Forums/Armchair-GM

Bertuzzi and Rakell

Created by: Erkadurk347
Initial Creation Date: Jul 14, 2021
Published: Jul 14 at 1:50
Team: 2021-22 Toronto Maple Leafs
Free Agent Signings
RFAYEARSCAP HIT
Bertuzzi, Tyler8$5,000,000
UFAYEARSCAP HIT
Bogosian, Zach1$900,000
Thornton, Joe1$800,000
Ullmark, Linus1$5,000,000
Trades
TOR
    SEA
    1. Kerfoot, Alexander
    TOR
    1. Bertuzzi, Tyler [RFA Rights]
    DET
    1. Amirov, Rodion
    2. Engvall, Pierre
    3. 2022 1st round pick (TOR)
    TOR
    1. Schneider, Braden
    2. 2022 2nd round pick (NYR)
    NYR
    1. Rielly, Morgan
    TOR
    1. Rakell, Rickard
    Additional Details:
    One for one. Rakell is the better player but has one year left and then is a UFA, but Liljegren is worse and will be for sure with the organization for multiple years. If it isn’t even, add whatever ya need on either side to get it done.
    ANA
    1. Liljegren, Timothy
    Retained Salary Transactions
    • Phil Kessel: $1,200,000 (15%)
    DRAFT YEARROUND 1ROUND 2ROUND 3ROUND 4ROUND 5ROUND 6ROUND 7
    2021
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    2022
    TOR
    NYR
    TOR
    2023
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    TOR
    ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
    23$81,500,000$81,136,728$0$532,500$363,272
    Left WingCenterRight Wing
    Bertuzzi, Tyler
    $5,000,000
    LW, RW
    UFA - 2
    TOR
    Matthews, Auston
    $11,640,250
    C
    UFA - 3
    TOR
    Marner, Mitchell
    $10,903,000
    RW
    UFA - 4
    ANA
    Rakell, Rickard
    $3,789,444
    RW, LW
    UFA - 1
    TOR
    Tavares, John
    $11,000,000
    C
    NMC
    UFA - 4
    TOR
    Nylander, William
    $6,962,366
    RW, LW
    UFA - 3
    TOR
    Robertson, Nicholas
    $796,667
    LW
    RFA - 3
    TOR
    Brooks, Adam
    $725,000
    C
    RFA - 1
    TOR
    Mikheyev, Ilya
    $1,645,000
    LW, RW
    UFA - 1
    TOR
    Thornton, Joe
    $800,000
    C, LW
    UFA - 1
    TOR
    Spezza, Jason
    $750,000
    C, RW
    UFA - 1
    TOR
    Simmonds, Wayne
    $900,000
    RW, LW
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
    TOR
    Sandin, Rasmus
    $894,167
    LD
    RFA - 1
    TOR
    Brodie, TJ
    $5,000,000
    RD
    NTC
    UFA - 3
    TOR
    Campbell, Jack
    $1,650,000
    G
    UFA - 1
    TOR
    Muzzin, Jake
    $5,625,000
    LD
    NTC
    UFA - 3
    TOR
    Holl, Justin
    $2,000,000
    RD
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    Ullmark, Linus
    $5,000,000
    G
    NMC
    UFA - 4
    TOR
    Dermott, Travis
    $1,500,000
    LD/RD
    RFA - 2
    TOR
    Bogosian, Zach
    $900,000
    RD
    NTC
    UFA - 3
    ScratchesInjured Reserve (IR)Long Term IR (LTIR)
    NYR
    Schneider, Braden
    $925,000
    RD
    RFA - 3
    TOR
    Der-Arguchintsev, Semyon
    $766,667
    C
    RFA - 2
    TOR
    Hållander, Filip
    $764,167
    C
    RFA - 2

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    Jul 14 at 1:51
    #1
    Stay mad
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 1,789
    Likes: 481
    Lol not trading Schneider for Reilly 1 for 1
    palhal liked this.
    Jul 14 at 1:53
    #2
    Formerly Jamiepo
    Joined: Jul 2018
    Posts: 18,612
    Likes: 9,564
    If dubas makes that trade for Bertuzzi he is fired the next day.
    TrueCanuck, palhal, OnFoenem34 and 1 other person liked this.
    Jul 14 at 1:54
    #3
    Formerly Jamiepo
    Joined: Jul 2018
    Posts: 18,612
    Likes: 9,564
    Quoting: NYRxLundqvist
    Lol not trading Schneider for Reilly 1 for 1


    I doubt the Rangers are this hasty to improve but value wise it seems more than fair.
    OnFoenem34 liked this.
    Jul 14 at 1:56
    #4
    Buffbry
    Joined: Aug 2017
    Posts: 6,258
    Likes: 3,515
    Rather have hallinder over engvall but it's closer then almost every other trade on here
    Jul 14 at 1:57
    #5
    Roster Architect
    Joined: Mar 2021
    Posts: 1,846
    Likes: 623
    Quoting: GenXHockey
    If dubas makes that trade for Bertuzzi he is fired the next day.


    I can't agree more.

    I don't understand why fans are overpaying so much for Bertuzzi. He's exactly what Hyman is/was for Toronto and no one would give up that much for Hyman because the whole league knows he's helped by his linemates.

    The best trade comparable is Anderson for Domi and a 3rd last off-season. It needs to be a positional need for positional need. Honestly, Rielly for Bertuzzi straight up makes a ton of sense. Toronto likely loses some value there, but no trade is 50/50 and it gives them what they need so it still makes sense for them.
    OnFoenem34 liked this.
    Jul 14 at 1:58
    #6
    Thread Starter
    Joined: Sep 2020
    Posts: 340
    Likes: 50
    Quoting: NYRxLundqvist
    Lol not trading Schneider for Reilly 1 for 1


    Unless the rangers extend him at the time of the trade, he isn’t worth more than a first and a second with one year left. Schneider is a mid first rounder that has size (which is what all leafs fans have been asking for years). The value is a first and a second with one year left and that is what I offered. If anything, only one year of rielly is not worth that return
    Jul 14 at 2:00
    #7
    LongtimeLeafsufferer
    Joined: Jul 2015
    Posts: 39,206
    Likes: 11,542
    Rangers don't want that 5m Reilly cap, and really the Rangers don't want a one year rental.
    I like Bertuzzi but the Leafs would be much better just resigning Hyman for about that price and keeping Amirov and the 1st.
    Please, no more of Joe Thornton.
    Jul 14 at 2:02
    #8
    Stay mad
    Joined: Jun 2018
    Posts: 1,789
    Likes: 481
    Quoting: GenXHockey
    I doubt the Rangers are this hasty to improve but value wise it seems more than fair.


    Quoting: Erkadurk347
    Unless the rangers extend him at the time of the trade, he isn’t worth more than a first and a second with one year left. Schneider is a mid first rounder that has size (which is what all leafs fans have been asking for years). The value is a first and a second with one year left and that is what I offered. If anything, only one year of rielly is not worth that return


    No Reilly is garbage and the complete opposite type of player the rangers need
    Jul 14 at 2:10
    #9
    Go Wings Go
    Joined: Jun 2016
    Posts: 32,307
    Likes: 8,502
    Yzerman 100% takes this and runs, Depending on how badly Dubas wants Bertuzzi. I doubt he gives up both Amirov and the 2022 1st round pick. One or the other.
    Jul 14 at 2:21
    #10
    #LeafsFever
    Joined: May 2017
    Posts: 3,727
    Likes: 918
    Yikes that's a ridiculous price for a very banged up Tyler Bertuzzi.
    Jul 14 at 2:34
    #11
    Joined: Jun 2021
    Posts: 16
    Likes: 3
    someone will pay more for rakell
    Jul 14 at 3:06
    #12
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 1,143
    Likes: 657
    Quoting: TrueCanuck
    I can't agree more.

    I don't understand why fans are overpaying so much for Bertuzzi. He's exactly what Hyman is/was for Toronto and no one would give up that much for Hyman because the whole league knows he's helped by his linemates.

    The best trade comparable is Anderson for Domi and a 3rd last off-season. It needs to be a positional need for positional need. Honestly, Rielly for Bertuzzi straight up makes a ton of sense. Toronto likely loses some value there, but no trade is 50/50 and it gives them what they need so it still makes sense for them.


    Nope. Still not true no matter how many times you type it. Bertuzzi 80 games 55 points...Anderson 78 games 28 points. Not comparable. Just stop.
    OldNYIfan liked this.
    Jul 14 at 3:43
    #13
    Roster Architect
    Joined: Mar 2021
    Posts: 1,846
    Likes: 623
    Quoting: RedWing9119
    Nope. Still not true no matter how many times you type it. Bertuzzi 80 games 55 points...Anderson 78 games 28 points. Not comparable. Just stop.


    Actually:

    Bertuzzi
    2020-2021: 7pts in 9 games
    2019-2020: 48pts in 71 games (21 goals)
    2018-2019: 47pts in 73games (21 goals)

    Anderson (prior to this season since it's comparing at the time of the Anderson trade which was right after his injury season)
    2020-2021: 4pts in 26 games (keep in mind he played through his injury and Bertuzzi didn't)
    2019-2020: 47pts in 82 games (27 goals)
    2018-2019: 30pts in 63 games (19 goals)

    Point pace means very, very little in trade talks. GM's don't care about what a player "could have done" and care about what the player actually has done. Bertuzzi has 2 seasons above 17 goals, Anderson has 4 of those seasons. Despite Anderson playing with less talented linemates, Anderson still scores more - and even though you won't wanna admit it, goals carry more weight than points.

    Bertuzzi and Anderson are comparables whether you like it or not. & it's quite hysterical how you keep trying to prove that it's not everywhere I post. So please, keep going. I always enjoy a good laugh.
    Jul 14 at 3:49
    #14
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 1,143
    Likes: 657
    Quoting: TrueCanuck
    Actually:

    Bertuzzi
    2020-2021: 7pts in 9 games
    2019-2020: 48pts in 71 games (21 goals)
    2018-2019: 47pts in 73games (21 goals)

    Anderson (prior to this season since it's comparing at the time of the Anderson trade which was right after his injury season)
    2020-2021: 4pts in 26 games (keep in mind he played through his injury and Bertuzzi didn't)
    2019-2020: 47pts in 82 games (27 goals)
    2018-2019: 30pts in 63 games (19 goals)

    Point pace means very, very little in trade talks. GM's don't care about what a player "could have done" and care about what the player actually has done. Bertuzzi has 2 seasons above 17 goals, Anderson has 4 of those seasons. Despite Anderson playing with less talented linemates, Anderson still scores more - and even though you won't wanna admit it, goals carry more weight than points.

    Bertuzzi and Anderson are comparables whether you like it or not. & it's quite hysterical how you keep trying to prove that it's not everywhere I post. So please, keep going. I always enjoy a good laugh.


    Yeah i get it. This is your whole schtick; you just keep arguing until people get tired of you but stubbornness isn't a replacement for a valid argument and you don't have one. Bertuzzi and Anderson are not comparable except in your head and nothing you've said changes that fact.
    Erkadurk347 and OldNYIfan liked this.
    Jul 14 at 4:06
    #15
    Joined: May 2020
    Posts: 4,075
    Likes: 3,002
    Quoting: TrueCanuck
    I can't agree more.

    I don't understand why fans are overpaying so much for Bertuzzi. He's exactly what Hyman is/was for Toronto and no one would give up that much for Hyman because the whole league knows he's helped by his linemates.

    The best trade comparable is Anderson for Domi and a 3rd last off-season. It needs to be a positional need for positional need. Honestly, Rielly for Bertuzzi straight up makes a ton of sense. Toronto likely loses some value there, but no trade is 50/50 and it gives them what they need so it still makes sense for them.

    You don’t think GMs would give up valuable assets for Hyman? Seems like the “insiders” and those news outlets didn’t get that memo. I’d also wager the difference in help Hyman received versus Bertuzzi is a bit different. I posted this a couple days ago but over the last three seasons Detroit has 491 goals versus Toronto’s 709. Safe to say he’d pick up a few more apples.

    Source
    http://www.nhl.com/stats/teams?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20182019&seasonTo=20202021&gameType=2&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=goalsFor&page=0&pageSize=50

    Depends on the role of the player in valuing goals. Would I say a soft offensive winger that scores 20 versus a power forward that screens the net & gets 20 is the same? You should know the answer to that. Bertuzzi does a ton of things that aren’t on the scoresheet and to be 50 points on Detroit is actually decent with our style & supporting cast.
    RedWing9119 and OldNYIfan liked this.
    Jul 14 at 5:11
    #16
    Joined: May 2018
    Posts: 1,143
    Likes: 657
    Quoting: BStinson
    You don’t think GMs would give up valuable assets for Hyman? Seems like the “insiders” and those news outlets didn’t get that memo. I’d also wager the difference in help Hyman received versus Bertuzzi is a bit different. I posted this a couple days ago but over the last three seasons Detroit has 491 goals versus Toronto’s 709. Safe to say he’d pick up a few more apples.

    Source
    http://www.nhl.com/stats/teams?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20182019&seasonTo=20202021&gameType=2&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=goalsFor&page=0&pageSize=50

    Depends on the role of the player in valuing goals. Would I say a soft offensive winger that scores 20 versus a power forward that screens the net & gets 20 is the same? You should know the answer to that. Bertuzzi does a ton of things that aren’t on the scoresheet and to be 50 points on Detroit is actually decent with our style & supporting cast.


    Did you notice how he fudged Anderson's stats? Look carefully...
    BStinson and OldNYIfan liked this.
    Jul 14 at 5:16
    #17
    Joined: May 2020
    Posts: 4,075
    Likes: 3,002
    Quoting: RedWing9119
    Did you notice how he fudged Anderson's stats? Look carefully...

    Yeah, I noticed that he switched last year with this year and completely dropped the current season. Honest mistake I hope but you never know.
    RedWing9119 and OldNYIfan liked this.
     
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