SalarySwishSalarySwish
Forums/NHL

To all the Leaf Fans who Talked

Do the Leafs get out of the first round in 2022
The chart has been hidden

Poll Options


Jun. 2, 2021 at 11:43 a.m.
#1
Callfrom295
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jan. 2021
Posts: 97
Likes: 17
I appreciate you. I couldn’t be happier the leafs had such a good season where they maintained a 15+ point lead on pretty much all of the North Division teams, and essentially admitted publicly they felt the North teams were no match for this years leafs team.

I thank Leaf fans for never failing to comment under Armchair GM’s or social media posts that tout or celebrate another Canadian team, where you’d read things like “with no number one centre? Lol yeah okay enjoy first round exit” and “there’s no real talent. Compared to Toronto’s top four guys, they have literally no elite caliber players.” Or even, Matthews being asked about the North division, and saying that he hopes their will be a bigger challenge come playoff time.

Well I guess you got your wish bud.

All season (and as a negative Habs fan, rightfully so) the Habs were completely and utterly disregarded as contenders. Aside from the first 10 games of the season, once Price displayed weakness due to being injured, along with Gallagher, Chariot, and Tatar being injured, or even how quick people were to point out Drouin’s vast lack of offensive ability he’s proved this season, nobody ever even considered the Montreal Canadiens to eliminate the Leafs.

This is where the true colours of modern day post-2000s leaf fans are shown.

At the beginning of the season, we hear how this leafs team is the answer to Canada’s cup drought. Their top heavy roster was just simply superior to all the other teams. Throughout the entire season, every hockey fan has to deal with TSN, Sportsnet, and every sports broadcast panel in Canada, touting this leafs team like it’s the best team in the league, GAME IN GAME OUT (I’m mainly talking about Noodles, Hayes and O’Neil who are awful leaf homers who **** talked every Canadian team and is now spending the next week trying to recall their statements or rephrase, when really we know they’re eating their words.) every radio show, Steve dangle, name it; nobody thought this leafs team had clear flaws.

Yeah I saw the flaws early on.

1. Your stars are not at a level to take a team to the Stanley Cup finals, but they’re being paid like it.
- you overpaid your two young future stars and look what result it has gotten the Leafs since those contracts were signed. Signing Tavares was one of the most trigger happy dumb signings this franchise could have done, mainly because Tavares’ $11mil contract takes up the space you could use for:
2. At least ONE SHUT-down, dependable, x-factor defensemen. Every contender has at least one, whether they’re dominant and noticeable or not, every contending team has one stay at home consistent Dman. The leafs do not and have not had one. Reilly is an absolute beast, but that’s not his job. Reilly can get you points, goals, and can set up plays just as good as the rest of them. All you need is a Dougie Hamilton, Pietrangelo, Seth Jones, etc paired up with Reilly, yeah that’s truly scary.
3. Depth was dog****. Anybody whose watched the last 4 seasons of hockey, shook their head at the Leafs summer signings. Thornton? The guy was never all that dominant and has historically fizzled out during the playoffs literally his whole career in San Jose. That is not the grit you’re looking for and this playoff series proved that. Simmonds? He is nowhere near the guy he used to be. The grit is there but probably 75% less then it used to be. If MTL signed Simmonds, they wouldn’t have made the playoffs unless he sat. The guy isn’t useful nowadays. Vesey? Blinder pickup to distract leaf fans from actually acquiring the players the team actually needs. Bogosian?? A lame attempt at acquiring a shut down vet d-man like I just mentioned, but he’s a guy who looked mediocre on a stacked team in Tampa. The guy is washed out, and is a far cry from the type of d-man the leafs SHOULD have targeted.
4. Effort level. I’ve never seen this leafs team with its current core go full throttle to set up a goal. When you watch Tampa, or Boston, even Montreal, they TRY for their goals. They look like chickens with no heads trying to find openings. Leafs are built around a guy who makes all scoring look easy, so their goals don’t develop with the same energy as other teams (because they don’t need to rush when all they need is little openings for Marner to expose for Matthews so he can rip cheddar dogs). Though this game pace that the leafs maintained all season I feel hurt them. They never were very scary off the rush unless it was a two on one, and the only time I saw a terrifying leafs offence was during the POWERPLAY and while the team was already up.

In conclusion: STOP overrating your team during the season. Stop making hot takes about how far the leafs are going in the playoffs before they start. Stop ‘planning the parade’ as every other hockey fan calls it when the beginning of your season goes well. And LASTLY, don’t talk **** about other teams, when the faults of your own team stick out just as much. What makes someone able to identify a good leafs fan is how optimistic they are about the team.

I hope this season has taught you Leaf fans good. Good luck in the off-season. You’ll need it
A_Habs_fan and KSIxSKULLS liked this.
Jun. 2, 2021 at 12:45 p.m.
#2
torontos finest
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jul. 2019
Posts: 9,560
Likes: 11,192
2nd Favourite Team
Montreal Canadiens
Jun. 2, 2021 at 12:52 p.m.
#3
Hakuna Matata
Avatar of the user
Joined: Feb. 2020
Posts: 34,119
Likes: 20,983
I believe they will. I have a feeling they are on the verge of climbing over that wall known as R1. Tampa had that incredible season then got swept and followed that up by winning the cup. Leafs did not get swept but in a sense the same thing happened with them in the playoffs. Now I am not saying they will win it all in 2022 but I have a feeling they will get out of R1. This experience will be a learning curve for both management and the young players and will most certainly have influence on what Dubas plans for them in 2021-2022 as clearly the young guns need help as without JT they have shown they cannot lead this team.
Saskleaf liked this.
Jun. 2, 2021 at 12:56 p.m.
#4
torontos finest
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jul. 2019
Posts: 9,560
Likes: 11,192
Didn't read this entire self-indulgent wall of text, but I'll make one actual comment besides making fun of you for having the Habs as your "2nd favorite team":

Toronto was one goal away from you not being able to type this nonsense. They were one goal away twice. And I'm going to make fun of you and your team because you will 100% have the wrong takeaways from this playoff series.
Jun. 2, 2021 at 1:48 p.m.
#5
1967 Forever
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jun. 2021
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Dubas is proving you cant build a championship team using a calculator and anylitics and a dart board . Maybe he should give Maggie the monkey a try this summer.
Jun. 2, 2021 at 1:51 p.m.
#6
Hakuna Matata
Avatar of the user
Joined: Feb. 2020
Posts: 34,119
Likes: 20,983
Quoting: Leafsstink
Dubas is proving you cant build a championship team using a calculator and anylitics and a dart board . Maybe he should give Maggie the monkey a try this summer.


How did analytics play in him getting Spezza, Brodie, Bogosian, Simmonds, Thorton, Foligno.

none of those guys fit analytics. They fit leadership and skill

Everyone agrees Dubas built a championship caliber team last offseason with Skill, Grit and plenty of leadership. What happened the stars did not show up. Is that his fault no. Matthews and Marner need to realize they are the backbone of the team and need to perform better in the post season.
A_Habs_fan and Saskleaf liked this.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:22 p.m.
#7
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Next year gets tougher for TOR just because the Divisions are back to normal. TB, BOS, FLA (can they repeat this year's performance?) will be back in the same Division.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:33 p.m.
#8
WentWughes
Avatar of the user
Joined: Nov. 2016
Posts: 10,720
Likes: 10,275
Quoting: wabit
Next year gets tougher for TOR just because the Divisions are back to normal. TB, BOS, FLA (can they repeat this year's performance?) will be back in the same Division.


Don't ever count out Montreal man, they were just beat by them and our youth is just going to get better.
Brian2016 liked this.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 2:57 p.m.
#9
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
Don't ever count out Montreal man, they were just beat by them and our youth is just going to get better.


I'm not, but realistically they would have been 5th behind BOS, TB, FLA, and TOR this year if their was the normal Divisions. PIT, NYI, CAR, and WSH would have been better in the Metro. MTL and NYR would have been fighting for 9th in the East.

If it wasn't for the Play-ins then MTL would have missed the Playoffs last year too. Playoff Price needs to show up in the regular season, otherwise we won't get to watch Playoff Price at all.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 3:16 p.m.
#10
torontos finest
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jul. 2019
Posts: 9,560
Likes: 11,192
Quoting: wabit
Next year gets tougher for TOR just because the Divisions are back to normal. TB, BOS, FLA (can they repeat this year's performance?) will be back in the same Division.


Yeah well that's on them. They want to waste their chances and do things the hard way, fine by me.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:20 p.m.
#11
Avatar of the user
Joined: Dec. 2017
Posts: 5,012
Likes: 3,523
Quoting: aadoyle
How did analytics play in him getting Spezza, Brodie, Bogosian, Simmonds, Thorton, Foligno.

none of those guys fit analytics. They fit leadership and skill

Everyone agrees Dubas built a championship caliber team last offseason with Skill, Grit and plenty of leadership. What happened the stars did not show up. Is that his fault no. Matthews and Marner need to realize they are the backbone of the team and need to perform better in the post season.


I don't agree that Dubas built a championship calibre team. Marner never shows up. They need more balance. COL and TBL are light years ahead of the Leafs. This team has plenty of skill, but they're clearly too soft and they always fold under slight pressure. Playoff hockey is almost a different game than regular season hockey. It's not a skill-fest. It's a net-front grind. And Marner is simply not cut out for playoff hockey.
McGruff liked this.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:23 p.m.
#12
Avatar of the user
Joined: Dec. 2017
Posts: 5,012
Likes: 3,523
Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
Don't ever count out Montreal man, they were just beat by them and our youth is just going to get better.


The way MTL plays is really well suited for playoff hockey. They know how to grind. They're tough. They have 1/10th the skill of the Leafs, yet they totally dictated the style of play. I've been hard on the Habs, but I agree that they're only going to improve. Especially down the middle, which has been a major weakness for so long.
KSIxSKULLS liked this.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:30 p.m.
#13
Hakuna Matata
Avatar of the user
Joined: Feb. 2020
Posts: 34,119
Likes: 20,983
Edited Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:37 p.m.
Quoting: Brian2016
I don't agree that Dubas built a championship calibre team. Marner never shows up. They need more balance. COL and TBL are light years ahead of the Leafs. This team has plenty of skill, but they're clearly too soft and they always fold under slight pressure. Playoff hockey is almost a different game than regular season hockey. It's not a skill-fest. It's a net-front grind. And Marner is simply not cut out for playoff hockey.


Some players dont show up in the playoffs. Ehlers for years was a playoff no show and then finally he got his act together. Marner will do the same. And no this team was not soft. They were matching Mtl in hits every single game, some game even out hitting them. Playoff hockey is not the same per team. Some teams play more open then others while others play a more tight game. Look at Tampa vs. Florida skill-fest. Col vs. Blues skill-fest. Not every game plays a defense only series like Vegas vs. Minn was.

Also Col and Tampa are not light years ahead. Tampa is gonna go through a big regression this offseason as they are gonna lose Johnsson and one or two of Gourde, Palat, Killorn to seattle and trade. As with Kucherov back they are way over the cap. Colorado looks good but they are also gonna lose a big piece of their Dcore to Seattle. A team can be built well but it does not guarantee they will win it all.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:52 p.m.
#14
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Quoting: aadoyle
Some players dont show up in the playoffs. Ehlers for years was a playoff no show and then finally he got his act together. Marner will do the same. And no this team was not soft. They were matching Mtl in hits every single game, some game even out hitting them. Playoff hockey is not the same per team. Some teams play more open then others while others play a more tight game. Look at Tampa vs. Florida skill-fest. Col vs. Blues skill-fest. Not every game plays a defense only series like Vegas vs. Minn was.


COL/STL was a top tier, well built team, having their way with a team that didn't belong in the Playoffs.

It's not just hits for physical play, it's the going to the dirty areas of the ice shift after shift not just when it's convenient. Playing d-zone hockey that makes life mineable for the other team trying to get to those same dirty areas.

MN/VGK was more of a goalie showcase than a straight defensive struggle.

FLA had to open up because they couldn't relay on their goalies for anything. TB was happy to oblige because they had the goalie that could make the extra save or two to win the game.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 4:55 p.m.
#15
Avatar of the user
Joined: Dec. 2017
Posts: 5,012
Likes: 3,523
Quoting: aadoyle
Some players dont show up in the playoffs. Ehlers for years was a playoff no show and then finally he got his act together. Marner will do the same. And no this team was not soft. They were matching Mtl in hits every single game, some game even out hitting them. Playoff hockey is not the same per team. Some teams play more open then others while others play a more tight game. Look at Tampa vs. Florida skill-fest. Col vs. Blues skill-fest. Not every game plays a defense only series like Vegas vs. Minn was.

Also Col and Tampa are not light years ahead. Tampa is gonna go through a big regression this offseason as they are gonna lose Johnsson and one or two of Gourde, Palat, Killorn to seattle and trade. As with Kucherov back they are way over the cap. Colorado looks good but they are also gonna lose a big piece of their Dcore to Seattle. A team can be built well but it does not guarantee they will win it all.


Tampa won the skill-first against FLA and then adjusted to an absolute shutdown style against the Canes. They're adaptable. The Leafs are missing something very intangible. They don't know how to win when the pressure is on. They haven't progressed at all since Matthews' rookie season - 5 straight season getting knocked out before the 2nd round. I don't know what the answer is (trading MM is not a realistic option, imo). But, I know shuffling around a bunch of bottom six/bottom D pair depth players is not gonna get them over the top. Maybe they can start by fixing the PP???
Jun. 3, 2021 at 5:50 p.m.
#16
WentWughes
Avatar of the user
Joined: Nov. 2016
Posts: 10,720
Likes: 10,275
Quoting: wabit
I'm not, but realistically they would have been 5th behind BOS, TB, FLA, and TOR this year if their was the normal Divisions. PIT, NYI, CAR, and WSH would have been better in the Metro. MTL and NYR would have been fighting for 9th in the East.

If it wasn't for the Play-ins then MTL would have missed the Playoffs last year too. Playoff Price needs to show up in the regular season, otherwise we won't get to watch Playoff Price at all.


You can't say that. Montreal finished 4th playing their divisional rivals. There were no outside division games so who knows how the standings would've shaped up.
A_Habs_fan liked this.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 8:59 p.m.
#17
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
You can't say that. Montreal finished 4th playing their divisional rivals. There were no outside division games so who knows how the standings would've shaped up.


They aren't better than TB, FLA, CAR, PIT, WSH, NYI, BOS, or TOR. That puts them at least 9th in the East and out of the Playoffs. The teams in then normal Pacific are just awful overall. The entire West outside of COL and VGK is weak. The East has more good teams in both Divisions.

TOR in the East (WC) and TOR (2nd Pacific) are the 2 Playoff teams I see from Canada in a normal year. CGY/AZ would be fighting for 3rd in the Pacific. WIN would have been fighting for a WC spot in the West.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 9:44 p.m.
#18
WentWughes
Avatar of the user
Joined: Nov. 2016
Posts: 10,720
Likes: 10,275
Quoting: wabit
They aren't better than TB, FLA, CAR, PIT, WSH, NYI, BOS, or TOR. That puts them at least 9th in the East and out of the Playoffs. The teams in then normal Pacific are just awful overall. The entire West outside of COL and VGK is weak. The East has more good teams in both Divisions.

TOR in the East (WC) and TOR (2nd Pacific) are the 2 Playoff teams I see from Canada in a normal year. CGY/AZ would be fighting for 3rd in the Pacific. WIN would have been fighting for a WC spot in the West.


They aren't better than those teams according to what ? They only played 1 of those teams you mentioned this year.
Jun. 3, 2021 at 9:53 p.m.
#19
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
They aren't better than those teams according to what ? They only played 1 of those teams you mentioned this year.


Overall quality of team, goaltending, the results from the year before, etc. It's a hard argument that MTL would have had better seasons than any of those other teams if it was a regular season. The North didn't have any of the top teams to play against. It was fun hockey to watch, but not good hockey overall in the North this year.
A_Habs_fan liked this.
Jun. 4, 2021 at 9:10 a.m.
#20
WentWughes
Avatar of the user
Joined: Nov. 2016
Posts: 10,720
Likes: 10,275
Quoting: wabit
Overall quality of team, goaltending, the results from the year before, etc. It's a hard argument that MTL would have had better seasons than any of those other teams if it was a regular season. The North didn't have any of the top teams to play against. It was fun hockey to watch, but not good hockey overall in the North this year.


The year before isn't a solid answer considering we added Allen/Edmundson/Toffoli + more. There really isn't any evidence to support your claim.

I think our overall quality of team is a poor answer. Our 1st line was capable of shutting down Matthews + Marner so it's elite in its own way. Toffoli on the 3rd line was top 5 in scoring in the league. Factor in the growth of KK/Suzuku/Caufield and this team is a legit threat. You're saying the North is weak but again there's nothing that proves that. It's an empty argument.
Jun. 5, 2021 at 11:19 a.m.
#21
Thread Starter
Callfrom295
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jan. 2021
Posts: 97
Likes: 17
Quoting: wabit
Overall quality of team, goaltending, the results from the year before, etc. It's a hard argument that MTL would have had better seasons than any of those other teams if it was a regular season. The North didn't have any of the top teams to play against. It was fun hockey to watch, but not good hockey overall in the North this year.


Quoting: wabit
Overall quality of team, goaltending, the results from the year before, etc. It's a hard argument that MTL would have had better seasons than any of those other teams if it was a regular season. The North didn't have any of the top teams to play against. It was fun hockey to watch, but not good hockey overall in the North this year.


Here’s the problem with any argument that the Leafs have a better quality team: you have literally zero evidence to support that claim. When it matters most (which unless you believe regular season matters most, the playoffs) they’ve come short. How many times does this core need to be bounced out the first round for there to be some urgency to improve?
Jun. 5, 2021 at 1:12 p.m.
#22
Avatar of the user
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 8,210
Likes: 3,641
Quoting: Callfrom295
Here’s the problem with any argument that the Leafs have a better quality team: you have literally zero evidence to support that claim. When it matters most (which unless you believe regular season matters most, the playoffs) they’ve come short. How many times does this core need to be bounced out the first round for there to be some urgency to improve?


Regular season gets you into the Playoffs, so it matters a lot. Having a great post season team, doesn't do any good if you don't get into the postseason. MTL does not have a great regular season team as their record from the last 2 seasons backs up.
Jun. 5, 2021 at 10:31 p.m.
#23
Thread Starter
Callfrom295
Avatar of the user
Joined: Jan. 2021
Posts: 97
Likes: 17
Quoting: wabit
Regular season gets you into the Playoffs, so it matters a lot. Having a great post season team, doesn't do any good if you don't get into the postseason. MTL does not have a great regular season team as their record from the last 2 seasons backs up.


Sure, but I think any hockey fan would rather see two seasons with playoff hockey for two rounds, compared to having a good regular season.
 
Reply
To create a post please Login or Register
Question:
Options:
Loading animation
Submit Poll Edit