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Current forwards better than Matthews right now

Created by: Goulet
Team: 2018-19 Toronto Maple Leafs
Initial Creation Date: Nov. 17, 2018
Published: Nov. 17, 2018
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Potential is one thing, but results are another.
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 5:45 p.m.
#1
GM Hockeysaurus Rex
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Ehm.. he is injured for 2nd week now so your comment is pretty invalid.. but just for the sake of it.. he is currently (after two weeks out) 2nd in ppg average, 7 goals away from being top scorer in league and 4 goals behind 2nd place, best in goals per game and I can continue. There is not much better players than him and we are not talking about potential (he is 21 for 2 months..) but results (without Nylander).. I can name you players who are better or on same level as Matthews right now:

Crosby, McDavid, Ovechkin (better) Scheifele, Pastrnak, Rantanen, MacKinnon (on the same level). Thats it.
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 5:50 p.m.
#2
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Quoting: SammyT_51
Ehm.. he is injured for 2nd week now so your comment is pretty invalid.. but just for the sake of it.. he is currently (after two weeks out) 2nd in ppg average, 7 goals away from being top scorer in league and 4 goals behind 2nd place, best in goals per game and I can continue. There is not much better players than him and we are not talking about potential (he is 21 for 2 months..) but results (without Nylander).. I can name you players who are better or on same level as Matthews right now:

Crosby, McDavid, Ovechkin (better) Scheifele, Pastrnak, Rantanen, MacKinnon (on the same level). Thats it.


Being injured again only shows his fragility, nothing else.

I'm a Leaf fan too but scoring on half of your first 20 shots of the year doesn't make you top 30.
Nov. 17, 2018 at 5:56 p.m.
#3
GM Hockeysaurus Rex
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Quoting: Goulet
Being injured again only shows his fragility, nothing else.

I'm a Leaf fan too but scoring on half of your first 20 shots of the year doesn't make you top 30.


So Crosby is fragile too.. that means nothing.. it is what it is.. He scored goal per game pace with circa 25% percentage. Lets say he drops to 16-18 percent which is what I would expect with his insane shot.. he scores around 50 with average percentage. Pretty great isnt it? He is top-10 player in the league without doubt..
Nov. 17, 2018 at 5:56 p.m.
#4
What in tarnation
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You went slightly over the salary cap there mate.

But the trades are solid.
Nov. 17, 2018 at 5:59 p.m.
#5
Once a Kings Fan Too
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Trade Gauthier for Getzlaf.
Nov. 17, 2018 at 6:00 p.m.
#6
Formerly Jamiepo
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If you wouldn’t ‘t Mind picking another team to follow that would be okay with the rest of us leafs fans. Not only are you negative but your clueless...
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 6:04 p.m.
#7
McFaksaGOAT
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Epic troll post gamer ??
Nov. 17, 2018 at 6:15 p.m.
#8
Who adds what?
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Edited Nov. 17, 2018 at 6:45 p.m.
Quoting: OldNYIfan
Trade Gauthier for Getzlaf.


I think you're making fun of the idea of writing off guys who haven't achieved their potential, but the way people talk about Gauthier's potential as a young 23 year old rookie first round pick cracks me up, when every other Caps post this year has been ragging on Burakovsky's slow start this year, as a 23 year old who came into this season with 120 points, but only has four so far. Gauthier was picked one spot higher, in the same draft, and has five points, career, plus some hits. If they could trade him for Getzlaf, they would have, already.

Edit: Now I see it. OP forgot to trade Gauthier. Yeah. Getzlaf has a solid career. Makes sense. Never mind. smile
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 7:01 p.m.
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This is such a troll
Nov. 17, 2018 at 7:01 p.m.
#10
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Quoting: SammyT_51
Ehm.. he is injured for 2nd week now so your comment is pretty invalid.. but just for the sake of it.. he is currently (after two weeks out) 2nd in ppg average, 7 goals away from being top scorer in league and 4 goals behind 2nd place, best in goals per game and I can continue. There is not much better players than him and we are not talking about potential (he is 21 for 2 months..) but results (without Nylander).. I can name you players who are better or on same level as Matthews right now:

Crosby, McDavid, Ovechkin (better) Scheifele, Pastrnak, Rantanen, MacKinnon (on the same level). Thats it.


Malkin is better
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 7:04 p.m.
#11
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The only forwards who I would say are better than Matthews currently are:
Mcdavid Crosby Ovi Malkin and probably Mackinnon
Tavares Kane and stamkos are arguable
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 7:09 p.m.
#12
GM Hockeysaurus Rex
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Quoting: mhockey91
Malkin is better


Yeah. Somehow he disappeared from my mind.. sorry
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 7:21 p.m.
#13
Formerly Jamiepo
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Quoting: Eli
I think you're making fun of the idea of writing off guys who haven't achieved their potential, but the way people talk about Gauthier's potential as a young 23 year old rookie first round pick cracks me up, when every other Caps post this year has been ragging on Burakovsky's slow start this year, as a 23 year old who came into this season with 120 points, but only has four so far. Gauthier was picked one spot higher, in the same draft, and has five points, career, plus some hits. If they could trade him for Getzlaf, they would have, already.

Edit: Now I see it. OP forgot to trade Gauthier. Yeah. Getzlaf has a solid career. Makes sense. Never mind. smile


Any leafs fan will tell you Gauthier is a dud lol... hell I think he was a dud before the draft lol. But he isn’t a hottible depth 4c and seems to be a good locker room guy... will probably be a good captain for the marlies.
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 8:25 p.m.
#14
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Quoting: SammyT_51
So Crosby is fragile too.. that means nothing.. it is what it is.. He scored goal per game pace with circa 25% percentage. Lets say he drops to 16-18 percent which is what I would expect with his insane shot.. he scores around 50 with average percentage. Pretty great isnt it? He is top-10 player in the league without doubt..


Top 10 goal scorer sure. More to hockey.
Nov. 17, 2018 at 8:39 p.m.
#15
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Quoting: Jamiepo
If you wouldn’t ‘t Mind picking another team to follow that would be okay with the rest of us leafs fans. Not only are you negative but your clueless...


Quoting: mhockey91
The only forwards who I would say are better than Matthews currently are:
Mcdavid Crosby Ovi Malkin and probably Mackinnon
Tavares Kane and stamkos are arguable


Quoting: mhockey91
This is such a troll


Quoting: McFaksaGOAT
Epic troll post gamer ??


Reality boys... he's not even too 10 at his position.

How did last year's MVP not make the list??

You'd be hard pressed to find a single GM in the league that would take Matthews over Crosby, Malkin, McDavid, Bergeron, Kopitar, MacKinnon, Stamkos, Coutourier, Toews, last year's real Conn Smyth Kuznetszov and perhaps Barkov and Scheifele, going into the playoffs.

I'm not trolling, Matthews is a fraction of what he could become... right now. I'm not talking keeper league hockey pools. He's not even the best player on the Leafs.
Nov. 17, 2018 at 8:47 p.m.
#16
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Quoting: Goulet
Reality boys... he's not even too 10 at his position.

How did last year's MVP not make the list??

You'd be hard pressed to find a single GM in the league that would take Matthews over Crosby, Malkin, McDavid, Bergeron, Kopitar, MacKinnon, Stamkos, Coutourier, Toews, last year's real Conn Smyth Kuznetszov and perhaps Barkov and Scheifele, going into the playoffs.

I'm not trolling, Matthews is a fraction of what he could become... right now. I'm not talking keeper league hockey pools. He's not even the best player on the Leafs.


I think you’re the only one who thinks that
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Nov. 17, 2018 at 10:00 p.m.
#17
Who adds what?
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By points per game this season, Matthews is the best player on the Leafs, and is looking like a really, really good player this year. It's hard to say anything new while he's out and banged up.

I think in terms of trade value, you could get most of the above players straight up for Matthews, even while he's out, injured, for a month or more: Benn, Seguin, Kane, Towes, Marchand, Bergeron, Barkov, Carter, Kopitar, Hall, Stone, Giroux, Voracek, Stamkos.... They've accomplished more, but when you look at age and potential and who is going to be worth the most to a team long term, those teams could easily trade those guys for Matthews today. Maybe not Tampa if they really think this is their year, but they usually prefer consistency and long term planning, so maybe Tampa.

There's no way you get a MacKinnon or Draisaitl, but from a hockey perspective, Pittsburgh should shrug off trading Crosby for Matthews today, especially since Pittsubrgh is last in the East all of a sudden, and Matthews is injured. Add in that Matthews is one of the best American-born talents in a while, and Crosby is one of the better Toronto-born players in the league right now, and it could be a good fit, hockey-wise. But you try telling that to any fan within 200 miles of Pittsburgh, and it ain't happening.

I don't think Washington gives up Kuznetsov while it's hoping to repeat. Matthews could be a 90 point guy in another three years, but by then having him means they likely can't afford to keep Ovechkin, so that doesn't make sense.... I don't think the Leafs consider Matthews for Backstrom with only two years left on Backstrom's contract, but feel free to ask next summer, when he's eligible for an extension.

Quoting: Jamiepo
Any leafs fan will tell you Gauthier is a dud lol... hell I think he was a dud before the draft lol. But he isn’t a hottible depth 4c and seems to be a good locker room guy... will probably be a good captain for the marlies.


He reminds me of Dave Steckel a bit, in just the gangly way he tries to find the puck. You don't have to be the most coordinated guy on the ice if you're 6'5". Steckel evolved into a solid penalty killer and a faceoff specialist. As much as Gauthier hits, and as tall as he is, I'm sure he'll find a role. Just not necessarily in Anaheim, at the above price.
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Nov. 18, 2018 at 3:30 a.m.
#18
GM Hockeysaurus Rex
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Quoting: Goulet
Top 10 goal scorer sure. More to hockey.


Top-10 player. Period.
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Nov. 18, 2018 at 10:56 a.m.
#19
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Quoting: Eli
By points per game this season, Matthews is the best player on the Leafs, and is looking like a really, really good player this year. It's hard to say anything new while he's out and banged up.

I think in terms of trade value, you could get most of the above players straight up for Matthews, even while he's out, injured, for a month or more: Benn, Seguin, Kane, Towes, Marchand, Bergeron, Barkov, Carter, Kopitar, Hall, Stone, Giroux, Voracek, Stamkos.... They've accomplished more, but when you look at age and potential and who is going to be worth the most to a team long term, those teams could easily trade those guys for Matthews today. Maybe not Tampa if they really think this is their year, but they usually prefer consistency and long term planning, so maybe Tampa.

There's no way you get a MacKinnon or Draisaitl, but from a hockey perspective, Pittsburgh should shrug off trading Crosby for Matthews today, especially since Pittsubrgh is last in the East all of a sudden, and Matthews is injured. Add in that Matthews is one of the best American-born talents in a while, and Crosby is one of the better Toronto-born players in the league right now, and it could be a good fit, hockey-wise. But you try telling that to any fan within 200 miles of Pittsburgh, and it ain't happening.

I don't think Washington gives up Kuznetsov while it's hoping to repeat. Matthews could be a 90 point guy in another three years, but by then having him means they likely can't afford to keep Ovechkin, so that doesn't make sense.... I don't think the Leafs consider Matthews for Backstrom with only two years left on Backstrom's contract, but feel free to ask next summer, when he's eligible for an extension.



He reminds me of Dave Steckel a bit, in just the gangly way he tries to find the puck. You don't have to be the most coordinated guy on the ice if you're 6'5". Steckel evolved into a solid penalty killer and a faceoff specialist. As much as Gauthier hits, and as tall as he is, I'm sure he'll find a role. Just not necessarily in Anaheim, at the above price.


Trade value is a different topic altogether. I agree with your assessment and we as Leaf fans tend to assume our guys are the best however, the league is full of great players and we tend to forget that.

PPG is one thing, and Matthews certainly puts up points, he's a finisher, however, there is a lot more to the game.

He has a very high ceiling but the goal here was only to point out that his potential doesn't outweigh the player he is today, in the real world.
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Nov. 18, 2018 at 10:59 a.m.
#20
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Quoting: mhockey91
I think you’re the only one who thinks that


The only person on here for sure. I'm fine with that. I knew this would stir the pot and I knew that no one could actively support their argument, furthering my point.
Nov. 18, 2018 at 11:07 a.m.
#21
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Quoting: SammyT_51
Top-10 player. Period.


There are 10 better defensemen, 10 better goalies, more than 10 better centers, and almost 10 better wingers.
Nov. 18, 2018 at 11:09 a.m.
#22
GM Hockeysaurus Rex
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Quoting: Goulet
There are 10 better defensemen, 10 better goalies, more than 10 better centers, and almost 10 better wingers.


Only 1 defender is of similar value and well playing to Matthews - Hedman. Goalies are not counted since they are completely different breed..
Nov. 18, 2018 at 12:08 p.m.
#23
McFaksaGOAT
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Quoting: Goulet
Reality boys... he's not even too 10 at his position.

How did last year's MVP not make the list??

You'd be hard pressed to find a single GM in the league that would take Matthews over Crosby, Malkin, McDavid, Bergeron, Kopitar, MacKinnon, Stamkos, Coutourier, Toews, last year's real Conn Smyth Kuznetszov and perhaps Barkov and Scheifele, going into the playoffs.

I'm not trolling, Matthews is a fraction of what he could become... right now. I'm not talking keeper league hockey pools. He's not even the best player on the Leafs.


I do agree that he’s not a top 10 player in his position but by the end of the year I think he will be
Nov. 18, 2018 at 12:10 p.m.
#24
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Quoting: McFaksaGOAT
I do agree that he’s not a top 10 player in his position but by the end of the year I think he will be


He will be one day, no doubt. He started hot and the went invisible for 4 or 5 games. He has a ways to go before he is in the conversation as one of the best.
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Nov. 18, 2018 at 12:14 p.m.
#25
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Quoting: SammyT_51
Only 1 defender is of similar value and well playing to Matthews - Hedman. Goalies are not counted since they are completely different breed..


I'm not talking fan perspective. From a flat out hockey perspective, now, not for the next 5-10 years, he barely cracks the top 40 for all players, all things considered.

Does he have the best wrist shot? Hands down. But that's it.
 
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