I like the trade but in reality I think MTL should get a decent player for patch.

Jokiharju is a very good player. He's very very close to NHL ready.

Thats what I think too

I think this trade makes alot of sense for Montreal, but it shouldn't do anything for Chicago, in my eyes they are closer to rebuilding than contending and they will need more than Patches to get to that spot. As a Habs fan I would be really happy

I mean that Montreal needs NHL ready players that can play immediately.

I thought about that, and they can still trade him before the TDL, they still have decent young RD in Boqvist, Krys and Raddysh, I think Chicago will still try to compete this year

All about perspective. If this is an acceptable offer for Patches now, what was Bostons offer to NYR for Nash? I know people are down on Pacioretty he's not worthless either.

Nash (50%) at last years TDL:
Ryan Spooner, Matt Beleskey (50%), Ryan Lindgren and round 1st 2018 (Bernard Docker)

Jokiharju = Bernard Docker
2nd 2019 = Lindgren
6th does not equal Spooner+Beleskey (50%) (Spooner easily worth a late 2nd rounder and Beleskey at 50% is barely a nuisance. Half of his remaining 1.9 can be buried in the AHL making his actual cap hit only 800K..

And even if the last part was equal in your mind, that's for 20 regular season games of Nash and 1 playoff. Trading for Pacioretty now gives you 82 games and a 1 playoff. So that has to be compensated for.

Not too mention Pacioretty is 29, Nash is 34 and the thing people seem to forget that even in his worst offensive season of his career, Pacioretty still managed more points in less games than Nash did last year......in virtually the same amount of games last year in NYR, Nash only had 1 more goal than Pacioretty did.......

I get teams not wanting to give high end quality pieces for Pacioretty simply because the leverage has tilted away from MTL a bit, but we better be getting at the very least quantity then.

Hawks are closer to rebuilding than to contending so to trade away a blue chip defensive prospect who is almost NHL ready and draft picks for a 30 year old winger just can't happen.
more would have to come on the montreal side to Chicago if they really wanted to pry Jokiharju out of there.

players value spikes at the deadline due to teams trying to make a run at the cup. Players values are lower at times like right now. And Jokiharju does not equal Docker but nice try

Lower? Now is the best time to make trades because you have oodles of time before the start of the year and you can be patient if need be..... the salary cap is even inflated 10% to accommodate teams during this period between July 1st and the end of training camp. If players values were lowered so much right now, Ottawa wouldn't be trading Karlsson now. Buffalo wouldn't of traded ROR now and all the big blockbuster deals that have happened over the past while wouldn't have happened in the off season.....

As for Jokiharju not being at least similar to Docker in value, they literally both were drafted 26-29 in their respective drafts. Play RHD. Are ~6'0 and 180-190 lbs. Drafted only 1 year apart and are almost literally 1 year in age apart..... but Im sure you have extensive data to back up your claim. Go ahead, Im listening.

It’s better than other trades I’ve seen for him.

for one, Jokiharju has been playing in a better, more respected league (QMJHL) that produces more NHL talent than the AJHL. Also, Jokiharju faces better talents in his league and is still putting up better numbers than Docker. 71 points in 63 games for henri vs 41 pts in 49 games for Docker. On top of all that Jokiharju is more NHL ready which is a huge asset. Jokiharju can make the NHL this season while Docker will be playing in the NCAA this upcoming season. Jokiharju has represented Finland in international tournaments and again, Docker has only played in the AJHL. Lastly, Jokiharju is the faster, more offensive defenseman that the entire NHL is shifting towards.

All right since you asked for it.

Yeah you know who else came out of the AJHL that year Jokiharju was selected? Cale Makar. The 4th overall pick that year.....

Jokiharju is simply closer to NHL ready.......by 1 year. Yeah...being older than the other guy generally does that for you. But once again, has Jokiharju played NHL hockey yet either? No, so who cares? Both are prospects still.

Oh we're talking point totals are we? Might want to relook at when those years happened.... At the same age Jokiharju had 48 points in 71 games. Docker had 41 points in 48. Meaning a higher PPG...

I'm not going to dignify playing in WJC as a notch over another player. P-O Joseph the guy taken ahead of Jokiharju at 23rd wasn't playing for team Canada either.... Guess he's a nobody? Plus Canada drafts 3 times as many players than Finnish players so making team Canada is harder than Finland.

But good try taking the time to look up some generic statistics and basically just using your opinion to convince yourself. The worst part is, I'm not even trying to bash Jokiharju at all. Just saying Docker''s value is pretty similar to Jokiharju's at the same age and thus would be pretty equal in trade to jokiharju's last year at the same time......

Whats next? Jokiharju is blond thus making him 1/10th of a percentage faster thsan Docker because of "science"?

No, MTL is in a retool mode and won't be ready to compete for another couple seasons or at least one.

Jokiharju has developed as a top 10 already signed defensive talent under 20 not in the NHL yet. He isn't a top 5 but certainly in the top 10.

Based off what exactly? Once again, not trying to deflate Jokiharju here at all but where are these claims coming from? Jokiharku doesn't even make TSN's top 50 affiliated prospects and that had 13+ dmen on it...... I struggle to find Jokiharju mentioned anywhere in the same breath as any of the other regarded top 10 dmen prospects...... Just because a Hawks fan knows Jokiharju well and is able to make an educated opinion on him doesn't mean they are valid over another player they don't get to watch much at all.

I kind of feel like this is the bias every teams fans have. Fans who have very little actual viewing of the players other than Youtube and WJC content, etc but they claim their extensive knowledge can evaluate players better than others? Does anyone publication support your claims? Can we find an average of these top 10 lists that consistently show Jokiharju in that range? Nope.

Fans often confuse the best prospects in their system as being as valuable as other teams most valuable prospects like they're all even. MTL's top prospect before Kotkaniemi might not of even cracked the top 100 prospects league wide but you'll still get this reluctance to trade that prospect from Habs fans because "He's Montreal's best prospect". So what.....that's not saying much...

Jokiharju is a fine propsect and may be good one day but this idea that he's somewhere a head of the bell curve is pure opinionated. Which is fine, we all have one but its no more valid than some other random persons. Which than again, isn't saying much.

My point is that because Jokiharju is our best prospect, Chicago won't deal him unless sompthing really good comes along. And let me tell you Jokiharju, 2nd,6th for Pattriocetty is not the deal that lets a rebuiling team part with their top prospect. I didn't start all this comparing other prospects to Jokiharju... my only point was that Chicago won't do this deal

Actually one of your points was to say precisely Jokiharju and Docker aren't comparable. To which I gave ample reason as to why they were.

"And Jokiharju does not equal Docker but nice try".

But anyways if you would of just read the comment without bias, you'd see wasn't trying to force Pacioretty into the Hawks team. Simply that based on previous trades and comparable players, they should get more. That's all.

Just because one team makes a bad trade doesn't mean that changes the value of all other similar players. By that logic every filip Forsberg type player is worth a 4th liner (Martin Erat), and every second line center like matt duchene and some extras is worth a top 5 pick, a 3rd rounder, more prospects, and kyle turris. Bad trades happen and just because they do happen doesn't mean they change the value of all other trades too.

Ahhh I see your just going to argue any and every point I make ad nauseam. Well done!