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Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 11:30 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Claesson4Norris</b></div><div>Ottawa needs MORE of what Zub brings, not less. He's the D partner for their cornerstone Dman.</div></div>
Fair comment, and what I expected to hear from non Canucks fans. Was trying to post something I haven’t seen yet.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 11:28 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>emoprettyboy</b></div><div>Sens simply can't afford lose Zub for anything less than a major overpay</div></div>
That’s fair, to be honest I didn’t think Sens fans would be a fan of the deal, but I try not to post the same AGM trades that everyone else does.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 11:25 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Xspyrit</b></div><div>Canucks shouldn't trade a 1st liner and Sens can't even afford to move Zub. Both teams don't want to do that, even though it would fill a really big need for the Canucks
This is kind of an overpay, but as tempting as it is, Sens can't even do it due to the unhealthy balance of LHD strength vs RHD</div></div>
Is it an overpay though? A top pairing RD in his 20’s on a bargain contract for another 3 seasons after this one, that holds a LOT of value.
Kuzemko has a good contract as well but it’s only for one more season after this one, and wingers are not nearly as valuable nor as hard to acquire.. I think the value is pretty fair overall here.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 11:21 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Borocop</b></div><div>Is the point of this tool not to post different opinions?</div></div>
That was my understanding. Maybe I’ll have to reread the site rules…
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 11:20 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>remowilliams</b></div><div>YOUR opinion.Do you REALLY think they would trade Kuzy.Come on at least keep it real.</div></div>
We’ll I sure hope it was MY opinion, or someone has hacked my account, thanks for pointing out the obvious there bud.
I’m sure Vancouver would prefer not to trade Kuzemko, but they have smart people running the organization and if they can improve the team by moving him then yes I absolutely think they would, he’s certainly not “untouchable”.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 8:43 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>remowilliams</b></div><div>Canucks pass.Not a chance we trade Kuzy hes a keeper.IMHO.</div></div>
I disagree. If they can add a top pairing RD with term on a great contract for a winger I think they absolutely make this trade.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 5:50 a.m.
Thread:
Kuzmenko for
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Canuckfan98</b></div><div>Out of all the wingers Kuzmenko is the guy you keep, tbh tho I doubt Ottawa even does this, that being said I'd rather spend a 1st instead of a roster player at the TDL if we are going to continue this pace.</div></div>
Out of all the wingers the team has, Kuzmenko is the most valuable. If you want to get you have to give and your not getting Zub without a real good piece leaving the team. Reallocating cap from a position of relative strength to one of weakness is something this management group has been trying to do since they took over. I think if anyone turns down this trade it's OTT, with Zub's play and contract he would be a perfect target for the Canucks but I doubt he's available.
I would also rather trade a 1st than move a guy like Kuzmenko, but Zub is worth more than a 1st and the Canucks don't have the cap space to make a splash without moving money. If they don't want to pay additional assets to move a winger it's Kuzmenko or possibly Mikheyev/BB that may be able to fetch a legitimate top 4 RD.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 3:30 a.m.
Thread:
Hunt for need
Pesce is getting more than 6.5, and likely a full 7 years.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 7, 2023 at 1:06 a.m.
Thread:
Boeser would be nice
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>GMBL</b></div><div>The window to obtain a retained Boeser is closed. Vancouver was never going to do 50%, it just doesn't make sense as they were/are trying to free up cap space so that they could comfortably sign Pettersson and also make the additions that they have done, and hope to continue to make.
With Boeser back in form, the only reason to trade him is a hockey trade that they feel improves their team, which likely means they decide to trade him for a defender and play Garland in his spot. I highly doubt that they would want to do that or that the Isles would want to move anyone from their top 4.</div></div>
I fully agree with this.
I see a lot of Canucks fans saying that BB is no longer available, I disagree with that. I do think he is available if the right hockey trade comes up, he's playing great but they still want to move money from the wings, and it's been 12 games...
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 6, 2023 at 12:32 a.m.
Thread:
Rebuild Retool
Vancouver accepts.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 6, 2023 at 12:31 a.m.
Thread:
Starting the sell off
I think Vancouver for sure accepts that. The cost to move Garland without retention is more than a 3rd.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 6, 2023 at 12:26 a.m.
Thread:
A touch here and there
Can't see any of those other teams accepting.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 5, 2023 at 3:17 p.m.
Thread:
Posting so I have some comments to read tomorrow at work
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SGB88</b></div><div>I've worked up comps for Dube, keep in mind these were traded as RFA's vs in-season with retention to be fair so that for sure would speak to increasing Dube's value.
I went back a while and we've got Burakovsky. I think he's a worse comparable than Kunin. Burakosky is 6'3", Kunin is 6'0" and Dube is 5'11". Dube is in the under sized scoring winger with questionable defence and Burakosky was large fast winger with questionable defence. I think Burakosky sets a pretty good ceiling for value here, which was a 2nd, 3rd and a sweetner. So the range is a 3rd (plus sweetener) to 2nd, and 3rd (plus a sweetener).
For interest here was the last 3 years of performance of each player on per game basis leading up to the trade and Dube's last 3 years
Dube Kunin Burakosky
g/g a/g g/g a/g g/g a/g
.22 .53 .24 .14 .19 .36
.23 .18 .26 .24 .21 .23
.22 .13 .18 .20 .16 .17
Also keep in mind Kunin was 2 year youngers during those seasons. So Idk man the more I look at it, the more Kunin looks like a great comp, but it will depend on how Dube does this year I guess? Also advance stats put Dube's defence as very bad to be clear.
I agree Raty's value isn't crazy, that's why I put it a second, which I think is fair at this point. The point about him being the top center prospect wasn't to suggest he was worth more, just more why the Canucks really shouldn't trade him.
I think in season let's say no retention 3rd and 4th with another 4th with retention.
Last season was the season I was talking about because I think the greater value of Boeser is his defensive play plus his scoring. Like I said I see him as Toffoli, who would be the comp. Personally, I'd say keep Boeser and find a way to trade Garland for the RD maybe tap 4th and 3rd you're using the Dube trade. Maybe target Jensen or TVR who I think are both better choices and there seems to be interest from Washington for a trade like that (I prefer TVR for the lower hit).
If you can get the Hayton trade done at that cost I think it's probably a smart move, but I really hate losing Hoglander.</div></div>
I appreciate you putting time into your response, you make some good points.
Doesn't have to be Dube the team acquires, but if Boeser were to be moved it would be wise to bring in another middle six that can replace some of what he brings. I agree Burakosky would be a more expensive addition than Dube. It probably costs a 4th for 1M retention on Dube, maybe a 3rd.
Raty I think is worth probably a late 2nd to early 3rd at this point.
As for Murphy, doesn't have to be him either. I would be completely fine with a TVR or quite a few other options, but since this team is trying to win now I do think it's an area that should have a fairly substantial upgrade if they want to try and win a round or two.
Overall I don't think we are too far off on our evaluations.
I don't have a problem with trading Garland, my issue is if it's going to cost assets to move him, especially retention. I definitely don't think this team is out of the woods when it comes to cap issues and with OEL's dead money increasing next season, I have a hard time with Vancouver having more dead money on the books. That said I also don't think it would be wise to part with significant young assets to avoid paying retention and I believe those costs would be higher than 3rd-4th round picks... tough line to walk.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 5, 2023 at 1:15 p.m.
Thread:
Posting so I have some comments to read tomorrow at work
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SGB88</b></div><div>The best comp for Dube is Kunin, who was traded for a 3rd and you want to trade a 3rd, 4th, and our number one center prospect, who's worth at least a 2nd. We're losing Hoglander and Boeser so we're downgrading on wing to Dube. The team is now way worse on the wing and you paid a lot for the privilege.
Connor Murphy is not good, he's old and on a risky contract. He doesn't justify making the team worse. Boeser has had one bad season, which was pretty explainable considering what he was going through who is back to the form which he's consistently had in the past. I'm not talking his blazing-hot scoring, which is a nice bonus, but obliviously unstainable. I'm talking about his defensive play while, playing toughs and still putting up consistent top-winger points, which was doing for multiple seasons before last year. He's turning into Toffoli.
The Hayton one actually isn't bad to be honest. I was probably a little harsh. But the other two, especially the Dube were not great so this one got caught in the crossfire. I don't know if I would do it and I have a feeling Arizona wouldn't. I also really like Hoglander so you know feels. But this one could make the Canucks better and isn't crazy so sorry for the overreaction.</div></div>
Your opinion is certainly valid and you make some good points but I disagree with some of them.
Kunin was traded after having a 13 goal 22 point season with his career highest point total being 31 and goals being 15. Dube had 45 points last season and has had back to back 18 goal seasons. Although they may be comparable to a degree, I think Dube is the more valuable of the two. When it comes to cost, Ratty may be Vancouver's top rated center prospect but that says more about Vancouver's lack of center prospect depth than it does Raty's potential. Raty floor is an AHL player, his ceiling is a decent two way 3rd line player, and that is what Dube already is. So if Raty hits his celling you are getting a player around Dube's level. The 3rd is essentially paid incase as insurance as you are already getting a known value asset and Raty may not reach his ceiling, the 4th is for the retention. I feel like that's a pretty even value deal.
See I don't see Murphy as being on a risky contract at all, for a top 4 RD 4.4M is a bargain. I'm not saying Murphy is a top pairing guy but he's certainly a top 4, and his underlying numbers would certainly be better if he wasn't playing for Chicago. I think his style would be a good fit with Hughes and the difference in $ between him and Boeser would open up space for Vancouver to resign Bear. Essentially this trade allows Vancouver to trade from an area of relative strength to add a top 4 RD and a fringe top 4 RD, that is a significant boost for a team that currently has a Hronek, a bottom pair RD (Myers) and a 7th D in Friedman.
Out of curiosity, when was this one bad season for Boeser? The guy has fallen between 45-55 points in every single season he has played. Injuries aside (which are a concern), he has paced himself as a 65 point player over his career. I know his defensive game was poorer last season but overall his offensive numbers have been fairly consistent. His offensive numbers aren't bad but by adding all the additions here and substracting the players going out, I still think this team is far better after these moves.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 5, 2023 at 11:14 a.m.
Thread:
Posting so I have some comments to read tomorrow at work
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>audiodave</b></div><div>I don't think this improves the Canucks. Why trade Boeser when he is finally playing up to his potential?</div></div>
I have been moving BB in AGM's since I have been on this site. I like the player (and person), he does has high end potential but I don't think he will ever consistently put it together year over year and be able to stay healthy in the mean time. This is WAY to small a sample size to say he has finally reached his potential, I would like to see at least back to back full seasons before I am convinced.
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SGB88</b></div><div>All of these trades are absolutely brutal for the Canucks. Why would they do any of these?</div></div>
Lol, how are they brutal?
BB has been inconsistent for the majority of his entire career, the team has been trying to move a winger since Allvin took over to reallocate cap to more pressing positions of weakness, and so far they have been unable to do so. Even if BB has a strong year leading into the deadline, he hasn't proven to be a high end consistent offensive contributor, nor has he proven to be someone that is reliably healthy. With Murphy added, they have another top 4 RD that would be a great partner with Hughes who is cost controlled for another 2 seasons after this one. The team is still in a serious cap crunch and that cost efficient contract would hold massive value for a team like Vancouver. This would also allow Hronek to play on a the second pair with Cole who he also looked good playing with, giving Vancouver a balanced blueline. Also, if the team is to move a winger, which they still want to do, why trade a decent one like Garland if your going to have to retain and may still not get a positive asset back? I would personally rather trade a Boeser than Garland at this point..
Dube is a fairly young middle 6 piece that could partially help fill the void left by Boeser, he's also an RFA after this season so there is some team control. Vancouver is giving up a B prospect, a 3rd (stats say 3rd's are more likely to never turn into an NHL player) and a 4th for retention.
Hayton is a bit of a gamble, but there are giving up gambles for him. That said he had a strong year last year (19 goals and 43 points), is still young (23), plays center, is good at faceoffs and is a two way player. Vancouver gives up Hoglander who has been inconsistent so far during his career and may need a change of scenery, Klimovich has potential and is young, was decent last year but is being benched in the AHL this year, and a 3rd round pick.
I think this team is definitely better with these swaps.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 5, 2023 at 9:55 a.m.
Thread:
Heard this one proposed on the radio this morning
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Dickie_Dunn</b></div><div>I wouldn't trade Lekkermaki for Johnson straight up..........................</div></div>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SGB88</b></div><div>Lekkermaki is having a good season, but that's a little much. That's a trade you do instantly.</div></div>
This is why I made the AGM, I thought it would make for some differing opinions, which for me makes the most interesting AGM's.
Personally I'm not sure I give all three assets for Johnson but I would definitely trade Lekkermaki straight up for him and probably one of the other two assets as well.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 8:53 p.m.
Thread:
Heard this one proposed on the radio this morning
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>KINGS67</b></div><div>Why is Kent Johnson being traded for?
He on the block or something?</div></div>
Probably not. Was just an analyst spit balling out there trade ideas. He picked Johnson due to the reasons mv21227 stated and that Johnson is a local kid. I thought it was interesting.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 8:51 p.m.
Thread:
Heard this one proposed on the radio this morning
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>remowilliams</b></div><div>Canucks pass. IMHO.Dont believe everything you hear.The radio is not a credible source.</div></div>
It didn't come from a source or rumor, just a analyst throwing out his thoughts. I found it interesting.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 2:09 p.m.
Thread:
A couple near deadline moves
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>remowilliams</b></div><div>As a Nucks fan i respectfully disagree.I think we sign a younger dman ie Bear and leave the perfectly great pair of Hughes and Hronek alone.Just My opinion.</div></div>
Sorry, are we disagreeing that Boeser would be available? That Pesce would pair with Hughes? Or both?
I have no problem with a Hronek Hughes pair. With that said if Pesce was on the team I would prefer the more defensive minded Pesce with Hughes and the more offensive Hronek with Cole as I think it would balance the blueline nicely.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 12:09 p.m.
Thread:
A couple near deadline moves
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>remowilliams</b></div><div>Cant see the Canucks trading Brock for a pending UFA.</div></div>
I can. They have been unsuccessfully trying to reallocate cap from the wings since they took over.
Reports are Pesce is looking for 8-8.5 (believe that's what I saw) on a long term deal. Boeser makes 6.65, so for an additional 1.4-2M they could essentially swap Boeser for Pesce. I think they take in a heart beat, even if Boeser continues at his currant pace (CAR wouldn't consider the trade if he doesn't).
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 11:44 a.m.
Thread:
A couple near deadline moves
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>evelutions2</b></div><div>If that’s the best the Canucks can offer, Canes will gladly keep Pesce.</div></div>
I mean that's kind of what I figured.
My thought for this AGM was if CAR was shopping him in the summer for more scoring help, and if Boeser keeps on his current pace until the deadline (35-40 goals, 70-80 points) then maybe they would have some interest assuming thier blueline is healthy going into the deadline. If Boeser keeps on this pace he is worth every bit of his current contract (he's also a good two way player), and would be signed for two additional seasons.
I'm not personally convinced yet that Boeser's game has made long term change, however this is the first season where the personal tragedy's he's been dealing with appear to finally been resolved (as best they can), I am interested to see how the rest of his season turns out.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 4, 2023 at 11:30 a.m.
Thread:
If petterson wants out
Even if EP does become available (doubtful), that's not close. There needs to be a high end young D included, at the very least.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 2, 2023 at 6:09 p.m.
Thread:
GetterDoneConny
Cost is to high for Vancouver. Would rather pay the 1st and BRZUSTEWICZ for Hanifin than for the Tanev package, assuming there could be an extension worked out with the player. Tanev may be a piece they look at adding in the offseason, but he's not the main piece coming back if they are trading high end young assets. If Vancouver trades young pieces it will have to be for a reasonably young player with contract certainty.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 2, 2023 at 2:07 p.m.
Thread:
One for one
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Lancebmx</b></div><div>I would think Jersey just keeps McLeod, no incentive to do that trade.</div></div>
Ya, I figured Vancouver could use a shake up in their bottom 6. Hoglander is having a decent start but I personally like McLeod and thought they may be interested in a possible swap for two players that may benefit from a change of scenery, I feel both players have more potential then they have shown. McLeod is a couple years older and has more games played, both have roughly the same amount of points. Vancouver may have to add a 3rd or similar value prospect to even things out, if NJ would have any interest.
Forum:
Armchair-GM
Nov. 2, 2023 at 9:54 a.m.
Thread:
Habs expedited rebuild
Vancouver won't trade EP for futures, even if management wanted too ownership would veto that, they want to win now.
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