No from buffalo. We aren't selling and Girgensons at 50% also gets alot more.

Wrong. Classic over value.

Correct, you were wrong. All is forgiven.

Did you literally just argue with my like a five year old? Wow. This explains soooo much now.

Only way he’s sold for that low is it’s a favor to Zemgus himself. No one thought Goodrow would get a first from Tampa at the 20 TDL. Zemgus isn’t that valuable but he’s worth way more than a fourth at 50% and would be beat by many teams.

I mean his username is “little Jerry” and he sure is acting like it lol 😂
Ahhhh where’s my ignore list button?! lol 😂

I mean you responded initially with just the word "wrong"

Girgensons is a very good 4th liner and PKer who has position flexibility. He is also cheap when retained and wears a letter.

If buffalo were to sell, they very likely fetch a 2nd for him.

Goodrow got a 1st as a comp

Buffalo as of now is not selling, which was my edit to the post, and are likely to resign him.

No chance Buffalo trades Zemgus for less than a 2nd. They'll most likely resign him for next year.

Unless he says he wants out & wants to go to Pittsburgh (not completely unlikely), I think he stays.

@Mr_Gardoki the only reason I disagree with your opinion on moving blueger to 3C and trading for a 4C is that blueger is the only player that gives the 4th line a reason to play… Sullivans system requires him to roll 4 lines but when he doesn’t trust the 4th line he doesn’t do that and whoever is there gets like 5 min of ice time lol so if the 4th line is Poehling-Random C/Poulin-Archibald I doubt Sullivan will play them 10 min a game… as much as we hate to see it, I feel the top older guys are better game in and game out of hen they play fewer min… I’d like to see Sid capped at 18 mi, letang at 23, and geno at 17 just to keep them fresher… maybe I’m wrong but just a thought

Lets see if the person who simply responded "wrong" to my initial post and then called me a 5 year old for responding in kind, responds to any of these reasoned responses.

I think it's way better to try and get a 3C and keep Blueger at 4C. I wouldn't break up a line that's playing that well. He's the perfect 4C and would probably be fine at 3, but 4th line isn't broken, 3rd line is, so that's what I'd try and fix.

LOL a 2nd?!?!? You're going full Habs fan here.

I said wrong and you're overvaluing. Girgensons is a solid 4th liner. If you think he'll get a 2nd you're so far out of bounds you should be a Habs fan.

I can understand that POV, but we have to think about what's realistic in the Pens world as far as cap space, available futures to sell and roster space. I get the advantage of being able to have someone like Blueger on the 4C, but I think the Pens can still build a very good 4th line with another 4C.

I'm not sure there's a better 4C in the league than Blueger, and while some will think I'm being crazy in that statement, you'll be hard-pressed to find more than a handful of 4C's who put up the numbers, both basic and advanced stats, that Blueger does and that's because he's really a 3C.

But let's look at the facts:
-Any quality 3C's available will go for a 2nd and change, maybe a 1st depending on how the market pans out.

-The Pens have zero cap space and thinking realistically, not Capfriendly-Fun-Brain, the Pens don't have any significant cap they can just easily unload. As easy as people try to make it seem, moving Kapanen is very complicated and it's very unlikely they move McGinn this year.

-Hextall isn't moving any 1sts or quality prospects (not that the Pens have many lol)

This situation makes the Pens chances of landing a true UPGRADE at 3C very difficult. Getting a quality 4C is much more realistic and gives the Pens more options.

You initially only said wrong and then edited it.

Yet somehow you quoted the full quote. The quote doesn't update on your end. Nice try though.

Nice on the trade though. Take care

You too, run along now.

Buffalo isn't interested in selling one of their captains. You'll have to over pay. Add in retention, and the lack of need for picks, anything a 3rd or worse isn't worth the time to fill out the paperwork

I agree with your takes on the price of Rental 3Cs and Hextalls approach… but I’m not sure how PIT will succeed with only two scoring lines… blueger is amazing I agree but I’m not sure he can produce offense enough and who would be on his wings?! Maybe we could upgrade his wingers if we move carter down to the 4th line…

I campaigned for blueger to be the 3C on this very site before the carter trade so i have agreed with your position in the past… but now he’s just not producing offense at all…

I’m all for giving it a shot but we def need a new player or two to add to the bottom 6 to make it more potent

Maybe we add a winger? And a 4C option? Or do you think poulin could be the 4C?

I think Zemgus will be a Sabre next year,
His Salary is a good indication of the value that that Sabres place upon him.

So you find little annoying yet you respond to him.
Let that sink in for a bit.

First, if Hextall were to acquire Zemgus, would Sullivan not pair him Blueger to take advantage of the Riga connection?

Second, Since Teddy and Zemgus have the same salary, what do you think would be a fair value for Teddy?
Well that is what the Sabres think is a fair value for Zemgus.

Third, while it may be unlikely any team would give a second for Zemgus, unless he requested a trade (as @kclar suggested) it would take a second to pry him out of Buffalo.
28-17-21 are really good at controlling the puck in the offensive zone.

Finally, Since the Sabres have figured out how to win with 3 AHL defensemen in the line up (Clague, Fitzgerald and Pilut) I suspect when Power, Jokiharju and Lyubushkin return they will do even better and Zemgus' price will go up.

I think you should go revisit Blue's production. He had 28 points in 65 games last year, and that's playing on the 4th line. Also remember, that Sully does deploy the 4th line against team's top lines. As far as his production NOW, remember he's only recently back from an injury which he's clearly starting to rebound from. I have no doubt that Blueger would be a production 3rd line winger and having Carter on his wing allows Carter to let some of his workload move to Blueger and he can just focus on getting to the net.

I think finding an upgrade on the 3rd line wing is more realistic than a C. 3C's are usually a commodity at the deadline and get more than they should, but who knows, maybe Hextall can pull off some magic.

Obviously if Z wants to remain with Buffalo this is all moot. That's an entirely different discussion, but it could still be possible they have an agreement in place to re-sign in the off-season after a trade. It's not super common, but it has happened.

I don't think Sully would deploy Z on the 3rd line unless it's an injury. I like Girgensons, but he really shouldn't be playing above the 4th line IMO. Is it possible? Sure and I'm sure Sully would try a few different looks to see what works.

Value for Blueger? That's tougher to gauge. I'd put him more in the Lehkonen category. Blueger is superb 200ft player, SUPERB and he produces like a 3rd line forward playing on the 4th line, and I'm not sure if you watch many Pens games, but Sully deploys the 4th line against top lines all the time, so he's not getting easy assignments. This is vague, but I'd put Blueger's value anywhere between a 3rd + GOOD prospect and a 2nd + mid-level prospect. It really depends on the market which is why it's always hard to really put an exact value on these kinds of players.

I'm slightly confused by your last comment/question. What is the correlation you're drawing between the performance of your defensemen and the value of Z?

Great answer, much better than "your an idiot you need to watch hockey."
Let's start with your last comment, if the Sabres are in the hunt (because they have healthy defensemen) the Sabres would be even less likely to trade Zemgus and his price would be even higher.

Please I do not want to say who is more valuable just that each team is lucky to have a forward who were born in Riga.
Zemgus suffered playing under Krueger, but over the past four seasons Teddy has played 194 games scoring 26 goals, while Zemgus played 228 g and scored 30 goals.
Offensive Zone starts and assists makes Teddy the obvious stronger of the two.
Over the past 2 years Teddy OZ% have been 14.7, 29.3 much lower than Zemgus 42.2 and 38.4 with 51 assists v only 32 for Zemgus.
Let's agree that it would take a kings ransom for Hextall to trade Teddy, as it would for Karmanos to move Girgensons.
It is shocking how many Penguin and Sabre ACGM's trade Teddy or Zemgus for low round picks.

I'm not sure I agree with your logic Girgensons based on how good the team will be defensively. If BUF is a seller at the deadline, their teams success will have little to do with affecting the price of Girgensons. I get where you're coming from, but it doesn't really matter in that case. If Buffalo plans to sell, the price will be dictated by what teams are willing to pay.

I appreciate the stats you listed, but it still proves to Teddy producing more offense. To put it all in more context I did a player compare on NST and the stats and all stats favor Teddy. Teddy is better defensively and generates far more offense with predominantly starting from the defensive zone. To do what Teddy does starting from a defensive deployment is very difficult.

Zemgus is a fine 4th liner and we can play the we're both overvaluing, but Blueger would definitely garner a higher return.