no it would be a big issue, it would highlight not starting on time in the series and then not clutching when the season is on the line in game 7. The very two cruxes of the Leafs over the last however many years

Rielly and Brodie should honestly be reunited

McCabe-Brodie has been awful this series. Not even close to a shutdown pair

I get Rielly-Schenn had worked but its time for drastic changed up and down the lineup

No more room for error time to get the big boyz going and for our blue line to be better 5 on 5

Check out Hyman's career playoff points and tell me that's who we need. You guys are overreacting for sure. Major changes aren't the answer, a new voice yes, maybe a new personality but that'll come from a coach who can win. Keefe is a great regular season coach but he just can't adjust fast enough to work in the playoffs. He has made zero adjustments in these playoffs. Zero and you have to make hundreds of them.

The fanbase is lost. Not everyone's crosby where he won in 4 years after being drafted

It took

Stamkos 12 years
Ovie 14 years
MacKinnon 9 years
Keep the list going

Toronto has finally won a round for the first time in 19 years almost 2 decades. Build off that. Dont be like we took a step blow it all up no. That kind of mindset would lead a franchise to ruin. No matter how the series ends whether its in 4, 5,6,or 7 heck maybe even a reverse sweep u look and go k what changes still need to happen not well we won a round blow it all up.

If this was any other fanbase people would be like hey broke an almost 2 decade curse thats something but its Toronto and fans be spoiled over here

But remember this playoffs so far has been Leafs beating some of their demons

Game 4 vs Tampa down 4-1 what happened won 5-4. 2013 demon eliminated. Hadnt won a first round series in 19 years what they do accomplish it beating a team who went to the SCF 3 times in a row.

What if the hockey gods are making this an early problem that then goes to 7 for another demon to be beat. Could happen. As if the stars start scoring we got ourselves a series again even down 3-0. As if were making things close without them scoring what happens when they start lul probs win the next 3 heck maybe even 4 to complete the reverse sweep. And hey they lose in 7 we cant say they didnt try in the end.

Again, can you please explain how it took Ovi 17 years? Last time I checked he won in 2017-18, and he entered the league in 2005-06, which means it took him 12 years. Don’t even think about bringing the lightning into this lol, they made the finals once before and the conference finals numerous times before winning back to back. Not even remotely comparable to being the laughing stock of the league for 7 straight years.

My mistake 14 years but still thats a long time lul. 14 years it took ovie to get out of the second round 14.

And if we want more lets look at the record

https://champsorchumps.us/team/nhl/washington-capitals


So thinking we were gonna easily get out of the second round is just nonsense.

To me Toronto is honestly almost a perfect mirror of washington. I remember the year before Ovie won it all people were going this aint it blow it up, trade Ovie.

What happened they stuck to it continued adding and then finally beat their demon known as the Penguins and won it all

Toronto finally overcame the demon of the first round that held them back for 19 years. But that demon is a stepping stone. There are more to overcome. As to what happens next idk

To me if u want to go simplistic a new coach is the place to start. Someone who knows the ins and outs of playoff hockey. Now the options are not great but there is one man who might be someone to explore

Peter Laviolette. Guy made NSH one of the scariest teams in the NHL. Maybe his style is what Toronto needs rn. As while WSH run wasnt great injuries were a ****

I agree with you. Not saying Hyman is the exact guy we need (although he'd be awfully nice), my point was mainly that we are missing guys that play his style. He worked so hard and won so many battles down low. The Leafs are lacking that kind of work ethic right now.

I want a new head coach before we make any huge changes. No point in jumping the gun here

This whole "slaying demons" rhetoric is so overblown. Exactly zero of the Leafs care about the past. Only 1 current Leaf experienced the 4 - 1 choke against Boston. It means absolutely nothing. Their focus is the now, but they just aren't playing good. And again, why be satisfied with losing?

Fire the coach, that's the only change I would make

He makes a good point, imagine with Washington had blown it up instead of staying the course and finding the right Coach. That's what's needed, a new coach. I have no idea why anyone is defending him and instead want to trade Matthews, Nylander or Marner. It's frankly stupid

If there is anyway to find some sort on silver lining coming this offseason, IF they move Murray out (buyout, trade, LTIR) they could have close to 20mil to revamp this roster.



I'm still uncertain of who I would want that person to be. You have an aging Tavares who is not an 11mil dollar player anymore (terrible at 5v5), and aging Brodie who looks like he has lost a step, an aging Giordano who should retire next season, I love O'Reilly but is signing another slowish 32 year old C the best use of cap. I don't know, but money is there to change this group.

Might need more than just him but yes there is still work to do

Hey they created the demons time to slay em

2 down 1 very big one to go unless they get another one made after R2 is over win or lose

Was doing some quick maths and to me there is some intriguing solutions

Rn my 2023-2024 team is

Barbashev-Matthews-Nylander (might trade him but need to find the right deal)
Knies-JT-Marner
Robertson-ROR-Jarnkrok
Lafferty-Holmberg-Acciari

Rielly-Brodie
McCabe-Liligren
Rifai-Timmins

Samsonov
Woll

Extras: Giordano, McMann, Steeves

Debating Connor Hellybuyck though

GM: Treeliving Coach: Laviolette

I don't think so, I think everyone is giving Keefe a pass and blaming the stars for bad luck. The system we play is the coaches business and Florida is getting it done by exploiting the weakness in the system. In years past, you could blame some guys for mistakes that cost us or the players just didn't have what it takes but right now, the team is doing exactly what their coach wants.

Maintain possession at all cost, never flip it to centre, never dump it in. Hold it along the boards and try to find a guy open in front but no one is in front for rebounds.

Zero adjustments when it doesn't work because he feels like it's all fine, it'll work next time! Nope, you have to figure out how to make those adjustments and change things on the fly. Keefe is terrible at that. They lose it's on him. This team is clearly good enough to win, they just need the right guy moving chess pieces around during the games and Keefe isn't that.

Your GM and Coach ideas are ****ing terrible man. Laviolette sucks and Trevling dumpstered the Flames. This is the exact backwards thinking that I fear. Old school morons who will try to make their mark and will just go backwards and wreck the team. May as well just rebuild

Fixed it

Brodie was terrific 99% of the year. Id bet he is playing hurt

Go read this thread if you have a minute

I dont see a Marner trade as any trade we do involving him will be a loss even Pappetti said it



As the last thing we want is to do a trade like we saw CGY do with Tkachuck. U trade Marner for 2 guys and everyone goes great then they underperform while Marner just takes another step and RIP our sanity

Nylander could get a haul and I see a trade with CGY being perfect (Mangiapane + Dube)

I see it differently, all good.



"The real conundrum here is Marner. The Leafs winger had six points in their opening 7-3, 7-2 decisions against Tampa Bay (which included a couple shots from distance that got some luck) and some power play assists. He has no goals and one single power play assist over the past four games (and hasn’t scored in seven). While Marner does kill penalties, his recent five-on-five threat level is almost non-existent, not only because he isn't creating as much, but also because he's struggling to manage the puck effectively.

What’s caught my eye most is a stylistic change from how Marner plays in the regular season. I don’t know if it’s nerves, or if it’s just the way the game changes in the playoffs, but when it’s more physical out there, the only way to be able to maintain your non-physical game is to skate, skate, skate away from pressure, like prime Patrick Kane. You have to be able to do it at speed. And Marner’s post-season default has been to try and slow things down too much, and punt, punt, punt on his touches."

In the regular season, the Leafs' talented winger led his team in D-zone exits - both carry-outs and passes – and he did it with the fourth-highest success rate on his attempts (that’s among Leafs forwards who played about 25 games this season, via Sportlogiq). In the playoffs, he dropped in every category, and his success rate dropped to eighth among Leafs forwards. Even when he’s tried to dump the puck out, his success rate has dropped a few percentage points there too, likely due to increased pressure.

"What might be most concerning, is Marner's inability to get through the neutral zone and do something effective with the puck. His strength has been controlling the pace of play and dictating to opponents what’s going to happen next. Typically when they’ve wanted him to relinquish the puck, he’ll slow it down, go east-west, and seem to defy hockey’s natural rhythms. In the post-season sometimes you have to take what’s there rather than turn it over, meaning dump-in rates go up. Marner’s dump-in rate has indeed gone from 31.8 per cent to 37.3 per cent (which is a lot), but the Leafs are only recovering his dump-ins a team-worst 19.4 per cent of the time, where in the regular season they recovered 42.2 per cent of his dumped pucks (second-best on the team).

It feels like he’s not skating and is rushing plays, so he’s not even putting the puck in places that help the group. I don’t think he isn’t trying or doesn’t care or anything like that, but not everyone rises to the big moments a la Justin Williams (or more recently, Leon Draisaitl). It could be bad luck, it could be … a Rorschach test for you to impose your own opinion on why you think this player starts playing differently as the pressure mounts."

That is a big move that I could maybe get behind but I also feel like it's a bad idea. I think Marner more than anyone struggles with the mental part of this game. When it gets hard he overthinks and does weird stuff. Passes when he should shoot, hold it top long, shoot when he should pass etc etc. More than anyone else he struggles. But he's also an incredible hockey player who does so much and loves being a leaf. Not sure what to do with him other than take him away from the stars and let him figure it out lower in the lineup.

You must see the irony of this post. You can't trade Marner because it'll be as bad as Calgary trading Tkachuk and then you trade Nylander to Calgary for 2 40 point small wingers.