those of the people in charge. To your point Monahan and Edmundson being injured are not returning a 1st and Hoffman was never worth that. For Anderson only time will tell but I'm not opposed to keeping him.

Again maybe things do change if he goes to MTL but that still requires MTL to make a completely unnecessary gamble to get that answer. Sure Dadonov and Drouin could stick around for super cheap but that wasn't the issue, more so why either player or management would want to. As for Hoffman sure nobody probably picks him up but I wouldn't be shocked if he gets bought out. Gallagher isn't really a problem, he likely ends up LTIRetired in a year or 2.

I mean Dach is on pace for about 55 points at 22 years of age, he's doing just fine. Sure Coronato could step in and outproduce Dach but he could also just as easily not do so. I'll take the smooth-skating 6'4 guy doing it in the show already over the 5'10 guy who might some day. For my general prospect reports I usually defer to The Athletic's Scott Wheeler who wrote up his top 50 prospects 2 weeks ago. For what its worth Coronato comes in at 27, Ferrell and Beck come in at 41 and 50 respectively and Roy and Mesar gain honorable mentions as do Zary and Pelletier. For more Habs related prospects I read and listen to Hadi Kalakeche, Patrik Bexell, Marc Dumont and Marco D'Amico who provide excellent coverage of the team's prospects for various outlets.

Rational people can disagree but for me Dach is a building block who's age fits perfectly in the range they are building around and has abilities that I rate highly. His inclusion is a big turnoff for me. The main difference between the gamble on Anderson and Huberdeau is double the term and nearly double the cap. For a team targeting a competitive window in 2-4 years Anderson's contract is far less problematic IMO. I'm ok with MTL taking gambles but not on 30 year olds.

Arguing with you is as pointless as arguing with a 2 year old but they at least listen to reason. Your comps are ridiculous, you seriously think Coronato and Ruzicka are better than Dach?! That right there says all you need to know about your player evaluation! I suppose next you will be saying Coronato os better than McDavid. Also Ruzicka has never hit 80 points in any league Kidney is on pace for more than 100 and you say I overvalued our prospects LMAO!!! A great goalie once said "Prospects are great to have but until they prove they belong in this league they are just prospects!" Saying any prospect is more valuable than proven top 6 centers is just moronic and shows how little you know about Hockey!

Yeah, I understood you didn’t like the idea from the get go and that’s perfectly fine. All we can do here is make our best guess, try to support or explain our reasons and hope we’re right when the future inevitably gives us the answer

Kirby at 0.50-0.65PPG and climbing + Anderson at 0.40-0.46PPG and declining vs. Coronato or Pelletier at 0.50PPG and climbing + Huberdeau at 0.70-1.44PPG and declining is how I look at it

If you already have Suzuki, will soon get PLD (no guarantees but there’s a good probability) and can have both Coronato and Ruzicka, will you really not be able to rebuild without Dach!?

You don’t have to agree or like it, that’s not how this works. Maybe I’m wrong then again maybe I’m right, it’s just hypothetical, guessing and making predictions. Nothing worth getting overly serious or upset about imo

Player and Prospect Values certainly change in time, but who is any more of an Expert than the GM’s and Scouts who Drafted these guys:

Coronato - 13th Overall (value is the same or higher now)
Zary - 24th Overall (value is the same)
Pelletier - 26th Overall (value is higher now)
Ruzicka - 109th Overall (value is much higher now)
Wolf - 214th Overall (value is WAY WAY WAY higher now)

Dach - 3rd Overall (value is a tad lower now)
Mesar - 26th Overall (value is same)
Beck - 33rd Overall (value is slightly higher now)
Kidney - 63rd Overall (value is pretty much the same)
Farrell - 124th Overall (value is much higher now)
Roy - 150th Overall (value is much higher now)

I have never seen such an argument on capfriendly before. It’s like I’m reading a chapter book

What’s with the insults!? Does it make you feel good or do you think it helps cement your position!? It makes you look silly af

Now you’re comparing Dach to McDavid. Who’s out to lunch now!? I said Coronato + Ruzicka >= Dach. We don’t know about Coronato yet, but Ruzicka has done just as much in the NHL as Dach so far…. Kidney plays in the QMJHL, which is the most offensive and weakest defensive Junior League in North America.

Anyways, I’m not arguing, I’m merely supporting my position, but if you want to get mad, upset and insulting, I honestly have no more time to waste on you. This isn’t real life, it’s a friggen hockey forum for discussion and fun for heavens sake. You don’t come across as having much fun. I truly hope things go your way more and get better for you.

Take Care 🏒 🥅

You’re kidding right lol. Are You Not Entertained!? 👏

These types of posters seem to follow and want to engage with me way too much. Everybody just wants to be right and when what they say is either challenged or disputed, they need to resort to bully and insult tactics to try and submit somebody to accept their position, because again, they have to be right. It’s the most important thing in life and ppl often actually lose or cut off friends and family who don’t agree or share the same opinion or view as them. That’s how important it is to them to be right

The direction this world is going with social media is unbelievable. I’m just here to have some fun and talk hockey, but inevitable somebody wants to get in to it and berate me if I don’t agree with them. I’ve gotten used to it

You can't be serious, Dach has 94 points in 206 games played Ruzicka has played a grand total of 72 games and has 31 points, the clincher here, Ruzicka was drafter 2 years before Dach! So how has Ruzicka proven as much as Dach has exactly?! Dach is younger, has more points, more GP and the topper is a top 6 center. Ruzicka is older, has less games played, less points and is a bottom 6 winger! Yup he for sure has proven as much at the NHL level as Dach has ROFLMFAO!!!!

For me this trade simply comes down to adding a player I don't believe my team should acquire and trading away a player I firmly believe they should keep. Huberdeau can definitely be better than he has shown this season but a contending (or close to that status) team should be making that gamble, not a rebuilding one.



Haha it seems we finally found something we agree on! Cheers!

You’re absolutely hilarious without trying to be 🤣

Ruzicka won’t need nearly as much ice time to eclipse Dach’s offensive production.

Dach 31G + 63A = 94PTS in 206GP -22
GPG: 0.15 PPG: 0.46 FO%: 35.5% ATOI: 16:59 PPTOI: 482
VS.
Ruzicka 11G + 20A = 31PTS in 72GP +11
GPG: O.15 PPG: 0.43 FO%: 46.4 ATOI: 11:04 PPTOI: 83.3

Ruzicka has the same or better stats in nearly all categories, yet Dach needed over 53% more ice time and received almost 6 times as much Power Play time to contribute as much as Ruzicka does in the very limited ice time he receives (mostly on the 4th line) and with significantly less skilled line mates

You clearly don’t know much about the Flames or Ruzicka at all. He played all 4th line minutes last season and has been 50% 4th line and 50% 1st and 3rd line minutes this season. He sat to start the season (Sutter prefers to Play Veterans over Rookies), but stepped in and was scoring 1.00PPG on the 1st line. He’s on a 10+ Game 4th line slump right now, otherwise his numbers would be even higher than Dach’s

Ruzicka has clearly been more Effective & Efficient with his ice time and Better Offensively, Better Defensively and is Better at Faceoffs than Dach too. You probably didn’t even know Ruzicka is a C/RW yet Sutter plays him primarily at LW. He’s improperly and under utilized AFAIC. He could stand to be more Physical otherwise he’s played better than Dach all thing considered

I like Dach more because he’s bigger, more physical, younger, from Alberta and we need a RW, but Ruzicka could very well have a better career in the end than Dach does

You suggest I should learn more about hockey, yet I just schooled you with a lesson son. I’m out now, you’re simply not worth my time or attention anymore mic 🎤 drops

In 6 years since being drafted, Ruzicka still hasn't earned a full-time roster spot! That is all that has to be said about the difference between Dach and Ruzicka! Now since you can't seem to grasp this concept and I am tired of trying to teach you something about hockey only to have it fall on deaf ears, welcome to my ignore list!

HaHa. Oh no, I’m not gonna have to deal with you, your snarky comments and insults anymore. Do you promise!?

Sounds like you have a list, which means you aren’t very good at educating people to share your opinions and beliefs, so you must banish them all to the dreaded ignore list. You’re so not tolerant of others and their opinions

Maybe it’s you that has more to learn, I mean just because anybody can make the Blackhawks or Canadiens Top-6, doesn’t mean they’ll make the Flames Roster at all.

The Flames are by far the most difficult team and road to make the NHL as a Prospect. They believe in longer development and give preferential treatment to the Veterans, especially with Sutter behind the bench, but for sure you’re right, that means Ruzicka’s terrible instead. Even though I proved to you he’s just as good, if not better than Dach

Okay, sorry for hurting your feelings and for not giving in to your delusional belief that’s Dach is comparable to McDavid and the 2nd coming of Christ is coming via MTL’s Prospect Pipeline. 😭 NOT!

Bye from Planet Earth 🌍 You’re in Your Own lil Galaxy now

As others have said the MTL trade is bad for MTL. Dach and Pelletier were both 2019 draft picks, and Dach is the better player right now and is signed to a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons. Ruzicka is a decent 3rd liner right now, but isn't really a player I can see MTL moving prospects for. Huberdeau is easily far better than Anderson and has way more on ice value. However, Anderson's contract expires sooner, opening up more cap to resign younger players who are performing well and MTL is unlikely to be competitive until Huberdeau is 31 so they are taking a big risk on his contract becoming a massive anchor just as they are looking to compete again. They value might be fair in a vacuum, it likely even favours MTL a bit, but with MTL mid rebuild it's not good value for them.

That’s a fair assessment.

I could debate that Dach was rushed in to the NHL too soon and whether that was the best decision for his development, but he was also a Top-10 Pick and had the size to jump right in to the NHL. Doesn’t always work, I mean Slafkovsky wasn’t able to do it either.

The McDavid’s Draisaitl’s, Malkin’s and Crosby’s etc. are a rare breed and my personal belief is this next generation doesn’t have the same level of maturity, but that’s neither here nor there.

Ruzicka might have been a decent guy to bring in for Slaf & Mesar was my mindset otherwise I would have added a Pick, but I do think it’s a better deal for MTL, but does it fit their plans, that part I won’t argue more than the Mentorship Huberdeau would provide for the Young Gun Forwards MTL has coming up

I think Jeff Skinner struggled in BUF because he didn’t have a guy he respected enough to mentor him. Who was he supposed to go to, Eichel!? These guys’s ego’s are so high and sensitive, in my head they have to admire and respect you and they just won’t do that as much with a declining 0.50PPG Veteran they know they’re better than. I could be wrong, but it my head, they’re probably like “what is this guy gonna do to help me break this slump” whereas they’d approach Huby and say wtf and Huby would tell them the stories they need/want to hear.

Don’t mind all the other drama. Camp came across as snarky and condescending, so I typically mirror and echo that back to posters who do that. It’s so annoying

Dach was absolutely rushed into the NHL, and now after a few years he's looking like a solid 2nd line player moving forward with time to improve. Pelletier is a good prospect but given they're the same age it's a stupid move for MTL to swap them.
I'm doubtful Ruzicka would make much difference in Mesar and Slafkovsky's development, and I wouldn't trade Farrell for that gamble at this point.

Huberdeau hasn't really done anything to command respect in MTL's locker room at this point. He's on pace for less than 60 points and has been out of the 1st round once. If he bounces back and plays like a star again, sure, he'll command some respect but right now he's an overpaid Veteran with almost no playoff success in the NHL. I think playoff success likely commands a solid amount of respect on it's own and MTL has guys that have gone deep. Again, it's not worth the risk of that contract when they are out of Anderson's 4 years sooner and have an extra 5M to use in the meantime on a guy like Dubois if he hits free agency.

Completely makes sense. I appreciate your input

Thanks for posting! 👍

No problem, I like discussing trades like this. It's interesting figuring out what fair value should be (and watching the TDL make a complete mockery of it), even if it's not a good fit do to a teams situation.