The penguins starting goalie was injured like half the year lol. Their top defenseman missed games due to a stroke and his dad passing. They literally had the worst GM in the league. The pens still have Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, and Kris Letang. Until proven otherwise, I’m not betting against them. With a semi-competent GM the pens make the playoffs this year. Even with all the other stuff happening.
Actually thinking the Sabres currently constructed are better than the pens or even on the same level is pure delusion on the next level 😂.

Wouldn’t expect anything less from someone who thinks players use Buffalo as leverage to get bigger contracts 😂.
That must have worked wonders for Ryan Strome who after having a career year went to rebuilding Anaheim going from 4.5 million-5 million per year…oh wait…
Well maybe it worked for Frank Vatrano who had 13 pts in 20 playoff games, 13 pts in 22 games with the rangers…oh wait he settled for rebuilding Anaheim too and only went from making 2.533 million - 3.65 million…
Well surely ERod coming off a career year of 43 points could strike it big using Buffalo as leverage…wait…only 2 million? After only making 1 million last year and coming off a career year? Say it ain’t so?
Well Danton Heinen coming off a career high in goals and playoff goals surely would make bank using Buffalo as leverage…what? He went from 1.1 million - 1 million? Weird.
Well big fish Barkov surely would get McDavid money in free agency after a career year….oh wait he wanted to stay in Florida, so he took only 10 million per year and didn’t even make it to free agency for teams to throw money at him.
Hmmm weird how using Buffalo for leverage hasn’t worked out like you said and players are willing to take less to go to a team they want 🤷‍♂️

I would sincerely hope the team that has drafted top 10 in every draft since 2012 has a better prospect pool than the team that has drafted in the top 10 once since 2006 lol

Okay, you're absolutely right. The pens are way better. Im sorry I ever criticized. Truth is I don't know much about hockey. But I appreciate your willingness to explain and walk me through it. My delusions come and go, but it's nice that there are people on this site willing to be patient with it. A rare breed now a days. You're probably right the pens will contend for a cup next year. Looking forward to it. It must be nice being super smart. I hope I can get there some day. Maybe I can learn more from reading your posts.

Thanks again!

that isnt close to HALF of what Ullmark would cost

Everything on here is bad. A dime a dozen homer post.

Noooo it’s ridiculous. F-. Terrible. vezina winning goalie with 2x5 left on his deal for a 3rd and a trash d man? That’s clinically insane. Psychiatric team insane.

Maybe the bruins have to trade ullmark. That’s a very reasonable assertion, your first of the thread. There are THIRTY other teams that could offer more than a 3rd and a trash d man. Add a first - still trash.

What’s in the water down in Pitt?

DOC has done significantly more to prove himself than any of the other guys mentioned in your comment though

If Boston made Ullmark available, this offer easily gets beaten.

No he hasn’t. Sure he’s “done more” because he’s had more opportunities. But “significantly more” is a stretch….

Sure he has. He's been better in the AHL and NHL

He's had more opportunities because he's done more to get those opportunities. And he's made them count.

It's definitely light it'd definitely take more than a 3rd and POJ to get Ullmark (even if everyone knows Bruins have to sell to make room for Swayman) but I wouldn't call POJ a "trash d-man". He's 23 years old and was a +8 last year on a team that finished negative goal differential with 21 pts in 75 games (not being on the PP unless there were injuries) in basically his first season in the NHL. You'd buy him based on his potential. He's also a former first round pick. I just don't agree with that assessment. He's definitely light esp. for his size and he made some boneheaded mistakes and turnovers last year but he looked pretty good at times. I'd prefer we keep him unless the return is good. I wouldn't call him a "trash d-man" though. He's a definite starter in the league and again he's only 23.

Soooo I guess Puustinen and Nylander haven’t been good in the AHL now? Poulin we will leave out due to his uncertainties and the mental absence that he took, can’t really bring that into the conversation as that was an obvious hurdle in his development.

24-35-59 in 72gp for Puustinen
25-25-50 in 55 gp for Nylander

Both solid seasons down in WBS, now has DOC played better in the AHL? Yea, sure but he also has developed faster and been in our system longer then both Puustinen and Nylander so obviously he’s going to be the teams first option of the 3.

DOC has 17 points total in 78 career games over the last 3 years with the Pens. Puustinen and Nylander have a combined 10 games played in Pittsburgh and have yet to be given a real “opportunity” in the lineup on a night to night basis. So I wouldn’t go as far as to say DOC is “significantly better” then the 2 solely because we haven’t even seen them play enough NHL games with us to make that determination.

Literally nowhere did I say they haven't been good lol. I said DOC has been better - because he has. 27g-46a-73p in 73 gp for DOC at the AHL level.

I'm all for giving one of Puustinen/Nylander a spot absolutely, but definitely not at the cost of DOC. Plus they're two(three) completely different types of players. Nylander/Puustinen don't have the skillset for bottom 6 play - they're smaller, skilled forwards where it's play them in the top 6 or it's a waste. Whereas DOC fits the bottom 6 mold a lot better. They shouldn't be competing for the same roster spots.

DOCs also playing 9 minutes a night with bad teammates getting all dzone starts - so just looking at his point totals doesn't tell much. He scored at the same rate as Bryan Rust this past season. He scored at a significantly higher rate than Nylander in his brief stint - and Nylander was playing with Malkin and getting heavy offensive zone starts. Sure, significantly better applied more to the AHL numbers than the NHL - we need to see more of guys like Nylander and Puustinen. But I see nothing anywhere that says any of the guys you mentioned should be playing over DOC

Context is everything. This isn’t taking a flyer on a young d man. This is the key piece coming back for Linus ullmark. In that context, he’s trash

I was going to say just this lol. Thank you for at least being reasonable. I’m not saying it’s a lot of value coming back. Actually I’ve kind of insinuated that Bruins fans would say it’s not good enough. But going on history, it’s just not far off from what goalies have gotten. Even with similar stats. Count in the fact that the Bruins are cap strapped, Ullmark had a 16 team NTC, and almost all of the playoff contenders are in cap hell. I just don’t see where he’d command much more.
For context: Robin Lehner was traded to Vegas with 69 (nice) percent retention (1.1 million) for an AHL starting goalie with a sub .900 save percentage and a 3+ GAA at the nhl level, a 2nd, and 5th.
Jack Campbell (when he was at his peak) was traded to Toronto 50% retained (800k) for two 3rds and Trevor Moore who was a 4th liner putting up 10 points in a season.
MAF off a vezina winning year was traded to Chicago for nothing, then flipped by Chicago 50% retained for a 2nd at the deadline to Minnesota whose GM loves Fleury.
Cam Talbot was traded from the rangers to Edmonton with a 7th for a 2nd, 3rd, and 7th.
Starting goalies don’t get traded often so the value is hard to judge but history has shown that they don’t return much. Even the good ones and there are a lot of free agent options that teams would probably rather just sign and not give assets up for. That was basically my assessment of the situation.
Maybe he’d be willing to go to a team like Detroit or Buffalo who could offer more 🤷‍♂️. But this is the most I’d offer as a pens fan.

Yea he’s been better because he’s played longer in WBS and been in the system longer, as expected he should be better.

I disagree I think both Puustinen and Nylander can find success on our team regardless it’s just a matter of if the scoring can translate to the NHL level which has yet to be seen. Obviously if that answer is no then yea the top 6 is out of the equation for them, I’d guess Nylander has more potential regardless. As you did say though I can’t really see Puustinen being around long if his game doesn’t translate to our top 6. His size hurts him a lot in that regard to be consistently playing that kind of game.

DOC games played for the baby pens - 73. Puustinen - 145. Nylander - 99. So not sure what you're trying to get at there.

I think they can find success as well - I'm not saying they're terrible players. Just that to give them a roster spot over DOC is a bit crazy. DOC has proven himself already as capable to be an NHL regular on this team - the others haven't. Plus he plays a completely different role with a different skillset and playstyle. Like I said - I think one of Nylander/Puustinen should make the roster - but it shouldn't be over DOC. It should be more as like a Heinen replacement or something - or to move Rust down to the 3rd line to give better depth. They should be in the top 6 - similar to what they did with Sheary and Guenztel when they came up. Because that's where they'd fit. I don't see them as as bottom 6 grinders getting defensive zone starts. I think that's a recipe for disaster and just setting them up for failure - like you said I don't see Puustinen being around long either if he can't carve out a spot on the top 2 lines