Aug 18, 2017
Toronto Maple Leafs
Sep 12, 1995
Posts per Day
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>CrossFireX33</b></div><div>I was going off of his rumored asking price. Unless I see something legitamate that says different than 8 Million, I'm going to assume that's what he'll get</div></div>
However, I think the story broke because Barrie's agent told someone in the media that they were looking for a $50,000,000 contract (without providing specifics).
Then the TV analysts used the $50,000,000 asking price to estimate / predict a 6-year deal with an $8,000,000 cap-hit (I could be wrong / missing info though).
Barrie's camp has a bunch of different options though ... not limited too:
<strong>$8,000,000 x 6 years</strong> = $48,000,000 total (35 years old at expiry)
<strong>$7,250,000 x 7 years</strong> = $51,000,000 total (36 years old at expiry + TOR can front-load salary)
<strong>$6,750,000 x 8 years</strong> = $54,000,000 total (37 years old at expiry + TOR can front-load salary + TOR is Barrie's only option)
All else being equal ... I'd choose the 8-year deal with the extra $6,000,000 guaranteed ... hopefully Barrie agrees (Ryan Ellis did).
It's tough to predict injuries / how your body will hold up in your mid-late 30's (most guys are forced out of the league by 35).
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Bf3351</b></div><div><a href="/users/drewjenks" target="_blank">@drewjenks</a> .........</div></div>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>CrossFireX33</b></div><div>Math is hard</div></div>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>SammyT_51</b></div><div>Most of the Leafs fans dont even count on re-signing Barrie next year.. he would not be a Leaf next year which is fine.</div></div>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Jamiepo</b></div><div>Tavares....</div></div>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Ledge_And_Dairy</b></div><div>With Andersen and Rielly contracts coming up and Hyman being the only +1M contract coming off the books between then, signing Barrie (for his minimum 8M) would be the absolute stupidest thing Dubas could do. I would highly suggest someone like Shattenkirk next year who shouldn't cost more than 4.5M max (probably less) if you need another offensive defenseman.</div></div>
<strong>Question to BF3351 ... What are you trying to accomplish with your plan of:</strong>
1) Ignoring everything I said in our discussion (link to it below).
2) Then mis-quoting me and making an entire team with fake numbers.
3) Just to display that I'm "wrong" or don't know hockey / don't know math ???
I'm kinda interested in learning your mindset LOL ... but here are the actual numbers quoted from my comment <em>(the one you based this team off):</em>
<strong>QUOTE 1</strong> = <em>"Required Signings = 3 defensemen (Dermott = $2,000,000 / Muzzin = $5,000,000 / Barrie = $7,000,000)"</em>
If we make the honest adjustments:
- <strong>Dermott</strong> = $2,000,000 x 1/2 years <strong>(not $3,000,000 x 3)</strong> Dermott hasn't left the Leafs bottom pair (and he'll likely stay there this season).
- <strong>Muzzin</strong> = $5,000,000 x 6/7 years <strong>(not $5,500,000 x 4)</strong> Muzzin likely prefers an extra $8,000,000 - $13,000,000 over a slightly higher cap no?
- <strong>Barrie</strong> = $7,000,000 x 7/8 years <strong>(not $7,500,000 x 5)</strong> Barrie likely prefers an extra $12,000,000 - $18,000,000 over a slightly higher cap no?
Boom ... now we're only $350,000 over<strong> your </strong>salary cap (which is $1,000,000 less than the $84,000,000 cap that the NHL recently projected).
Their projections aren't always perfect (last years was off) but they're usually solid (and I assume that they want to avoid making the same mistake twice in a row).
<strong>End result = The above team now have $650,000 in cap-space ... and all you had to not intentionally mis-quote me.</strong>
However ... I'll add one more of my quotes ... just to ensure that <em>"my team"</em> is cap-compliant in any situation:
<strong>QUOTE 2</strong> = <em>"They really don't have to sign Barrie if he wants too much money. They could also trade Kappy + Hyman for help on defense or cap-space"</em>
The key points to pick up on are:
- Barrie doesn't have to be re-signed (depends on his price) and if he has a down year he may get less than expected (Gardiner's a good example of this).
- Kapanen + Hyman can be traded <strong>for help on defense</strong> (not just given away for nothing ... as in your above example for some reason).
- Packaging Kappy + Hyman (plus futures if needed) easily nets the Leafs a serviceable defensemen or two (to replace Barrie).
- Toronto is giving up two young(ish) forwards on team-friendly deals (so the defenders coming back should cost less than Barrie).
- The easiest option is to replace Barrie with a less expensive UFA (someone with less offense but solid defense ... which might improve the team).
<strong>If they let Barrie walk and replace him with a RD in the $3,000,000 - $5,000,000 range (via signing or trade) ... than your above team now has:
- $2,650,000 - $4,650,000 in excess cap-space
- A full 23 man roster with respectable defense:</strong>
Rielly - <strong>Acquired ($3,000,000 - $5,000,000 player)</strong>
Muzzin - Dermott
Sandin - Liljegren
Harpur - Holl
Gravel - Schmaltz
So yeah ... I'm surprised you took your response this far (without intending to being honest) ... but I got 10 minutes of entertainment so it's all good.
Link to our original conversation that you made this team from = <a href="https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/277740&post_id=1121184">https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/277740&post_id=1121184</a>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Bf3351</b></div><div>Get used to it. Leafs are gonna be full of desperation next season ;)</div></div>
<strong>LMAO ... OK there bud. </strong>
1) All of the Leafs key forwards are already signed through next season.
2) All of the Leafs press-boxers are already signed through next season.
2) Anderson + Rielly + Sandin + Liljegren are signed through next season.
Hyman - Matthews - Nylander
Johnson - Tavares - Marner
T.Moore - Kerfoot - Kapanen
N.Petan - Gauthier - Agostino
Reilly - Sandin - Liljegren
Anderson - Joe Woll
Agostino - Kossila + (Gravel or Holl)
<strong>2020-21 SEASON TOTALS</strong>
<strong>Signed Roster</strong> = 20 Players
<strong>Team Cap-Hit</strong> = $70,500,000
<strong>Salary Cap Est</strong> = $84,500,000
<strong>Remaining Cap Space</strong> = $14,000,000
<strong>Required Signings</strong> = 3 Defensemen (Dermott = $2,000,000 / Muzzin = $5,000,000 / Barrie = $7,000,000)
<strong>Total Cost</strong> = $14,000,000
And Toronto really doesn't have to sign Barrie if he wants too much money.
They could also trade Kappy + Hyman for help on defense or cap-space.
Especially if Mikheyev + Moore keep playing as well as they are.
<strong>Go check it for yourself though ... I mean, were definitely on the right website. </strong>
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>buxvet</b></div><div>The trouble next year is even worse than one might expect
Which no one really seems to be talking about
What happens when the fake 11m in cap space disappears
With the expiration of the ltir from Horton + Clarkson because their contracts are up
With just 12 players signed for next year and a cap hit of 67.271
This only leaves 14.2M in cap space to sign 11 players
Even if your really bullish of the cap going up, lets say it jumps to 85M
That still only about 17.5M for 11 guys or about 1.6M per signing on avg
I just can't see how Nylander can stay</div></div>
<strong>"With just 12 players signed for next year and a cap hit of 67.271. This only leaves 14.2M in cap space to sign 11 players"</strong>
<strong>How about some context </strong>... he're are some other teams "12 most expensive contracts locked in for next year" ....
$75,374,999 = Tampa Bay Lightning
$69,617,855 = Winnipeg Jets
$67,722,857 = Philadelphia Flyers
$67,556,944 = Arizona Coyotes
$66,469,800 = New York Rangers
$65,663,333 = Vegas Golden Nights
$65,227,417 = San Jose Sharks
<strong>And most of these teams still have re-sign some key pieces.</strong>
<strong>As for the Leafs</strong>
After $2,000,000 - $4,000,000 in cap-growth .... the Leafs will have between $16,000,0000 - $19,000,000 to sign (or promote):
- 1 backup goalie ($800,000)
- 3 press-boxers ($2,100,000)
- 3 fourth liners ($2,400,000)
- Travis Dermott ($2,000,000 x 2)
- Jake Muzzin ($5,000,000 x 7)
- Tyson Barrie ($6,500,000 x 7)
<strong>TOTAL = $18,800,000</strong>
LOL this is not an issue at all ... they could trade Hyman is they have to ... or sign someone cheaper than Barrie.
Johnson - Matthews - Nylander
Kapanen - Tavares - Marner
T. Moore - Kerfoot - Hyman
ANYONE - ANYONE - ANYONE
Muzzin - Barrie
Rielly - Dermott
Sandin - Liljegren
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>thelastlongbow</b></div><div>So pissed off seeing this as a Leafs fan. I was relieved to hear Marner sign but seeing this, I don't see any love for Toronto or any soft of discount. Everyone says he took too much, but as much as 1.5mil per in excess. Even a 9mx6 deal compared to 6.75x3 for Point sounds bad when taking importance of position and term into account.
Thanks, Mitch. Thanks, Auston. Thanks, Kyle.</div></div>
Dubas honestly should have signed all 3 of them to bridge deals.
Even if he had to overpay for bridge deals ... which would have looked something like:
$8,500,000 x 3 = <strong>Matthews </strong> (his agent reportedly asked for $9,000,000 x 3)
$7,000,000 x 3 = <strong>Marner</strong>
$5,000,000 x 3 = <strong>Nylander</strong>
Those would have saved <strong>$8,500,000</strong> for the next 3 years ... and none of them would have gotten "paid for potential" on their next deals.
Which would force them to earn a massive extension ... or sign for something similar (possibly less) than their current contracts.
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Brian2016</b></div><div>It's a 3 year bridge deal. If this were a 6-7 year deal the $$ would've been substantially higher.</div></div>
Honestly ... I'm a Leaf fan ... and there's zero chance Point end's up with Marner type money over the next 6 years:
<strong>Mitch Marner </strong>
6 Year AAV = $10,890,000
Year 1 (Contract 1) = $6,750,000
Year 2 (Contract 1) = $6,750,000
Year 3 (Contract 1) = $6,750,000
Year 4 (Contract 2) = $15,030,000
Year 5 (Contract 2) = $15,030,000
Year 6 (Contract 2) = $15,030,000
6 Year AAV = $10,890,000
If Tampa can keep Point's next cap-hit under $15,030,000 and his term over 2 years ... they'll come out laughing.
<strong>And if I had to guess</strong> ... I'd guess that Point's next contract will look very similar to Marner's current contract.