lol, Gordeev. Great joke

Is he good?

Nylander is a lot closer to Marner than Kapanen, give your head a shake.

I don’t see Fiala taking 2.5

Keep Nylander, hope for a bounce back/ break out. If not trade him next year when value is similar. This signing doesn't screw over the league, just the Leafs. Dubas is much smarter than that.

Would you rather the leafs trade Kapanen? What is a fair return for Kapanen? i have a list of ideas to make a big "What should the Leafs do" ACGM. Is Liljegren a bust?

Does anyone really know what Marner is realistically going to make? 9? 10?

I am not going to speculate because there is a fair share of that on here. All I know is that 4 years at 10.5 is too much considering he goes straight to UFA.

You are all over the place and need to push away the noise.

1) If you look at Nylander beyond last seasons meager point totals you see a player who is a possession monster, creates offense and an elite level 5v5, is a top tier playmaker and creates a lot of turnovers in the neutral and offensive zones. He definitely could be a little more engaged in his zone but he isn't Kessel levels bad, he's sometimes gives guys too much cushion in the defensive zone.

2) Kapanen is the most replaceable player on the entire team. He's a right winger with big value in the minds of many, but in reality is a depth guy with great speed who I think could be a 30 goal scorer in the right scenario. Will it happen in TO? Maybe but if someone wanted to buy high on him thinking increased icetime would unlock a monster player, I'd move him in a heart beat. He gets so much love from Leaf fans and non Leaf fans alike and that is confounding to me. He had a hot start playing with Matthews and completely disappeared in the second half and playoffs. If he isn't on a break away he's almost useless. Just skates up the wing with speed takes a shot and skates back to his zone. The kid needs to work on holding the puck in the offensive zone.

3) Liljegren isn't a bust at all. In fact I think he's a terrific prospect who could make the team this year. I think too many heard or ready stuff about him being in the mold of Karlsson and that wasn't fair. He's a terrific skater and great puck carrier but isn't the best passer. What he did last year was take the pedal off his offensive game and focused on his defensive zone play and he was terrific defensively in the 2nd half and the playoffs playing top pair minutes for the Marlies at 20. That is an accomplishment most don't seem to see. He is developing into the perfect partner for Rielly, someone who can skate their way out of trouble and is very good positionally. He won't be top pair minutes right away in the NHL but I see him being more like a smaller Brett Pesce than Karlsson. May chip in with 30 points a year from time to time but always be good defensively.

4) People just need settle down. People are way too worried and consumed with periphery stuff. Marner's contract, trade ideas, cap space, speculation most is just people trying to get clicks to make money. Its too much.

Moral of the story, Marner is going to sign in TO, the team will have an interesting training camp and the Leafs will be battling Tampa for the presidents trophy as long as they don't face major injuries.

Kapanen takes too many low risk shots. That is his major downfall. Besides that, The kid is great. Love his speed and attitude. Certainly a keeper for the leafs on a decent deal. I say we keep everyone and work out a deal with marner that works for both sides. This isn’t it. Dubas has his team set and the money aside for marner. There won’t be any stupid trades to overpay marner.

The Leafs just traded him to Minnesota for a 7th...

I agree completely. I do like Kapanen, don't get me wrong, he does need to grow as a player and learn where he can improve to make himself a better offensive player. I love him on the 3rd line, his speed and abilities with Kerfoot and I hope Johnsson would be a matchup nightmare. If they learn how to cycle the puck down low with speed, rolling off guys and darting to open areas, this could be a huge boon for TO. If Kapanen keeps doing what he did last year, he could have a rough year. If I were him, I'd make a goal to score 10 garbage goals this season. Crash the net and pick up a few rebounds. If he did that he could really blossom.

If he gets better shot accuracy he'll be fine. Although he should definitely try for more garbage goals too.

I have zero idea why leaf fans have a love a fair over Nylander.... hes been a proven 60 point guy, id say he hes a 70point guy max.. yet people act like hes unbelievable

He has shot at an 11% rate since he entered the league, I wouldn't expect better numbers unless he shoots more, or works hard at getting closer before shooting. 11% is about average for the NHL but shooting percentage isn't really something that you can work to get much better at. There are too many variables when it comes to shooting percentage. What is a better driver for more goals is shot volume and location of the shots. Players who increase their shot volumes generally score more and often see their shooting percentage drop as well.

Kapanen would be wise to get closer to the net more, he is a perimeter player. Look at the playoffs last year and Matthews line had 1 specific area where they failed miserably. The whole team had issues in this regard but specifically Matthews line was terrible. It was rebound offense. Boston had 80% of the rebound offense in the series and 100% vs Matthews line. Why? Because Johnsson is too small to get to the net, Matthews isn't really a crash the net guy more of a hash marks sniper so he doesn't go to the net much and Kapanen doesn't even try to get close to the net unless he's on a breakaway.

So what should Kapanen do? He needs to commit to going to the harder areas more. Take a crosscheck but pot an ugly rebound goal, if he scored 10 of those a year I think 30 goals would be easily in reach. Otherwise I don't see him ever being more than a 20 goal scoring 3rd liner.

His ceiling is 90 points. He is a possession monster, offensively at 5v5 near the top of the league. He doesn't get much PP time because Babs is a bad coach otherwise he would have had more points in his first 2 years. Last year was a write off but its not a good indicator of what he can do. This season he'll show what he's capable of being. McKinnon had a great rookie season and didn't match those numbers again until his 5th season before he had his coming out. You act like Nylander is a 29 year old and Leaf fans are saying he may still reach his potential. He's 23!

Im so sick of hearing hes a possession monster... I could care less of possession.. Why is last year a write off, he played 54 games... The guy is a 60 point getter... idk how he can go from a 60 point getter to a 90 point getter... and I cant see how you can relate mack to nylander they are no where near each other, even back in the early seasons of Mackinnon

Not enough for Nylander IMO. Fiala is a good start, but the Wild would have to add more than later picks/meh prospects.

What was McKinnon in his first 4 seasons? A 64 point guy in season one and then 3 years of him being a less than 60 point player. He did this while having very high possession numbers and doing well in many other areas. In year 5 he exploded and is now showing his potential. Who's to say that Nylander can't be the same thing? He is always one of, if not the best player for his home country in international play, he's got speed to burn, creates offense at an elite rate at 5v5 and has only played 3 full seasons in the NHL. But for some reason, he can't keep getting better like so many other players have done.

Kucherov was a 60 point player for 2 seasons and then got 80+ when he was 23 years old.
Barkov was 4 seasons in before he broke 60 points
Elias Linholm never had more than 45 until his 4th season where he got 78
Marchand didn't score 60 points until his 6th full season

The list is endless but somehow it doesn't matter because Nylander hasn't scored more than 60 so he can't because he won't progress because that never happens......except almost always.

I am not saying Nylander is going to be a super elite player that will be one of the best in the league. He could be, but I think he'll more likely be closer to what Kessel was in his first 2 seasons in Pittsburgh. An offensive force but a secondary one, he doesn't have to lead his team or be a top #1 centre or kill penalties. With the firepower surrounding him, and his own talent level, Nylander being a point a game player should be a reasonable expectation as long as health doesn't derail it.

Im just so sick of people picking and choosing stats, when you look at the 5v5 stats, Im sure you wont have a problem saying Jordan staal is one of the most dynamic players 5v5 in the league then, and is due for a break out player...

Nylander put up 7 goals last year in 54 games how are we ignoring that.. no excuse for him, Tom wilson had no problem jumping right back into the season after mission most of the start of the season, infact he had a career year...

You can also go through SOOO many players who scored 60 points and declined after...

And you cant bring up international play because its such a different game, and bigger ice service... Guessing wennberg is gonna have a greatt or even dominant season after his international play this offseason..

until nylander proves other wise he is a 70 point getter max to me.. there is zero indication that he is a 90 point guy.. but if you think he is then you can say that about alotttttttt of other people in the league too then, which just isnt feasible

So according to your wisdom, his 7 goals last year (where he shot at half his career shooting percentage, which is a luck stat that will almost always balance out) is the only thing that matters. All other stats are just nonsense.

Jordan Staal is one of the best defensive centres in the league, he's still good although his offensive output is declining. They are both good players but they are different players and play different positions. Poor choice to use as an example.

I will say I am not sure Nylander can be a 90 point guy unless he has the right linemates. I think that is his ultimate potential but not his likely ending point. I think if he plays with Matthews for a full season, both will have massive years. Matthews is the best 5v5 goal scorer in the game, and its not close, but that has only been the case when he's been paired with Nylander. Together seeing Matthews score 60+ goals is reasonable and Nylander in that case should be well over a point a game. I think the best season he'll have is 35 goals and 55 assists or so. Matthews would have 60+ goals and 40 assists in the same year. Without Matthews I think Nylander is going to be closer to a 70 point guy, possibly 80 on a good year.

I am sure you'll say without Matthews he's a 30 point player because you clearly just don't want to give him a chance.

Im just so sick of everyone boosting this guy when hes done nothing, and especially nothing on his own... if he needs to get carried from matthews he clearly isnt as much as a star as people think...

And Matthews can be a 50 goal scorer, but until he stays healthy he isnt so..

There it is, you are just a goof. Nylander makes Matthews better as much as Matthews makes Nylander better. Nylander is a playmaker and last year for much of his season was playing with guys who couldn't score, also he had a horrendous start to his shortened season where he had I believe 1 point in his first 16 games or something like that. After that time he was on a 60 point pace playing on the 3rd line. Matthews last year scored a lot and looked like a beast but he also had to do that entirely on his own all year. Kapanen isn't a good partner for Matthews, he's way too much of a rush player who flies up the ice takes a shot, and then skates back to his end. Matthews needs someone who can keep the puck in the O zone and find him as he eludes the defence and get in prime shooting positions. Which is exactly what Nylander does. Its a symbiotic relationship.

Just out of curiosity, what do you think of Point? Is he a top end centre, or a product of playing with Kucherov at 5v5 and with Kucherov and Stamkos on the PP? You'll probably say this isn't a good comparison because apparently there is no way for Nylander to be good.

If he scores 90 points playing with Matthews, its a mirage and was just Matthews carrying him.
If he plays away from Matthews and has a 70+ point season, it'll likely be because of some other reason and was just a mirage.

The reality of this conversation is you want Nylander to fail. Its a personal thing that I don't care to hear about.

Okay so every point you just made goes agaisnt everything people say about marner...

And there is no excuse to have as bad of a start as Nylander did.. if youre a true superstar or elite player you should be able to drive your line, and Nylander isnt that.. and id say playing with Kadri and Johnasson isnt a bad line...

And point is a good number 1 centre on his own, he has proved that in the playoffs and carried that over to this previous year.. he is also good defensively. But no that isnt a good comparison because point is way above of Nylander

And the reality of this convo is that is it is personal. You are a fan boy over this guy.. How many points do you think Wilson can score, because based on your standards he can be a 70 point guy too, if he played on the 1st pp and didnt have a cold stretch in his year...

When u look at any player in the league, you can say what if, what about that.. but reality is you cant live that life, or everyone would be elite

I get it, Nylander sucks, everyone else is better, no one on TO is good and everyone who thinks a Leaf player has any talent is a fan boy. I assume you just loath the Leafs because they get so much attention. Well you talking about how much you hate everything about them is half the amount of attention the franchise gets. If you just ignored the Leafs instead of trying to troll their fans, you'd likely be a happier person.