That marner contract will never happen. Moore is better then petan and bracco, harpur doesnt make the marlies top 6

not a leafs expert but i was mostly asking about the trade. It clears up 2M in cap space in case you do end up giving Marner that contract. Do you think it's a fair trade?

The Ceci trade saves the Leafs about 1.25m after the trade and Ceci's replacement. Not worth it, Leafs need Ceci this year. Wouldn't want Harpur, Schmaltz and Holl as 5/6/7 as the bottom when every one is healthy.

I like the trade only if the leafs are able to get another defenseman in a separate trade.

that;s fair. How would you solve the Marner problem then? He has all the leverage imo. Leafs can't afford to pull a Nylander on him because his cap hit if signed after season starts becomes higher than his normal AAV. And please don't say he'll sign for less than 10.5 x 5

I think the Leafs did really good signing Gravel. In his limited time with Edmonton I often liked him on the 3rd pair whenever he'd play. He's quiet for a 3rd pair defenceman which is good. I think the Leafs can roll:

Reilly - Muzzin
Dermott - Barrie
Gravel - ???

Leafs be better off trading Marner then to over pay. Should of not have gave Matthews that kind of money. Tavares made sense he already proved himself.

FAX!! Dubas really messed up Matthews signing him to that money and term. It's really that contract that set precedence over the other RFAs. I get it, elite goal scorer, close to PPG, and centre. But no way should he have gotten that contract. Closer comparable should've been Jack Eichel.

Yeah I know the cap goes up for a delayed Marner signing. But that was the purpose of the Clarkson acquisition, somehow (don't ask me how) the Leafs could get more cap space with a delayed signing.
I figure Johnsson or Kapanen would have to get traded for cap space. Traded for futures since the Leafs do have wingers as possible replacements. Leafs need Ceci this year but welcome the cap space that Ceci, Muzzin and Barrie will provide next summer.
Yes, Dubas overpaid Matthews and Nylander, but that doesn't mean the Leafs have any obligation to continue the tradition. Just like some teams have very cap friendly deals on their stars, but new RFAs do not have to settle for that "low bar". Aho's had identical figures and value to Marner in the past two seasons and he just signed for 8.5m X 5. Lots of good RFAs are waiting for the "next guy" to sign to truly set the RFA wage bar.
So unless an offer sheet is forthcoming, I don't know how you can say Marner has all leverage. My prediction 8.5m X 3.

So you'd rather give up 4 years of Johnsson or 3 years of Kapanen rather than 1 year of Ceci? Those two signed really good value deals. I get you guys need defencemen but dang, since when did Ceci become a reliable top 4 option anyways? I'd take Johnsson or Kapanen all day over Ceci.

Yes, I'd say Marner has all the leverage because he can sit out until December 1st if it came down to it. Whatever they're offering now, they can still offer December 1st. But if he accepts then, the Leafs would be in tougher due to the delayed signing. I don't imagine you guys wanna see Marner sit all season long considering your time to win the Cup is now.

Of course the Leafs don't want Marner out till December or all year. But Marner doesn't want to miss all that time either or miss at on a 8 m or so paycheque this year. You make it sound the Leafs are so desperate. What about all the RFA players and teams? Probably all would want a deal in August or certainly by October 1st. But if its isn't....so what. Remember the player has the option to sign with any team, in any league, including the NHL. When hasn't signed with any team, doesn't it show the player doesn't have the leverage you think?
But let's stop this nonsense that the Leafs time to win the Cup is now (this year). Actually I think the Leafs even with Marner are poorer than last year....all those Dmen defections. Actually I'm more optimistic for 2020/21 and the year after.
But the "trade" isn't Ceci for Johnsson. It's one year of Ceci and the assets in trade for Johnsson for Johnsson.

The only Leverage marner has is withholding his services this year. In which case he loses about 10m... not a lot of leverage.

You are a bit confused on the late signing. Much like nylander did last year 10m cap hit that was prorated to 7m for time missed. Or jimmy Schuldt with Vegas. Do you really think they were hit with 6.6m cap hit to play him for 1 game?

To make the numbers simple let’s say marner misses 20% of the season and gets a 10m contract. His cap hit would be 12.5m and pro rated for time missed.... 10m total.

How does Marner have "all" the leverage? Wait...how does he have any leverage? Leafs have the cap space to match offer sheets but that doesn't matter. Marner won't sign one because he wants to be in Toronto.

Leafs have a good good team with or without Marner so if decides to sit regular season games, he will only hurt his bargaining power.
The smart Leafs fans were predicting a punt year and maybe even with all these moves it still will be but signing Marner to bad contract is worse than a punt year.

If we get a D man to replace Ceci then maybe okay.
But you didnt do that.

We cant afford to trot out Harpur, Holl, Gravel, and Schmaltz all as everyday players.
They are not good enough.

I also dont think Leafs agree to 5 year deal with Marner this would walk him to UFA.
Beyond dumb, Leafs have all the leverage with threat of an offer sheet non-existent.

I couldn't have said it better myself. Bravo sir