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ducks fans i have a question

Created by: sens65
Team: 2023-24 Ottawa Senators
Initial Creation Date: Mar. 19, 2024
Published: Mar. 19, 2024
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Description
Question A:

Is John Gibson available?

Question B:

What is the desired return for him?

Question C:

How much are the Ducks willing to retain?
Trades
Buyouts
Retained Salary Transactions
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2024
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the BOS
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the DET
Logo of the FLA
Logo of the TBL
Logo of the OTT
2025
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the FLA
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
2026
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
Logo of the OTT
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
22$83,500,000$83,325,713$0$1,932,500$174,287
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$8,205,714$8,205,714
LW
UFA - 5
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$8,350,000$8,350,000
C
UFA - 8
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$6,500,000$6,500,000
RW, C
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$2,950,000$2,950,000
LW, RW
UFA - 3
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$863,333$863,333
C, LW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$4,975,000$4,975,000
RW, LW
UFA - 4
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$2,500,000$2,500,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$835,000$835,000
C, RW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$762,500$762,500
LW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$825,000$825,000 (Performance Bonus$82,500$82K)
C
RFA - 3
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$758,333$758,333
LW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$775,000$775,000
C
RFA - 1
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$8,000,000$8,000,000
LD
UFA - 5
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$4,600,000$4,600,000
RD
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$4,000,000$4,000,000
G
M-NTC
UFA - 5
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$4,600,000$4,600,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$1,100,000$1,100,000
RD
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$2,750,000$2,750,000
G
UFA - 2
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$2,000,000$2,000,000
LD/RD, LW
RFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$805,000$805,000
RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Anaheim Ducks
$6,400,000$6,400,000
G
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$1,850,000$2M)
LD
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$775,000$775,000
C
UFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$7,950,000$7,950,000
C
UFA - 7
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$775,000$775,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Ottawa Senators
$775,000$775,000
RW, C
UFA - 3

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Mar. 19 at 2:01 p.m.
#1
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Not a Ducks fan - but I'd have to imagine it's something like Boston's 1st + good prospect(s): Kleven, Jarventie, etc. + probably one of your AHL goalies. If it's after the draft it gets a lot harder because neither team would probably want to acquire future Ottawa 1st (unclear future in OTT).
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Mar. 19 at 2:05 p.m.
#2
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Quoting: JackSC87
Not a Ducks fan - but I'd have to imagine it's something like Boston's 1st + good prospect(s): Kleven, Jarventie, etc. + probably one of your AHL goalies. If it's after the draft it gets a lot harder because neither team would probably want to acquire future Ottawa 1st (unclear future in OTT).


That's a lot to ask for for a goalie who has below league average stats for 5 straight seasons.
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Mar. 19 at 2:11 p.m.
#3
MisstheWhalers
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Question D:

Would John Gibson waive for Ottawa?

No
sens65, GiggywithGibby, csick and 3 others liked this.
Mar. 19 at 2:13 p.m.
#4
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Quoting: MisstheWhalers
Question D:

Would John Gibson waive for Ottawa?

No


Eh, you never know.
Mar. 19 at 2:13 p.m.
#5
Future Ducks legend
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1: Probably for the right price, but it's well known all of Canada is on his 10 team list. Dostal isn't ready for starting duties yet and Anaheim defense isn't set yet either, Verbeek seems more than happy to ride out that deal.

2: This varies wildly, this season goalie asks were high for dedicated starters. Late first or a second and a prospect of interest. POI between Ottawa and Anaheim are difficult because the two prospect pools have the same strengths and weaknesses, Centers and LHD galore, weak at wings and RHD.

3: minimal/next to nothing, maybe 1.4 million tops, but that would add significantly to the acquisition cost.

It's a moot point though, as he 1: won't waive for Ottawa and 2: I don't think even he could save Ottawa, the chances you guys give up on the D zone are 10 bell when they happen.
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Mar. 19 at 2:20 p.m.
#6
KFTW
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Quoting: GiggywithGibby
1: Probably for the right price, but it's well known all of Canada is on his 10 team list. Dostal isn't ready for starting duties yet and Anaheim defense isn't set yet either, Verbeek seems more than happy to ride out that deal.

2: This varies wildly, this season goalie asks were high for dedicated starters. Late first or a second and a prospect of interest. POI between Ottawa and Anaheim are difficult because the two prospect pools have the same strengths and weaknesses, Centers and LHD galore, weak at wings and RHD.

3: minimal/next to nothing, maybe 1.4 million tops, but that would add significantly to the acquisition cost.

It's a moot point though, as he 1: won't waive for Ottawa and 2: I don't think even he could save Ottawa, the chances you guys give up on the D zone are 10 bell when they happen.


I get u guys may draft a Dman but a lineup of :
Lindstrom-McTavish-Zegras
Gauthier-Carlsson-Terry

Would be insane
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Mar. 19 at 2:28 p.m.
#7
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Edited Mar. 19 at 2:38 p.m.
Quoting: JackSC87
Not a Ducks fan - but I'd have to imagine it's something like Boston's 1st + good prospect(s): Kleven, Jarventie, etc. + probably one of your AHL goalies. If it's after the draft it gets a lot harder because neither team would probably want to acquire future Ottawa 1st (unclear future in OTT).


Haha 32/32 NHL teams think that is an insane ask. Including Verbeek. Gibson's last good season was 2018-19. He'll be 31+ with three more years at an above average cap hit for average at best play.
sens65 liked this.
Mar. 19 at 2:39 p.m.
#8
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Quoting: csick
I get u guys may draft a Dman but a lineup of :
Lindstrom-McTavish-Zegras
Gauthier-Carlsson-Terry

Would be insane


We're thinking it's going to be Leshunov, but if he goes before our pick, it's more than likely a forward. Verbeek won't take a LHD and the next RHD is way down the list.
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Mar. 19 at 3:02 p.m.
#9
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Edited Mar. 19 at 3:07 p.m.. Reason: added explanatory phrase
Quoting: jfkst1
Haha 32/32 NHL teams think that is an insane ask. Including Verbeek. Gibson's last good season was 2018-19. He'll be 31+ with three more years at an above average cap hit for average at best play.

There are 20 goalies who have appeared in 40 or more games for their team this season. Here are 5 at the bottom of the statistical tables:
Goalie A: 0.907 save % (14th), 3.03 GAA (16th)
Goalie B: 0.902 save % (16th), 2.83 GAA (14th)
Goalie C: 0.898 save % (17th), 2.96 GAA (15th)
Goalie D: 0.896 save % (18th), 3.05 GAA (18th)
Goalie E: 0.892 save % (19th), 3.38 GAA (20th)

The one-third of a goal per game difference between the guy in 8th place by wins and John Gibson (20th in wins) is 14 goals.

The 0.006% difference in saves between the guy in 9th place by wins and John Gibson is 6 shots out of one thousand.

The guy who has more wins than any other goalie in the League is Goalie B. The difference between him and John Gibson in save % is one shot in one hundred.
Mar. 19 at 3:06 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
There are 20 goalies who have appeared in 40 or more games for their team. Here are 5 at the bottom of the statistical tables:
Goalie A: 0.907 save % (14th), 3.03 GAA (16th)
Goalie B: 0.902 save % (16th), 2.83 GAA (14th)
Goalie C: 0.898 save % (17th), 2.96 GAA (15th)
Goalie D: 0.896 save % (18th), 3.05 GAA (18th)
Goalie E: 0.892 save % (19th), 3.38 GAA (20th)

The one-third of a goal per game difference between the guy in 8th place by wins and John Gibson (20th) is 14 goals.

The 0.006% difference in saves between the guy in 9th place by wins and John Gibson is 6 shots out of one thousand.

The guy who has more wins than any other goalie in the League is Goalie B. The difference between him and John Gibson in save % is one shot in one hundred.


Not sure what your point is. If it is that there is marginal difference between most goalies I largely agree with you. Though that only further illustrates the problem with Gibson's value relative to cheaper alternatives. GAA and especially wins aren't really useful in measuring individual goal career performances either as they are stats heavily reliant on the team in front.
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Mar. 19 at 3:15 p.m.
#11
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Quoting: jfkst1
Not sure what your point is. If it is that there is marginal difference between most goalies I largely agree with you. Though that only further illustrates the problem with Gibson's value relative to cheaper alternatives. GAA and especially wins aren't really useful in measuring individual goal career performances either as they are stats heavily reliant on the team in front.

I
COULD
NOT
AGREE
WITH
YOU
MORE.

Which is why I react so badly to the nincompoops who always say "Gibson hasn't been good for {x} years."

By the way, Goalie C makes almost exactly 50% more than Gibson.
Mar. 19 at 3:23 p.m.
#12
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
I
COULD
NOT
AGREE
WITH
YOU
MORE.

Which is why I react so badly to the nincompoops who always say "Gibson hasn't been good for {x} years."

By the way, Goalie C makes almost exactly 50% more than Gibson.


Because he hasn't been and it's a massive sample of not outperforming much cheaper alternatives. All the more reason more teams are going to shared goaltending duties and reducing the value of individual goalies. Very few goalies are consistently strong and Gibson isn't one of them. So he is a risk on that contract that many teams probably view as a liability. Combined with his 10-NTC makes it ZERO chance he's getting any return close to what some posted in here.
Mar. 19 at 3:49 p.m.
#13
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Quoting: sens65
That's a lot to ask for for a goalie who has below league average stats for 5 straight seasons.


The price of acquisition in part reflects that the Ducks need a guy capable of starting 50 game next season and maybe another season after that. I haven't looked at available UFA goalies but the track record of most of the guys signing starter contracts have blown up hard on teams in the past few years. Campbell, Korpisalo, Cal Petersen, Husso, Vanacek, etc. Trying to get a "free" guy via free agency has a lot of risk.

Or you go the trade for a starter route and part of the return for Gibson goes right back out the door to some other team. It's hard to come up with a Gibson trade where the Ducks actually come out as a better team because of the trade. It would be far easier and possibly cheaper asset-wise to just ride Gibson into the ground for another couple of seasons.
 
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