Forums/Armchair-GM

Fiala to NJ is a no go

Created by: SimonSelaars3
Initial Creation Date: May 11, 2022
Published: May 11, 2022
Team: 2022-23 Minnesota Wild
Free Agent Signings
RESERVE LISTYEARSCAP HIT
Wallstedt, Jesper3$925,000
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Vanecek, Vitek3$1,500,000
Dewar, Connor2$950,000
Chaffee, Mitchell2$950,000
Middleton, Jacob3$2,750,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Zadorov, Nikita3$4,000,000
Copp, Andrew3$5,250,000
Trades
1.
MIN
  1. Sokolov, Egor
  2. 2022 1st round pick (OTT)
OTT
  1. Fiala, Kevin [RFA Rights]
2.
MIN
  1. Vanecek, Vitek [RFA Rights]
WSH
  1. 2023 2nd round pick (MIN)
3.
MIN
  1. Hirvonen, Roni [Reserve List]
  2. 2022 3rd round pick (WPG)
TOR
  1. Greenway, Jordan
4.
MIN
  1. 2022 1st round pick (PIT)
PIT
  1. Dumba, Matt
Additional Details:
If Letang walks in FA
5.
MIN
  1. 2023 4th round pick (NYI)
NYI
  1. Kulikov, Dmitry
Buyouts
  • Zach Parise: $6,371,794
  • Ryan Suter: $6,371,794
DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
2022
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2023
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2024
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ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
23$82,500,000$80,742,754$0$1,547,500$1,757,246
Left WingCenterRight Wing
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Kaprizov, Kirill
$9,000,000
LW, RW
UFA - 4
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Hartman, Ryan
$1,700,000
C, RW
UFA - 2
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Zuccarello, Mats
$6,000,000
RW, LW
NMC NTC
UFA - 2
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Boldy, Matthew
$880,833
LW, RW
RFA - 1
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Rossi, Marco
$863,333
C
RFA - 3
Copp, Andrew
$5,250,000
LW, RW, C
UFA
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Foligno, Marcus
$3,100,000
LW, RW
UFA - 2
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Eriksson Ek, Joel
$5,250,000
C
UFA - 7
Logo of the OTT
Sokolov, Egor
$818,333
LW
RFA - 1
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Dewar, Connor
$950,000
LW
RFA - 2
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Gaudreau, Frédérick
$1,200,000
C
UFA - 1
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Jost, Tyson
$2,000,000
C, LW, RW
RFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
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Middleton, Jacob
$2,750,000
LD
RFA
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Spurgeon, Jared
$7,575,000
RD
NMC
UFA - 5
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Talbot, Cam
$3,666,667
G
UFA - 1
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Brodin, Jonas
$6,000,000
LD
NMC
UFA - 6
Zadorov, Nikita
$4,000,000
LD/RD
UFA
Vanecek, Vitek
$1,500,000
G
RFA
Logo of the MIN
Merrill, Jon
$1,200,000
LD
UFA - 3
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Addison, Calen
$795,000
RD
RFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
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Duhaime, Brandon
$750,000
LW, RW
RFA - 1
Logo of the MIN
Goligoski, Alex
$2,000,000
LD/RD
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the MIN
Shaw, Mason
$750,000
C
RFA - 1

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May 11 at 11:30 p.m.
#1
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Call it in, Isles accept. Kulikov is a great addition for LD2.
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May 11 at 11:30 p.m.
#2
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Ottawa won’t trade their first either. They aren’t good enough to make a move like this.
May 11 at 11:32 p.m.
#3
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Quoting: Sabres923
Ottawa won’t trade their first either. They aren’t good enough to make a move like this.


Pretty sure their GM just said he’s willing to move the 1st for an impact player, not to mention Fiala has been rumored to be a target of Dorion’s since January.
May 11 at 11:40 p.m.
#4
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Please don't put Zadorov in the top 4
May 11 at 11:42 p.m.
#5
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Quoting: Gmonwy
Please don't put Zadorov in the top 4


You could pair an AHL defenseman with Brodin and he would make them look good. It’s more about putting another big body on the blue line.
May 12 at 8:35 a.m.
#6
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Devils first moving to two could also take Ottawa’s first out of the game as well and both teams might try using lesser pieces.
May 12 at 8:41 a.m.
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Quoting: HeadHighSauce
Devils first moving to two could also take Ottawa’s first out of the game as well and both teams might try using lesser pieces.


Not sure how those things correlate in any way but I highly doubt it. The trade has to be centered around something and it likely won’t be a roster player. It’s either a prospect or the 2022 1st.
May 12 at 9:56 a.m.
#8
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
Not sure how those things correlate in any way but I highly doubt it. The trade has to be centered around something and it likely won’t be a roster player. It’s either a prospect or the 2022 1st.


Because the devils pick being off the table kinda blunts the arms race. Ottawa won't need to offer a high first if other teams aren't.

The only way Fiala is getting a big return is if there's a big bidding war. Devils (or Ottawa) winning the lottery blunts that in some manner because it takes one of the bargaining chips off the table.
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May 12 at 10:39 a.m.
#9
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If it is NJD and Ottawa left bidding for Fiala, never team offers a 1st. A playoff team probably will.
May 12 at 10:41 a.m.
#10
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Quoting: HeadHighSauce
Because the devils pick being off the table kinda blunts the arms race. Ottawa won't need to offer a high first if other teams aren't.

The only way Fiala is getting a big return is if there's a big bidding war. Devils (or Ottawa) winning the lottery blunts that in some manner because it takes one of the bargaining chips off the table.


Exactly (not that either team would have sent 1st in first place).

Hard to see how Minnesota profits on the trade when the impetus is shedding salary.
May 12 at 10:46 a.m.
#11
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Quoting: HeadHighSauce
Because the devils pick being off the table kinda blunts the arms race. Ottawa won't need to offer a high first if other teams aren't.

The only way Fiala is getting a big return is if there's a big bidding war. Devils (or Ottawa) winning the lottery blunts that in some manner because it takes one of the bargaining chips off the table.


Have you forgot about Buffalo, Columbus, Detroit, New York Islanders, and potentially even the Flyers? It would be ignorant to think that Ottawa and NJ will be the only two teams interested in Fiala, even if that ends up being the case then I would expect Guerin to just extend him.
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May 12 at 10:47 a.m.
#12
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Quoting: NHLfan10506
Exactly (not that either team would have sent 1st in first place).

Hard to see how Minnesota profits on the trade when the impetus is shedding salary.


I’ve explained this to you probably 10 times and you still have yet to understand.
May 12 at 10:53 a.m.
#13
Chart Boi
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
Have you forgot about Buffalo, Columbus, Detroit, New York Islanders, and potentially even the Flyers? It would be ignorant to think that Ottawa and NJ will be the only two teams interested in Fiala, even if that ends up being the case then I would expect Guerin to just extend him.


I mean, maybe Columbus offers their mid first and maybe Lou does too (but has no cap space, right?). But I don't think Fiala will have quite the market the Wild expect. Who knows though, he's a fantastic player. Maybe all these teams try.

And Guerin should extend him /anyway/. They are only trading him if they can't extend him, obviously lol. Give him his 8M, he deserves it.

The entire reason Fiala's name is out there is because they likely cannot afford him!
May 12 at 11:00 a.m.
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
I’ve explained this to you probably 10 times and you still have yet to understand.


Show me some historical references to justify the asking price.

- when has a team, who is looking to move out salary, profited from that trade?
- when has a team selling an unsigned RFA gotten full value?
- when has a top-5 pick ever been traded for a player (and when has a top-5 pick and a prospect been traded for a player?).

Explain this to me and I will understand.
May 12 at 11:04 a.m.
#15
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Quoting: HeadHighSauce
I mean, maybe Columbus offers their mid first and maybe Lou does too (but has no cap space, right?). But I don't think Fiala will have quite the market the Wild expect. Who knows though, he's a fantastic player. Maybe all these teams try.

And Guerin should extend him /anyway/. They are only trading him if they can't extend him, obviously lol. Give him his 8M, he deserves it.


I would expect several teams to be interested, I can’t think of any other top level player that has been rumored to be on the trade market this off season other than Chychrun and potentially Tkachuk. The opportunity to get the Fiala’s of the NHL don’t come around everyday. Obviously you have to factor in FA as well but you’re competing with damn near every team on the FA market.

I personally have no issue with Guerin extending Fiala long term but it’s been rumored that there is more to his potential departure than what meets the eye. Apparently Fiala and HC Dean Evason have never got along very well (Evason coached Fiala in his AHL days as well as on the Wild). Also apparently Guerin hasn’t been pleased with his streakiness as a player. Fiala has seemed to clean up this problems over the last 3 months but I think Guerin’s plan all along has been to trade Fiala. It would logically make far more sense just to retain him but from what I’ve heard that’s never been Guerin’s plan.
May 12 at 11:07 a.m.
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Quoting: NHLfan10506
Show me some historical references to justify the asking price.

- when has a team, who is looking to move out salary, profited from that trade?
- when has a team selling an unsigned RFA gotten full value?
- when has a top-5 pick ever been traded for a player (and when has a top-5 pick and a prospect been traded for a player?).

Explain this to me and I will understand.


I’ll counter with this

Who ever said that Guerin’s motive behind trading Fiala is to move out salary?

Unsigned RFAs of Fiala’s stature rarely get traded

I’m not asking for a Top 5 pick and the prospect is decent at best

I’ve now explained this to you, hopefully you will understandsmile
May 12 at 11:20 a.m.
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
I’ll counter with this

Who ever said that Guerin’s motive behind trading Fiala is to move out salary?

Unsigned RFAs of Fiala’s stature rarely get traded

I’m not asking for a Top 5 pick and the prospect is decent at best

I’ve now explained this to you, hopefully you will understandsmile


1. Guerin's motive in moving Fiala is all about salary.
2. There were two last year, Buchnevich and Reinhart.
3. Every Wild-to-NJ thread has NJ's 1st and/or Holtz.

Right now, as an unsigned RFA who is one year from UFA, he should be priced as if he was a rental.

Expect a pick in 20-40 range and a decent prospect.
May 12 at 11:35 a.m.
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Quoting: NHLfan10506
1. Guerin's motive in moving Fiala is all about salary.
2. There were two last year, Buchnevich and Reinhart.
3. Every Wild-to-NJ thread has NJ's 1st and/or Holtz.

Right now, as an unsigned RFA who is one year from UFA, he should be priced as if he was a rental.

Expect a pick in 20-40 range and a decent prospect.


I see you still have yet to grasp what I’m telling you.

Even if Guerin’s motive in moving Fiala is to shed cap, he’s not telling anybody that and it doesn’t matter if the team on the other phone thinks that’s the case or not because at the end of the day, Guerin has the ability to retain Fiala.

Trading an RFA is essentially no different from trading a player under contract. If you think Guerin is gonna tell the team wanting to trade for him that they can’t talk to Fiala’s agent and negotiate an extension before the trade is finalized, then you’re crazy. Guerin should be fired if he doesn’t allow a team such as Ottawa to get an agreement from Fiala that he is willing to sign long term at his desired price before finalizing a trade because he wont get full value.

The Rangers were absolutely fleeced in the Buchnevich trade, everyone and their mom knows this. Reinhart is one of the most one dimensional players in the league and just simply isn’t on Fiala’s level.

Fiala to NJ makes 0 sense anymore, NJ will be lucky to have money to work with 5 year from now. They already have Dougie, Big Hughes, and Hischier locked up between 7-9 million price points. Sharangovich will demand over 6m, Bratt will demand over 6m, and down the road they will have to pay guys like Holtz and little Hughes big money as well. Not to mention, if Slafkovsky ends up being what we all think he is, he will demand a huge payday as well. Adding a 7-8 million dollar Fiala to that mix wouldn’t help in the slightest.
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May 12 at 12:00 p.m.
#19
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
I would expect several teams to be interested, I can’t think of any other top level player that has been rumored to be on the trade market this off season other than Chychrun and potentially Tkachuk. The opportunity to get the Fiala’s of the NHL don’t come around everyday. Obviously you have to factor in FA as well but you’re competing with damn near every team on the FA market.

I personally have no issue with Guerin extending Fiala long term but it’s been rumored that there is more to his potential departure than what meets the eye. Apparently Fiala and HC Dean Evason have never got along very well (Evason coached Fiala in his AHL days as well as on the Wild). Also apparently Guerin hasn’t been pleased with his streakiness as a player. Fiala has seemed to clean up this problems over the last 3 months but I think Guerin’s plan all along has been to trade Fiala. It would logically make far more sense just to retain him but from what I’ve heard that’s never been Guerin’s plan.


These are all just more reasons that the Wild won't be getting big value for Fiala. If everyone knows there's cap trouble /and/ personality conflicts, why would they be offering up premium assets...
May 12 at 12:08 p.m.
#20
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
Even if Guerin’s motive in moving Fiala is to shed cap, he’s not telling anybody that and it doesn’t matter if the team on the other phone thinks that’s the case or not because at the end of the day, Guerin has the ability to retain Fiala.


It matters. Wild cannot afford him. If Guerin extends him, he then has to give Dumba or Zuccarello away for even less (and that's harder with the NTC's).

Quoting: SimonSelaars3
Trading an RFA is essentially no different from trading a player under contract. If you think Guerin is gonna tell the team wanting to trade for him that they can’t talk to Fiala’s agent and negotiate an extension before the trade is finalized, then you’re crazy. Guerin should be fired if he doesn’t allow a team such as Ottawa to get an agreement from Fiala that he is willing to sign long term at his desired price before finalizing a trade because he wont get full value.


Its not a question of Guerin allowing teams to talk to Fiala or not.

First, all teams can already talk to him come July 13th. They don't need Guerin's permission.

Second, Fiala is one-year from UFA, he may not agree to extend with every team.
He could want to pick his destination.
That will limit the pool of potential trading partners.

Quoting: SimonSelaars3
The Rangers were absolutely fleeced in the Buchnevich trade, everyone and their mom knows this. Reinhart is one of the most one dimensional players in the league and just simply isn’t on Fiala’s level.


The Rangers were limited based on salary constraints. Hence, the lesser return.
The Sabres were limited by a player who wanted out. Hence, the lesser return.

Quoting: SimonSelaars3
Fiala to NJ makes 0 sense anymore, NJ will be lucky to have money to work with 5 year from now. They already have Dougie, Big Hughes, and Hischier locked up between 7-9 million price points. Sharangovich will demand over 6m, Bratt will demand over 6m, and down the road they will have to pay guys like Holtz and little Hughes big money as well. Not to mention, if Slafkovsky ends up being what we all think he is, he will demand a huge payday as well. Adding a 7-8 million dollar Fiala to that mix wouldn’t help in the slightest.


No one is, nor should be, worried about our cap situation five years from now.
May 12 at 12:26 p.m.
#21
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Quoting: NHLfan10506
It matters. Wild cannot afford him. If Guerin extends him, he then has to give Dumba or Zuccarello away for even less (and that's harder with the NTC's).



Its not a question of Guerin allowing teams to talk to Fiala or not.

First, all teams can already talk to him come July 13th. They don't need Guerin's permission.

Second, Fiala is one-year from UFA, he may not agree to extend with every team.
He could want to pick his destination.
That will limit the pool of potential trading partners.



The Rangers were limited based on salary constraints. Hence, the lesser return.
The Sabres were limited by a player who wanted out. Hence, the lesser return.



No one is, nor should be, worried about our cap situation five years from now.


The Wild can absolutely afford him with a couple moves. I’d rather get short sold on Dumba rather than Fiala.

If Fiala is traded he will be traded before July 13th, no way in hell Guerin let’s a team potentially offer sheet him unless he doesn’t get any better trade offers.

If Fiala wants to pick a team to be traded to then so be it, one more reason for a team to be interested in acquiring him.

You can’t realistically tell me the Rangers weren’t fleeced, they easily could’ve gotten rid of lesser players and chose to keep Buchnevich, just like the Wild can do with Fiala.

Fiala doesn’t want out so that’s not a concern.

If you don’t think every GM in the league is making moves with the next 2-3 years in mind at the minimum, you’d be wrong.
May 12 at 12:29 p.m.
#22
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Quoting: HeadHighSauce
These are all just more reasons that the Wild won't be getting big value for Fiala. If everyone knows there's cap trouble /and/ personality conflicts, why would they be offering up premium assets...


It couldn’t matter less if teams know there is cap trouble, if a team comes into negotiations with the mindset that they are gonna get Fiala for a bunch of scraps then I’d assume they get hung up on ASAP, especially with Guerin working the phones (he’s not gonna let anyone bend him over the barrel).

As for the of ice issues with Evason, they’re all rumors as of now. Like I said, if they truly ever existed in the first place, they seemed to have been resolved at this point.
May 12 at 12:45 p.m.
#23
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
If Fiala is traded he will be traded before July 13th, no way in hell Guerin let’s a team potentially offer sheet him unless he doesn’t get any better trade offers.


If he is traded before July 13th, that means he will need to agree to extension beforehand. In other words, he will have agreed to an extension after talking to one team (Guerin’s choice) when he could have waited a few days and spoken to all 32 teams. Got it. Sounds plausible.

Quoting: SimonSelaars3
If Fiala wants to pick a team to be traded to then so be it, one more reason for a team to be interested in acquiring him.


If Fiala picks his team, Guerin will be left with one trade partner. Who dictates the price in that situation?
May 12 at 12:53 p.m.
#24
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Quoting: SimonSelaars3
It couldn’t matter less if teams know there is cap trouble, if a team comes into negotiations with the mindset that they are gonna get Fiala for a bunch of scraps then I’d assume they get hung up on ASAP, especially with Guerin working the phones (he’s not gonna let anyone bend him over the barrel).

As for the of ice issues with Evason, they’re all rumors as of now. Like I said, if they truly ever existed in the first place, they seemed to have been resolved at this point.


again. if the Wild can extend Fiala and not trade him, they should. They shouldn't even think about trade returns. If they are trading him, its because they can't and Guerin will absolutely be getting some "scrap" offers.
May 12 at 12:57 p.m.
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Quoting: NHLfan10506
If he is traded before July 13th, that means he will need to agree to extension beforehand. In other words, he will have agreed to an extension after talking to one team (Guerin’s choice) when he could have waited a few days and spoken to all 32 teams. Got it. Sounds plausible.



If Fiala picks his team, Guerin will be left with one trade partner. Who dictates the price in that situation?


32 teams don’t have the requirements to offer sheet Fiala, it’s actually 31 teams but you said 32. There is maybe 2-3 teams that can realistically offer sheet him and my guess is he won’t want to go to any of those teams because they probably aren’t very good.

If Fiala only wants to be traded to one certain team then Guerin controls the price. If the other team doesn’t meet Guerin’s price then he can choose to extend Fiala himself or let him get offer sheeted.
 
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