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Leafs 2023 2024 Season Discussion Part 4 - Mid Season Slump

Feb. 15 at 9:43 p.m.
#926
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Should have never went to OT but glad we won
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Feb. 15 at 9:49 p.m.
#927
Leafs going to Leafs
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Auston Matthews is the best player in the world, argue with your mirror if you think otherwise
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Feb. 15 at 9:57 p.m.
#928
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Quoting: aadoyle
3-1 lead gone again through this teams own hands

b2b offensive zone penalties giving Flyers the tying goal (31 rank PP BTW)

Rip Bertuzzi


Keefe is going to lose it on him. But Roberson is getting some chances now, so that's good. Hopefully
Feb. 15 at 10:03 p.m.
#929
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Quoting: RipNasty
Keefe is going to lose it on him. But Roberson is getting some chances now, so that's good. Hopefully


Bertuzzi and Knies be on thin ice rn in Keefe's eyes

He was shifting Domi and Robertson a lot in their place

His after comment on Knies especially was telling. Run the guy over lul
Feb. 16 at 1:28 a.m.
#930
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Quoting: Juice
Would you guys do Lilly for Tanev 1 for 1?

Would Calgary?

I've been a Liljegren supporter since he's been drafted but I'm just not seeing him take that step. For me, it would depend on how extension talks have gone...but he's not someone that has earned $3m+ to me...maybe worth the risk if that's a long term deal...but I've just been seeing a lot of mental errors recently.

From calgary's end...they obviously get a younger guy that can step right into the lineup with control vs a typical draft pick.

TIme to cut bait or hold the line?


Totally understand why you're asking this question and we'll.. it's a difficult one for sure. The biggest problem is Tanev's age and yeah, probably won't get more than 2 good years out of trading for him and signing him to probably a 3-4 year deal.

I was really hoping Lillijegren would figure it out and become at least a rock solid second pair D but right now he's only a steady third pair.

I suppose the real question is what to do when Tanev does start declining because this team as is may still be trying to win.
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Feb. 16 at 1:55 a.m.
#931
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Quoting: Juice
Would you guys do Lilly for Tanev 1 for 1?

Would Calgary?

I've been a Liljegren supporter since he's been drafted but I'm just not seeing him take that step. For me, it would depend on how extension talks have gone...but he's not someone that has earned $3m+ to me...maybe worth the risk if that's a long term deal...but I've just been seeing a lot of mental errors recently.

From calgary's end...they obviously get a younger guy that can step right into the lineup with control vs a typical draft pick.

TIme to cut bait or hold the line?


I wouldn't like it, but I could see them possibly doing it. I just think with Tanev's injury past and age, if anything happens it would look like a pretty bad move when Liljegren is still an RFA
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Feb. 16 at 8:16 a.m.
#932
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Quoting: RipNasty
He's the only defenceman who can get the puck up ice consistently. Take him out and we will get hemmed in constantly. The Leafs don't need to be less conservative they need better defenceman


I am not asking him to be a Rod Languay. But he needs to be a bit more picky in the spots he picks to join the rush.
Getting the puck up ice does not mean the defenceman needs to join the rush ahead of the centreman. They can pass it to.
And maybe the problem is that Klingberg was supposed to share the load and he bombed. Also, Timmins is a bit like Robertson that he's not trusted - and just when an opportunity presents itself, he is injured.
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Feb. 16 at 8:47 a.m.
#933
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I think it's a statement to Lilly's growth that he's spent back to back games on the 1rst pair, And the team's allowed a combined 2 5v5 goals in that span
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Feb. 16 at 9:15 a.m.
#934
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Just to add to the Liljegren comments. I wouldn't trade him for Tanev. He made good plays on the Leafs 3rd and 4th goals last night. I've been kinda dismayed why so many Leaf fans are so love Calgary Dmen. There is defensive record isn't much better than the Leafs, and IMO it was Leafs poor goaltending for a stretch attributed to goals allowed.
Maybe it's kinda of a blessing Reilly has will be out five games. Gives Lagaesson ice time. Any chance of a long playoff run, you probably need eight Dmen due to injuries. Too bad Timmins has mono, he needs game time too,
Feb. 16 at 9:38 a.m.
#935
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Quoting: aadoyle
Bertuzzi and Knies be on thin ice rn in Keefe's eyes

He was shifting Domi and Robertson a lot in their place

His after comment on Knies especially was telling. Run the guy over lul


Yeah that was a lazy play
Feb. 16 at 9:40 a.m.
#936
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Quoting: Messier99
I am not asking him to be a Rod Languay. But he needs to be a bit more picky in the spots he picks to join the rush.
Getting the puck up ice does not mean the defenceman needs to join the rush ahead of the centreman. They can pass it to.
And maybe the problem is that Klingberg was supposed to share the load and he bombed. Also, Timmins is a bit like Robertson that he's not trusted - and just when an opportunity presents itself, he is injured.


Getting mono is just the worst luck for the kid. I agree though he just doesn't get the chance with Keefe. Should be playing
Feb. 16 at 10:22 a.m.
#937
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Quoting: Leafsfan98
I think it's a statement to Lilly's growth that he's spent back to back games on the 1rst pair, And the team's allowed a combined 2 5v5 goals in that span


Keefe will still sewer him. Somehow it's Brodie who is the difference in his mind. While it was clear to all, Liljegren is better than Brodie
Feb. 16 at 10:25 a.m.
#938
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Quoting: oneX
Totally understand why you're asking this question and we'll.. it's a difficult one for sure. The biggest problem is Tanev's age and yeah, probably won't get more than 2 good years out of trading for him and signing him to probably a 3-4 year deal.

I was really hoping Lillijegren would figure it out and become at least a rock solid second pair D but right now he's only a steady third pair.

I suppose the real question is what to do when Tanev does start declining because this team as is may still be trying to win.


Liljegren is 24, he's been good and needs to get thrown into the fire a bit to really grow. Something Keefe just doesn't ever do and when he makes a mistake the punishment is severe. Way more severe than what happens to others when they make a mistake. Just fire Keefe and get a coach who actually does a good job.
Feb. 16 at 11:27 a.m.
#939
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Quoting: palhal
Just to add to the Liljegren comments. I wouldn't trade him for Tanev. He made good plays on the Leafs 3rd and 4th goals last night. I've been kinda dismayed why so many Leaf fans are so love Calgary Dmen. There is defensive record isn't much better than the Leafs, and IMO it was Leafs poor goaltending for a stretch attributed to goals allowed.
Maybe it's kinda of a blessing Reilly has will be out five games. Gives Lagaesson ice time. Any chance of a long playoff run, you probably need eight Dmen due to injuries. Too bad Timmins has mono, he needs game time too,


I think it was just the nature of Calgary being a team that, in the past few seasons, has been hard to play against, but now they're a couple seasons removed from contending and have/had 3 guys on deals as pending UFA's. Probably just natural to look at teams who are likely to be sellers and have quality pieces coming up on free agency.

As for Liljegren....I agree, he had a pretty good game last night. For the record, I'm not advocating he should be traded...was moreso interested in the discussion as to if we still think he's showing hints of being capable of taking another step anytime soon...because, if he's just going to max out as a bottom 4 guy, could make sense to move him for assets or someone with more consistency as you can add bottom pairing d-men relatively cheaply moving forward.
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Feb. 16 at 1:17 p.m.
#940
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Quoting: RipNasty
Keefe will still sewer him. Somehow it's Brodie who is the difference in his mind. While it was clear to all, Liljegren is better than Brodie


With Rielly out, Lilly becomes our most important defensemen while being the second best, behind McCabe
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Feb. 16 at 1:26 p.m.
#941
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Edited Feb. 16 at 1:50 p.m.
Here's my thing with Liligren

He has been good but just not taken that step to solidify his status as being a 2nd pair guy. Hes a solid third pair but just has not taken that step

That said I would not trade him for Tanev in a 1 for 1 as that would be crazy. If I was to look at moving Liligren the 3 Dman I would eye

Hanifin, Weegar, Chycrun now I would give HM to Parayko but that would come under very specific terms (aka if Blues were willing to ret like Kessel and other things)
Feb. 16 at 3:09 p.m.
#942
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Quoting: aadoyle
Here's my thing with Liligren

He has been good but just not taken that step to solidify his status as being a 2nd pair guy. Hes a solid third pair but just has not taken that step

That said I would not trade him for Tanev in a 1 for 1 as that would be crazy. If I was to look at moving Liligren the 3 Dman I would eye

Hanifin, Weegar, Chycrun now I would give HM to Parayko but that would come under very specific terms (aka if Blues were willing to ret like Kessel and other things)


Watching the highlights of SanJose/Flames game, you wouldn't want Hanifan or Weager playing defence on the Leaf team. Yeah, I know it was one game, but geez all these outstanding Flames Dmen have allowed as many goals as the Leafs pathetic (apparently) group of Dmen.
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Feb. 16 at 3:16 p.m.
#943
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Quoting: Leafsfan98
With Rielly out, Lilly becomes our most important defensemen while being the second best, behind McCabe


I think Liljegren is possibly better than McCabe already
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Feb. 16 at 3:17 p.m.
#944
Rip
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Quoting: palhal
Watching the highlights of SanJose/Flames game, you wouldn't want Hanifan or Weager playing defence on the Leaf team. Yeah, I know it was one game, but geez all these outstanding Flames Dmen have allowed as many goals as the Leafs pathetic (apparently) group of Dmen.


Hanafin would certainly be a big improvement
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Feb. 16 at 3:23 p.m.
#945
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Quoting: RipNasty
Hanafin would certainly be a big improvement


True, but man you gave away the puck for no reason which led to a San Jose goal. If Liljegren had done that 80% of so called Leaf fan would have sent her for free to Arizona.
I'm of the belief that the Leafs shouldn't be trading any young assets (they have so few) for a rental.
Wolf was the Flames goalie last night. He's small for a goalie by any current NHL standard, and IMO he's going to get lit up by NHL shooters as his butterfly style just doesn't cover enough net.
Feb. 16 at 3:25 p.m.
#946
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Quoting: palhal
Watching the highlights of SanJose/Flames game, you wouldn't want Hanifan or Weager playing defence on the Leaf team. Yeah, I know it was one game, but geez all these outstanding Flames Dmen have allowed as many goals as the Leafs pathetic (apparently) group of Dmen.


Lul Weegar is one of the best defensive Dman in the NHL and Hanifin is a solid 2-way Dman one bad game against a bottom feeder dont say much

Look at what we have done vs. bottom feeders this season. Many teams have come up with stinkers vs. lottery teams it really dont say much these days
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Feb. 16 at 3:26 p.m.
#947
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Edited Feb. 16 at 3:34 p.m.
Quoting: RipNasty
I think Liljegren is possibly better than McCabe already


MMM No


If he was he would be trusted with more responsibility but in past 2 seasons its hit and miss. And sure you can say well its Keefe. But no its also Liligren he has to show Keefe he can be a consistent top 4 guy but its been hit and miss with him. Keefe even trusts Benoit more which makes sense as Benoit - McCabe has been a nice 2nd pairing

Liligren has solidified himself as a nice third pair but just has not taken that true step to say the #4 or even 2 spot is mine
Feb. 16 at 3:28 p.m.
#948
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Quoting: RipNasty
I think Liljegren is possibly better than McCabe already


Maybe...
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Feb. 16 at 3:33 p.m.
#949
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Quoting: aadoyle
Lul Weegar is one of the best defensive Dman in the NHL and Hanifin is a solid 2-way Dman one bad game against a bottom feeder dont say much

Look at what we have done vs. bottom feeders this season. Many teams have come up with stinkers vs. lottery teams it really dont say much these days


To highlight this is Hanifin

GGOf8AkXUAAzpST?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

And this is Weegar last season

https://thewincolumn.ca/2023/02/25/mackenzie-weegar-has-been-one-of-the-best-defensive-defencemen-this-season/

This year he would be 5th in goals amongst the Leafs
Feb. 16 at 4:01 p.m.
#950
Rip
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Quoting: palhal
True, but man you gave away the puck for no reason which led to a San Jose goal. If Liljegren had done that 80% of so called Leaf fan would have sent her for free to Arizona.
I'm of the belief that the Leafs shouldn't be trading any young assets (they have so few) for a rental.
Wolf was the Flames goalie last night. He's small for a goalie by any current NHL standard, and IMO he's going to get lit up by NHL shooters as his butterfly style just doesn't cover enough net.


Leaf fans are a fickle bunch who often see only what they want to see and nothing else
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