Forums/Armchair-GM

Very aggressive wishful thinking

Created by: ceeque84
Initial Creation Date: Jun. 30, 2022
Published: Jun. 30, 2022
Team: 2022-23 Edmonton Oilers
Team Explanation
Smith Retires leaving only Klefbom on LTIR to start the season
Holland grows a brain and gets Arizona to do the Keith trade & buyout thing.
San Jose has to retain half of Kane's salary & trades him to the Oilers
Leaves them with $15.2 Million cap space in 23/24 to resign Debrincat, Bouch, & Skinner, who are all RFAs WITHOUT arb rights.

Bridge Bouch, similar to what they did with Nurse 2 x $3.5million
DeBrincat 8 x $9mill
Skinner 3 x 900k- Takes him until Husso's deal is up
Leaves a little over a million left to sign another 4th liner/press box player to replace Shore
Things wouldnt get real scary until 25/26 when Drai, Kane, Crouse, Yamo, Bouch, & Ceci would all need new deals!!

Dont @ me Blackhawks fans, considering what Minny got for Fiala(yes I know the Cat is better), I think the trade is more than fair.
Free Agent Signings
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
McLeod, Ryan2$975,000
Yamamoto, Kailer3$2,750,000
Perlini, Brendan1$800,000
Crouse, Lawson3$3,000,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Kulak, Brett4$2,250,000
Marody, Cooper1$800,000
Husso, Ville4$3,750,000
Kane, Evander3$3,750,000
Gagner, Sam3$850,000
Deslauriers, Nicolas3$1,500,000
Rutta, Jan3$1,750,000
CREATEDYEARSCAP HIT
Keith, Duncan1$1,000,000
Trades
1.
EDM
  1. DeBrincat, Alex
CHI
  1. Bourgault, Xavier
  2. Puljujärvi, Jesse [RFA Rights]
  3. 2022 1st round pick (EDM)
  4. 2024 1st round pick (EDM)
2.
EDM
  1. Crouse, Lawson [RFA Rights]
ARI
  1. Savoie, Carter
  2. Foegele, Warren
  3. Keith, Duncan
  4. 2023 1st round pick (EDM)
Additional Details:
Arizona does the Keith buyout thing
First for Crouse.
Keith and Foegle help get Arizona above the cap floor, Foegle also gives them a roster player.
Savoie for taking the cap dumps.
3.
EDM
  1. 2023 2nd round pick (PIT)
  2. 2023 4th round pick (PIT)
PIT
  1. Barrie, Tyson
Additional Details:
Letang doesnt return
4.
EDM
    Future Considerations
    ANA
    1. Kassian, Zack
    2. 2023 3rd round pick (EDM)
    5.
    EDM
    1. 2022 3rd round pick (WSH)
    WSH
    1. Ryan, Derek
    6.
    EDM
      SJS
      1. Samorukov, Dmitri
      2. 2022 3rd round pick (WSH)
      Additional Details:
      For the Kane trade situation.
      Buyouts
      • James Neal: $1,916,667
      • Andrej Sekera: $1,500,000
      Retained Salary Transactions
      • Milan Lucic: $750,000 (13%)
      DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
      2022
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      2023
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the PIT
      Logo of the PIT
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      2024
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      Logo of the EDM
      ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
      23$82,500,000$82,051,833$896,000$1,700,000$448,167
      Left WingCenterRight Wing
      Logo of the EDM
      Kane, Evander
      $3,750,000
      LW, RW
      NMC
      UFA - 4
      Logo of the EDM
      McDavid, Connor
      $12,500,000
      C
      NMC
      UFA - 4
      Logo of the CHI
      DeBrincat, Alex
      $6,400,000
      LW, RW
      RFA - 1
      Logo of the EDM
      Nugent-Hopkins, Ryan
      $5,125,000
      LW, C
      NMC
      UFA - 7
      Logo of the EDM
      Draisaitl, Leon
      $8,500,000
      C, LW
      NMC NTC
      UFA - 3
      Logo of the EDM
      Hyman, Zach
      $5,500,000
      LW, RW
      NMC
      UFA - 6
      Crouse, Lawson
      $3,000,000
      LW
      UFA - 5
      Logo of the EDM
      McLeod, Ryan
      $975,000
      C
      RFA
      Logo of the EDM
      Yamamoto, Kailer
      $2,750,000
      RW, C
      RFA - 2
      Logo of the EDM
      Malone, Brad
      $762,500
      C, LW
      UFA - 2
      Gagner, Sam
      $850,000
      C, RW
      UFA
      Deslauriers, Nicolas
      $1,500,000
      RW, LW
      NTC
      UFA - 4
      Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
      Logo of the EDM
      Nurse, Darnell
      $9,250,000
      LD
      NMC
      UFA - 8
      Logo of the EDM
      Bouchard, Evan
      $863,333
      RD
      RFA - 1
      Husso, Ville
      $3,750,000
      G
      NTC
      UFA - 3
      Logo of the EDM
      Kulak, Brett
      $2,250,000
      LD/RD
      UFA - 4
      Logo of the EDM
      Ceci, Cody
      $3,250,000
      RD
      UFA - 3
      Logo of the EDM
      Skinner, Stuart
      $750,000
      G
      RFA - 1
      Logo of the EDM
      Broberg, Philip
      $863,333
      LD
      RFA - 2
      Rutta, Jan
      $1,750,000
      LD/RD
      UFA - 3
      Keith, Duncan
      $1,000,000
      ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
      Logo of the EDM
      Perlini, Brendan
      $800,000
      RW, LW
      UFA
      Logo of the EDM
      Klefbom, Oscar
      $4,167,000
      LD
      NTC
      UFA - 1
      Logo of the EDM
      Shore, Devin
      $850,000
      LW, C, RW
      UFA - 1
      Logo of the EDM
      Smith, Mike
      $2,200,000
      G
      UFA - 1

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      Jun. 30 at 5:45 a.m.
      #1
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      NHL didn't like it when WSH manouvered like this with Orpik, I don't see them allowing a team doing it again. Also, Keith's NMC poses a bit of a problem - I mean yes he doesn't lose any money over it but he effectively loses his playing position. I like the value in the deal tho, there's certainly incentive for ARI to consider.

      CHI trade in my opinion is an overpayment. Big one.

      Think dumping Kassian costs a bit more than third. Also can't see Ryan being worth a third.

      Lastly, Kane is severely underpaid.
      Jun. 30 at 5:56 a.m.
      #2
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      NHL didn't like it when WSH manouvered like this with Orpik, I don't see them allowing a team doing it again. Also, Keith's NMC poses a bit of a problem - I mean yes he doesn't lose any money over it but he effectively loses his playing position. I like the value in the deal tho, there's certainly incentive for ARI to consider.

      CHI trade in my opinion is an overpayment. Big one.

      Think dumping Kassian costs a bit more than third. Also can't see Ryan being worth a third.

      Lastly, Kane is severely underpaid.


      Agree that it would be an overpayment for Debrincat, ideally i'd like to remove Bourgault from it, but not sure Pulji + 2 late first rnd picks get it done.
      Kane is underpaid on the Oilers books because San Jose is retaining half of his salary.
      Might take a 2nd to dump Kass, but there are rumors out there that the Ducks OR Ottawa actually see him as a player with some value, so who knows.

      No clue what the NHL would do with the Keith buyout resign situation, im sure it wouldnt be in the Oilers favor tho.... but legally on paper there is nothing saying they couldnt do it.
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      Jun. 30 at 6:44 a.m.
      #3
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      NHL didn't like it when WSH manouvered like this with Orpik, I don't see them allowing a team doing it again. Also, Keith's NMC poses a bit of a problem - I mean yes he doesn't lose any money over it but he effectively loses his playing position. I like the value in the deal tho, there's certainly incentive for ARI to consider.

      CHI trade in my opinion is an overpayment. Big one.

      Think dumping Kassian costs a bit more than third. Also can't see Ryan being worth a third.

      Lastly, Kane is severely underpaid.


      Bmac was big brained
      Jun. 30 at 7:33 a.m.
      #4
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      Chicago trade is heavily one sided for hawks.
      Arizona trade is a massive overpay.
      Moving Barrie resulted in a big downgrade I don't think the team can afford to make. Still count on that 3rd pair alot.
      San Jose trade I just don't see any way San Jose gets kane back and if they do I wouldn't talk to them that's beer league bs let them have Kane and find another answer betting most gms will see it that way.
      Jun. 30 at 9:39 a.m.
      #5
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      Quoting: Timmah007
      Chicago trade is heavily one sided for hawks.
      Arizona trade is a massive overpay.
      Moving Barrie resulted in a big downgrade I don't think the team can afford to make. Still count on that 3rd pair alot.
      San Jose trade I just don't see any way San Jose gets kane back and if they do I wouldn't talk to them that's beer league bs let them have Kane and find another answer betting most gms will see it that way.


      I dont think Rutta is a big downgrade from Barrie if Bouch is to be the full time PP1 guy next season. Rutta played big minutes for Tampa up on the top pairing with Hedman, he is better defensively than Barrie.
      Agreed that the Debrincat trade is a little bit of an overpay, idealy i would like to remove Bourgault from it, but i was taking into consideration that they would be very late first rnd picks.
      I dont think the Arizona trade is an overpay. Again, the first rnd pick for Crouse would be late in the rnd. I get that alot of Oiler fanas are super high on Savoie, but i think its a bunch of biased speculation. Plus, if they are hypothetically getting Debrincat and keeping Yamo, there is no need for more another undersized winger, they also have a surplus of Left shot wingers... another reason it would be best to try and keep Bourgault if possible.
      Jun. 30 at 9:44 a.m.
      #6
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      Quoting: ceeque84
      I dont think Rutta is a big downgrade from Barrie if Bouch is to be the full time PP1 guy next season. Rutta played big minutes for Tampa up on the top pairing with Hedman, he is better defensively than Barrie.
      Agreed that the Debrincat trade is a little bit of an overpay, idealy i would like to remove Bourgault from it, but i was taking into consideration that they would be very late first rnd picks.
      I dont think the Arizona trade is an overpay. Again, the first rnd pick for Crouse would be late in the rnd. I get that alot of Oiler fanas are super high on Savoie, but i think its a bunch of biased speculation. Plus, if they are hypothetically getting Debrincat and keeping Yamo, there is no need for more another undersized winger, they also have a surplus of Left shot wingers... another reason it would be best to try and keep Bourgault if possible.


      Bourgault would be off limits for me just because we need a right shot forward coming up.
      Jun. 30 at 10:35 a.m.
      #7
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      NHL didn't like it when WSH manouvered like this with Orpik, I don't see them allowing a team doing it again. Also, Keith's NMC poses a bit of a problem - I mean yes he doesn't lose any money over it but he effectively loses his playing position. I like the value in the deal tho, there's certainly incentive for ARI to consider.

      CHI trade in my opinion is an overpayment. Big one.

      Think dumping Kassian costs a bit more than third. Also can't see Ryan being worth a third.

      Lastly, Kane is severely underpaid.


      I can assure you that it is not an overpayment and CHI would decline that offer without thinking twice about it.
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      Jun. 30 at 10:37 a.m.
      #8
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      Quoting: Garak
      I can assure you that it is not an overpayment and CHI would decline that offer without thinking twice about it.


      Lmao if you truly think you're getting almost 4 firsts worth of stuff for one year of DeBrincat before his big QO kicks in you're setting yourself for a massive disappointment.

      I can't recall a trade in modern NHL history with such a return (2010s onwards).
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      Jun. 30 at 10:45 a.m.
      #9
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      Lmao if you truly think you're getting almost 4 firsts worth of stuff for one year of DeBrincat before his big QO kicks in you're setting yourself for a massive disappointment.

      I can't recall a trade in modern NHL history with such a return (2010s onwards).


      Lets go over what we have there. At this point PJ is a 2nd liner and only looked decent in large part because of who he was playing with he is worth a 2nd at best, Bourgault projects as a good 3rd liner but he is not worth a 1st round pick, and then 2 late 1st round picks one of which is a this year 29th overall in a very shallow draft. CHI declines. There is a big difference between listening to offers and actively shopping a player. Not all 1st's are the same. There are teams that would beat this offer with less quantity and more quality.
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      Jun. 30 at 10:50 a.m.
      #10
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      Quoting: Garak
      Lets go over what we have there. At this point PJ is a 2nd liner and only looked decent in large part because of who he was playing with he is worth a 2nd at best, Bourgault projects as a good 3rd liner but he is not worth a 1st round pick, and then 2 late 1st round picks one of which is a this year 29th overall in a very shallow draft. CHI declines. There is a big difference between listening to offers and actively shopping a player. Not all 1st's are the same. There are teams that would beat this offer with less quantity and more quality.


      Bourgault was drafted in the first round and had a great albeit injury-riddled year. He absolutely projects as a top-6 center. Worth more than a first easily right now.

      Pulju is worth about a high 2nd. His performance weren't impacted by the players he was playing with - it's actually quite opposite, he often made those around him much better.

      First rounders are first rounders.

      I would argue that is 4 first rounders in total. You're downplaying EDM's assets here big time.
      Jun. 30 at 10:51 a.m.
      #11
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      Lmao if you truly think you're getting almost 4 firsts worth of stuff for one year of DeBrincat before his big QO kicks in you're setting yourself for a massive disappointment.

      I can't recall a trade in modern NHL history with such a return (2010s onwards).


      LMAO, that's a really bad take and not all firsts are worth the same thing. Chicago declines this all day long and plenty of teams offer better with a high first round pick and top NHL prospect which the Hawks and everyone take over this version of "4 first rounders"
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      Jun. 30 at 10:54 a.m.
      #12
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      Quoting: ChiHawk
      LMAO, that's a really bad take and not all firsts are worth the same thing. Chicago declines this all day long and plenty of teams offer better with a high first round pick and top NHL prospect


      First rounders are first rounders, who knows what will happen in 2024. Not likely that OTT was projecting the 2020 first rounder they got for Karlsson to turn into Stutzle for example.

      As it stands right now this offer would stand as one of the highest payments for a player in last 10 years, and especially for a guy with no term to boot.
      Jun. 30 at 11:00 a.m.
      #13
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      Bourgault was drafted in the first round and had a great albeit injury-riddled year. He absolutely projects as a top-6 center. Worth more than a first easily right now.

      Pulju is worth about a high 2nd. His performance weren't impacted by the players he was playing with - it's actually quite opposite, he often made those around him much better.

      First rounders are first rounders.

      I would argue that is 4 first rounders in total. You're downplaying EDM's assets here big time.


      I'm not downplaying them. I like PJ and Bourgault. But they aren't worth that much in trade at this point in their careers. I see people using Fiala in comparison going forward, so I will say this right now. MIN had zero leverage in the Fiala trade and were forced to give him up, Fiala is a defensive liability, and he has not shown anywhere near as much consistency as Cat. CHI has zero reason to sell cat unless the return is a game changer, because Cat himself is a game changer. CHI has all the leverage and zero need to sell him. All first round picks are absolutely not created equal.
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      Jun. 30 at 11:00 a.m.
      #14
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      First rounders are first rounders, who knows what will happen in 2024. Not likely that OTT was projecting the 2020 first rounder they got for Karlsson to turn into Stutzle for example.

      As it stands right now this offer would stand as one of the highest payments for a player in last 10 years, and especially for a guy with no term to boot.


      "first rounders are first rounders"...LMAO that's rich! The 2022 Edmonton first rounder is garbage...nothing but a dice roll on the craps table. The 2024 is going to be another late one. You simply don't get an elite player for 2 late firsts, a middle 6 winger and good (not great) prospect. Rumor is, Devils and Hawks meeting about the #2OA and Holtz which kills this offer all day long. Ottawa also beats this offer with Pinto and (2) firsts. Cat is an elite 24 year old proven NHL player who's stock continues to rise each year in the league. He's an RFA in another year with a QO of $9M which easily is justified. Rarely do players like him become available. Fiala, who didn't even have a contract and is clearly not as good as Cat in all areas on the ice, pulled in quite a bit for no contract in place...start there.
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      Jun. 30 at 11:11 a.m.
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      These contracts, dude. You serious?!! Way underpaid.
      Jun. 30 at 11:17 a.m.
      #16
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      Quoting: Koskinen_The_Great
      These contracts, dude. You serious?!! Way underpaid.


      Care to be specific. If you are referring to Mcleod Yamo and Crouse, keep in mind they are both still RFAs. And if you are referring to Kane, it is under the hypothetical situation that SJ is retaining half of his salary.

      Husso might get more, but with being fairly unproven as a full time starter i wouldnt go any higher than $4mill per.
      I have Gagner taking $850k because he gets 3 yrs term which i think at this stage in his career and with having a family is more important that say another 1 yr contract for like $1.5 mill
      Kulak has already been rumored to be looking for around $2.5mill per depending on term.....
      Jun. 30 at 11:21 a.m.
      #17
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      Quoting: Garak
      I'm not downplaying them. I like PJ and Bourgault. But they aren't worth that much in trade at this point in their careers. I see people using Fiala in comparison going forward, so I will say this right now. MIN had zero leverage in the Fiala trade and were forced to give him up, Fiala is a defensive liability, and he has not shown anywhere near as much consistency as Cat. CHI has zero reason to sell cat unless the return is a game changer, because Cat himself is a game changer. CHI has all the leverage and zero need to sell him. All first round picks are absolutely not created equal.


      Quoting: ChiHawk
      "first rounders are first rounders"...LMAO that's rich! The 2022 Edmonton first rounder is garbage...nothing but a dice roll on the craps table. The 2024 is going to be another late one. You simply don't get an elite player for 2 late firsts, a middle 6 winger and good (not great) prospect. Rumor is, Devils and Hawks meeting about the #2OA and Holtz which kills this offer all day long. Ottawa also beats this offer with Pinto and (2) firsts. Cat is an elite 24 year old proven NHL player who's stock continues to rise each year in the league. He's an RFA in another year with a QO of $9M which easily is justified. Rarely do players like him become available. Fiala, who didn't even have a contract and is clearly not as good as Cat in all areas on the ice, pulled in quite a bit for no contract in place...start there.


      "You simply don't get an elite player for two late firsts, a middle 6 winger and a good (not great prospect)."

      Yeah, something tells me there's something wrong with that sentence, what with elite players certainly moving for lesser packages than this, starting from Toews, Reinhart, Fiala and even Eichel to an extent (yes I think Eichel return was better than this one but not by too much). Granted some differing circumstances definitely played a part here and there.

      First round picks are not equal, that's true, but they still hold a high perceived value due to the unknown factor. Yes the 2022 first isn't as valuable because we know it's a 29th overall pick but we can't say the same for certain for the 2024 one.

      I'd argue that 29th overall pick + Bourgault is about the same in value as Faber + 19th overall is. So basically we have Pulju + 2024 1st added to that return, which is in my opinion quite a lot.

      If teams like NJ or OTT is handing out those offers for DeBrincat, yeah I think I agree that it will top the value in this, but that's a BIG if. Personally I don't see them doing it at all, doesn't scream to me like Fitzgerald or Dorion types of moves.

      My argument is that since such a package has not been traded for a player in past 10 years, probably more than that, imo it's almost asinine to think that a RFA that is two years away from free agency would be worth MASSIVELY more than any trade in the past. For all we know Debrincat could go and pull a Dubois in 2023, and only agree to a one year deal, which is likely the specific reason why CHI is listening offers for the guy as they don't want to compromise on value by rebuilding and not offering him a position to produce at his earlier and/or potentially risk losing the leverage over him.

      Can Debrincat reach an offer like Holtz+2nd overall? Maybe, but it's a risk I definitely wouldn't be willing to take nor suggest as it would become one of the highest paid prices for a player with no certain term in years.
      Jun. 30 at 11:29 a.m.
      #18
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      Edited Jun. 30 at 11:36 a.m.
      Quoting: justaBoss
      "You simply don't get an elite player for two late firsts, a middle 6 winger and a good (not great prospect)."

      Yeah, something tells me there's something wrong with that sentence, what with elite players certainly moving for lesser packages than this, starting from Toews, Reinhart, Fiala and even Eichel to an extent (yes I think Eichel return was better than this one but not by too much). Granted some differing circumstances definitely played a part here and there.

      First round picks are not equal, that's true, but they still hold a high perceived value due to the unknown factor. Yes the 2022 first isn't as valuable because we know it's a 29th overall pick but we can't say the same for certain for the 2024 one.

      I'd argue that 29th overall pick + Bourgault is about the same in value as Faber + 19th overall is. So basically we have Pulju + 2024 1st added to that return, which is in my opinion quite a lot.

      If teams like NJ or OTT is handing out those offers for DeBrincat, yeah I think I agree that it will top the value in this, but that's a BIG if. Personally I don't see them doing it at all, doesn't scream to me like Fitzgerald or Dorion types of moves.

      My argument is that since such a package has not been traded for a player in past 10 years, probably more than that, imo it's almost asinine to think that a RFA that is two years away from free agency would be worth MASSIVELY more than any trade in the past. For all we know Debrincat could go and pull a Dubois in 2023, and only agree to a one year deal, which is likely the specific reason why CHI is listening offers for the guy as they don't want to compromise on value by rebuilding and not offering him a position to produce at his earlier and/or potentially risk losing the leverage over him.

      Can Debrincat reach an offer like Holtz+2nd overall? Maybe, but it's a risk I definitely wouldn't be willing to take nor suggest as it would become one of the highest paid prices for a player with no certain term in years.


      Fiala, again had no contract in place and he's not elite. Reinhardt elite, especially prior to the trade? You seem to be using very broad brush strokes for what is defined as elite. The one elite player you listed is Eichel and due to public display of issues with Buffalo, carrying a $10M cap hit and being trade in season, a UFA in 4 years not RFA, facing a major surgery that does not have a good long term prognosis in impact sports (see the NFL), he didn't get what he is worth and Cat is worth every bit of what Eichel got maybe more.

      Again, Fiala wasn't under contract, Minnesota faced in a cap crunch, and he's simply not in the elite discussion of players like Cat.

      Any big trade for Cat, let's be real, just like Fiala will include an extension...it's really that simple. That will be worked out between the three parties before a trade happens. Same thing happened with Seth Jones a year ago. It's been widely reported out of Chicago that Cat and his agent would be allowed to talk to a future team prior to a trade if Chicago feels like the return meets their expectations. Either the Devils or Ottawa will pull the trigger on a big package or you will more then likely see Cat staying in Chicago. If Edmonton wants in, then Holloway or Broberg will be the anchor piece coming back.
      Jun. 30 at 11:35 a.m.
      #19
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      Quoting: Garak
      I can assure you that it is not an overpayment and CHI would decline that offer without thinking twice about it.


      Quoting: ChiHawk
      LMAO, that's a really bad take and not all firsts are worth the same thing. Chicago declines this all day long and plenty of teams offer better with a high first round pick and top NHL prospect which the Hawks and everyone take over this version of "4 first rounders"


      Damn there are going to be some very disappointed Blackhawks fans when DeBrincat does get traded for just slightly better than what Minny got for Fiala.... Lets also not forget about the report that Debrincat has alredy let it be known that he doesnt want to stay in Chicago if they plan to go full rebuild mode... this being publicly known hurts the Hawks chance of getting an over the top deal for him.
      Jun. 30 at 11:37 a.m.
      #20
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      Quoting: ceeque84
      Damn there are going to be some very disappointed Blackhawks fans when DeBrincat does get traded for just slightly better than what Minny got for Fiala.... Lets also not forget about the report that Debrincat has alredy let it be known that he doesnt want to stay in Chicago if they plan to go full rebuild mode... this being publicly known hurts the Hawks chance of getting an over the top deal for him.


      Cat is going to get a top prospect and a mid to high first IF he is traded and that is a big IF.

      What report, please link it
      Jun. 30 at 11:38 a.m.
      #21
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      Quoting: ChiHawk
      Fiala, again had no contract in place and he's not elite. Reinhardt elite? You seem to be using very broad brush strokes for what is defined as elite. The only one you listed is Eichel and due to public display of issues with Buffalo, carrying a $10M cap hit and being trade in season, a UFA in 4 years not RFA, facing a major surgery that does not have a good long term prognosis in impact sports (see the NFL), he didn't get what he is worth and Cat is worth every bit of what Eichel got maybe more.

      Again, Fiala wasn't under contract, Minnesota faced in a cap crunch, and he's simply not in the elite discussion of players like Cat.

      Any big trade for Cat, let's be real, just like Fiala will include an extension...it's really that simple. That will be worked out between the three parties before a trade happens. Same thing happened with Seth Jones a year ago. It's been widely reported out of Chicago that Cat and his agent would be allowed to talk to a future team prior to a trade if Chicago feels like the return meets their expectations. Either the Devils or Ottawa will pull the trigger on a big package or you will more then likely see Cat staying in Chicago. If Edmonton wants in, then Holloway or Broberg will be the anchor piece coming back.


      I mean all 3 of DeBrincat, Fiala and Reinhart are all known as offensive machines, and past 3 years their production is almost equal but only one of them had the luxury of playing with Kane throughout this time frame. You make it sound like DeBrincat is head and shoulders above the two but he's not. Both Fiala and Debrincat have exactly 179 points in this timeframe with Reinhart having 172. As for goals, Debrincat has 91, Reinhart has 80 and Fiala has 76, so not a massive difference there either. If one of them constitutes as elite, all of them should if you ask me.

      Fiala and Reinhart weren't under contract when dealt which is why I agree that Debrincat will get more than they did in a trade, but imo the value shouldn't be that massive as you and Garak have portrayed.
      Jun. 30 at 11:39 a.m.
      #22
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      Quoting: ChiHawk
      Cat is going to get a top prospect and a mid to high first IF he is traded and that is a big IF.

      What report, please link it


      Friedman said weeks ago on his podcast that DeBrincat has let management know that if Kane is being traded and especially if they are moving into rebuild mode then he wants out as well.
      Jun. 30 at 11:48 a.m.
      #23
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      Quoting: ceeque84

      Might take a 2nd to dump Kass, but there are rumors out there that the Ducks OR Ottawa actually see him as a player with some value, so who knows.


      As a Ducks fan I'd be pretty happy with Kassian on the fourth line. ANA is in a situation with their cap that they can look past the fact they are paying a 4th liner that much.
      Jun. 30 at 11:49 a.m.
      #24
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      Quoting: justaBoss
      I mean all 3 of DeBrincat, Fiala and Reinhart are all known as offensive machines, and past 3 years their production is almost equal but only one of them had the luxury of playing with Kane. You make it sound like DeBrincat is head and shoulders above the two but he's not. Both Fiala and Debrincat have exactly 179 points in this timeframe with Reinhart having 172. As for goals, Debrincat has 91, Reinhart has 80 and Fiala has 76. If one of them constitutes as elite, all of them should if you ask me.

      Fiala and Reinhart weren't under contract when dealt which is why I agree that Debrincat will get more than they did in a trade, but imo the value shouldn't be that massive as you and Garak have portrayed.


      Fiala and Reinhart (pre trade) did not come close to matching Cat's career numbers they don't. The body of work of a player means as much or more then just one season.

      Cat = .834ppg, .435gpg
      Fiala = .675ppg, .296gpg

      That's not close and Cat is head and shoulders above Fiala not to mention, Cat plays both ends of the ice, in all situations (special teams, etc), and is more physical on top of it.

      Regarding Reinhart, we are talking about trade values (you brought him up) and you can't use this past season as part of your analysis and then argue Cat's trade value is similar to what Reinhart's was...that's inflating values after the trade to make your argument. Reinhart's numbers this past season have no value against what he was traded for. So, prior to Reinhart being traded; .649ppg, .134gpg...way off of Cat's numbers and lower then Fiala. Sorry man, but these guys aren't as good as Cat and it's not particularly close unless you cherry pick their best year (post trade for Reinhart) and compare it to one year of Cat but that's not how player value works. Nor did they have any term on their agreements. Cat is simply worth a good chunk more then what they got in return.
      Jun. 30 at 11:50 a.m.
      #25
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      Quoting: ceeque84
      Friedman said weeks ago on his podcast that DeBrincat has let management know that if Kane is being traded and especially if they are moving into rebuild mode then he wants out as well.


      That's wrong. It's the other way around. Kane said that not Cat. Kane said if Cat is traded then he's not sure he wants to stick around.
      Garak liked this.
       
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