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Reasonable 2nd OA trade for both

Created by: Caufield
Team: 2023-24 Montreal Canadiens
Initial Creation Date: Jun. 15, 2023
Published: Jun. 15, 2023
Salary Cap Mode: Basic
Trades
MTL
  1. 2023 1st round pick (ANA)
  2. 2023 5th round pick (ANA)
ANA
  1. Hutson, Lane [Reserve List]
  2. 2023 1st round pick (FLA)
  3. 2023 1st round pick (MTL)
Additional Details:
Not saying either team does that, but value-wise, this is what we are looking at. (Choice of Hutson or Guhle, but I think Hutson might be worth more)
Buyouts
DraftRound 1Round 2Round 3Round 4Round 5Round 6Round 7
2023
Logo of the ANA
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the PIT
Logo of the VGK
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the CGY
Logo of the ANA
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
2024
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the COL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the SJS
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the EDM
2025
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the CGY
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
Logo of the MTL
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES TooltipBONUSESCAP SPACE
20$83,500,000$67,724,166$1,170,000$4,195,000$15,775,834
Left WingCentreRight Wing
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$4,500,000$4,500,000
LW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$7,875,000$7,875,000
C
UFA - 7
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$6,500,000$6,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,100,000$1,100,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$4,450,000$4,450,000
C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$5,500,000$5,500,000
RW, LW
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$812,500$812,500
LW, RW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,362,500$3,362,500
C, RW
RFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,400,000$3,400,000
RW, LW
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,700,000$1,700,000
C
UFA - 2
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$4,875,000$4,875,000
LD
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$3,500,000$3,500,000
RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,925,000$1,925,000
G
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$875,000$875,000
LD/RD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$925,000$925,000 (Performance Bonus$275,000$275K)
RD
RFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,000,000$1,000,000
G
UFA - 1
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$1,400,000$1,400,000
LD/RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$766,667$766,667
RD
UFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$863,333$863,333 (Performance Bonus$420,000$420K)
LD/RD
RFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$762,500$762,500
RD
UFA - 1
ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$7,850,000$7,850,000
LW, RW
UFA - 8
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$10,500,000$10,500,000
G
NMC
UFA - 3
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$950,000$950,000 (Performance Bonus$3,500,000$4M)
RW, LW
RFA - 2
Logo of the Montreal Canadiens
$828,333$828,333
LD/RD
RFA - 1

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Jun. 15, 2023 at 7:39 p.m.
#1
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If I'm Anaheim I'd do that I guess each person's value would depend on how highly they value fantilli and Hutson as players (obviously). I will say though if San Jose selects will smith at 4 and that gives Anaheim in this scenario a chance to pick up michkov and then they also have Hutson, and they maybe get a guy like Daniel But with Florida's pick then Anaheims future would be looking bright.
Caufield liked this.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 7:46 p.m.
#2
Lets Get Kraken
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I’m an outsider in this, but why wouldn’t Anaheim just ask for 5OA and Caufield, and if/when that isn’t taken, negotiate the price down, to a deal that could be even more favorable than this one? I mean, assuming both teams would have elected to go with C in their current positions, the difference between 2OA and 5OA could be the difference between a 1C and a 2C.
High offense wingers aren’t that hard to replace, whereas you kind of have to draft and develop your own 1C.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 7:51 p.m.
#3
Billy739
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IMO Hughes Always said he prefers Prospects in Mctavish's position in his ELC/career over picks of similar value and acquiring Dach showed he can be aggressive.
Cheaper to offer them 5th OA for Mctavish or Zegras (obviously in a package not 1 for 1)

I mean if they could draft Fantilli and Smith in the same draft that puts Mctavish ,Fantilli and Smith's contracts at about 2-3 years apart from when ELC's end at the earliest
Fantilli will play next season to replace Zegras(More accurately Mctavish as he replaces Zegras)
Smith will take 1-2 years in the NCAA likely 2 then end the year playing 9-12 games with ANA
Now ANA has 3 top 5 drafted Centers in their line up by March 2024-25 season
Caufield liked this.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 7:55 p.m.
#4
Billy739
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Quoting: evelutions2
I’m an outsider in this, but why wouldn’t Anaheim just ask for 5OA and Caufield, and if/when that isn’t taken, negotiate the price down, to a deal that could be even more favorable than this one? I mean, assuming both teams would have elected to go with C in their current positions, the difference between 2OA and 5OA could be the difference between a 1C and a 2C.
High offense wingers aren’t that hard to replace, whereas you kind of have to draft and develop your own 1C.


2009 Kovalev left
2021 Caufield Arrived

MTL fans arent so lucky
They all crap out for one reason or another with consistency issues
Clutch Goal Scorers though ? The only one ill listen to an argument on is Mike Cammaleri our last PPG Playoff Player our GM Disgraced our team by removing his jersey after trading him mid game.
Even then it comes back to consistency to make them a High Offensive Winger
Caufield liked this.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 7:55 p.m.
#5
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Edited Jun. 15, 2023 at 8:01 p.m.
ANA decline.
First, we don't need defence as we are stacked in that department. We would rather accept wingers.
Second ANA doesn't have to trade as Fan as he sets us up down centre shifting Z to the wing, where his game is more suited.
Fan is the best player to come out of the NCAA since Eichel and Kariya and we know good those guys are/went. Fan could be ANA future Franchise centre.
As of which the cost is going to be too high to the point mtl declines.
If you really want a price it would be
-2023 1st MTL
-Slaf or Cole
-and I'd like to see Dach added but I'd be happy without him.
Yes, you are probably going to say I'm smoking something. But, when people are desperate stupidity takes over.
Mtl would be better off not trading for the 2nd OA.
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Jun. 15, 2023 at 8:00 p.m.
#6
Thread Starter
Sennecke is a gem
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Quoting: ItsDuckSeason
ANA decline.
First, we don't need defence as we are stacked in that department. We would rather accept wingers.
Second ANA doesn't have to trade as Fan as he sets us up down centre shifting Z to the wing, where his game is more suited.
Fan is the best player to come out of the NCAA since Eichel and Kariya and we know good those guys are. Fan could be ANA future Franchise centre.
As of which the cost is going to be too high to the point mtl declines.
If you really want a price it would be
-2023 1st MTL
-Slaf or Cole
-and I'd like to see Dach added but I'd be happy without him.
Yes, you are probably going to say I'm smoking something. But, when people are desperate stupidity takes over.


I definitely see where you're coming from, and I completely understand why ANA declines. I was trying to target the plain value, without considering positioning value. Obviously, ANA got a lot of D, and they are lacking wingers. But in Vacuum value, Slaf or Caufield would be too much and I would assume Dach would be a slice too low. Hutson does seem like the right value player for this trade, but I see why ANA declines. Honestly, I think MTL declines as well, but I wanted to put a 2nd OA trade which isn't awful value for one team or the other.
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Jun. 15, 2023 at 8:02 p.m.
#7
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Quoting: Caufield
I definitely see where you're coming from, and I completely understand why ANA declines. I was trying to target the plain value, without considering positioning value. Obviously, ANA got a lot of D, and they are lacking wingers. But in Vacuum value, Slaf or Caufield would be too much and I would assume Dach would be a slice too low. Hutson does seem like the right value player for this trade, but I see why ANA declines. Honestly, I think MTL declines as well, but I wanted to put a 2nd OA trade which isn't awful value for one team or the other.


Honestly, you hit the nail on the head smile
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Jun. 15, 2023 at 8:43 p.m.
#8
Once a Kings Fan Too
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This and all other "offers" I've seen for the second overall pick ignore the basic reality, which is that they look "reasonable" only from the guys holding #5. All of this posturing avoids the key issue, which is that Bedard and Fantilli are projected to be generational talents like McDavid and Eichel or perhaps MacKinnon and Draisaitl, and the guys at 3-4-5 aren't. This isn't a draft like last year's, where the consensus #1 actually went #4. Despite all the late talk about what a great prospect Leo Carlsson is, the undeniable fact is that there is a noticeable gap between the first two guys and the rest of the pack.

Looking at the 2015 (McDavid and Eichel) draft is instructive. There aren't three players in the 3 to 10 group from that year, and I consider at least 5 of them to be All-Stars, that you would prefer to have over Eichel (or MacKinnon or Draisaitl). And when you look at the players from 21 through 32, there aren't any two from the top 10 and one from the bottom 12 that you would take over Eichel or Draisaitl, either -- and at least 4 of those bottom 12 are outright busts. So this talk about #5 plus #31 is just silly due to the "zero value risk" of the later pick.

My point is that until proven otherwise, Fantilli is a franchise player. Carlsson, Smith and Michkov are hugely good prospects, but not franchise-level players, and neither Hutson nor Guhle nor even Caufield plus the #31 make up for that discrepancy. Anaheim won't be trading out of #2, and REALLY won't be trading out of #2 for a draft-pick-chart exchange.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 8:49 p.m.
#9
Banned
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Rather just draft Reinbacher. Keep Hutson. Trade the FLO pick+ for PLD. Mtl is a lot better off than overpaying in this deal.
Jun. 15, 2023 at 9:20 p.m.
#10
Thread Starter
Sennecke is a gem
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Quoting: OldNYIfan
This and all other "offers" I've seen for the second overall pick ignore the basic reality, which is that they look "reasonable" only from the guys holding #5. All of this posturing avoids the key issue, which is that Bedard and Fantilli are projected to be generational talents like McDavid and Eichel or perhaps MacKinnon and Draisaitl, and the guys at 3-4-5 aren't. This isn't a draft like last year's, where the consensus #1 actually went #4. Despite all the late talk about what a great prospect Leo Carlsson is, the undeniable fact is that there is a noticeable gap between the first two guys and the rest of the pack.

Looking at the 2015 (McDavid and Eichel) draft is instructive. There aren't three players in the 3 to 10 group from that year, and I consider at least 5 of them to be All-Stars, that you would prefer to have over Eichel (or MacKinnon or Draisaitl). And when you look at the players from 21 through 32, there aren't any two from the top 10 and one from the bottom 12 that you would take over Eichel or Draisaitl, either -- and at least 4 of those bottom 12 are outright busts. So this talk about #5 plus #31 is just silly due to the "zero value risk" of the later pick.

My point is that until proven otherwise, Fantilli is a franchise player. Carlsson, Smith and Michkov are hugely good prospects, but not franchise-level players, and neither Hutson nor Guhle nor even Caufield plus the #31 make up for that discrepancy. Anaheim won't be trading out of #2, and REALLY won't be trading out of #2 for a draft-pick-chart exchange.


If that's the case, Fantilli isn't traded for anything that has picks. It would be like an Extended Matthews or something
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Jun. 15, 2023 at 9:31 p.m.
#11
LosPatos
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Ducks aren’t even going to pick up the phone if one Slafkovksy, Caufield, or Suzuki isn’t involved. We have Zellweger, Mintyukov, LaCombe and Luneau all who are high high upside defenseman.

We need elite wingers
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