I read your description, Habs aren't trading Dach for PLD. Get that in your head Jets fans

Personally, I wouldn't do this as the Hawks. Blocks pathways for our young D core and the incentive isn't big enough. Mrazek is fine for tanking in between the pipes.

Sure

How is a player we just paid 13th OVA + 65th OVA for equal to 19th OVA and Pionk? The Trouba trade would be more like Florida's 1st (14-19th) + Harris, the one you are proposing is 13th + 37th + 65th, 13th is more valuable than 19th was, Pionk at the time might have gotten 37 but we are losing value because we also gave up the 65th pick. That's just pick value alone, when you factor in age, contract length, cap hit and years of team control these all favor Dach over PLD and then when you add in the PLD may very well only be open to signing long-term in Montreal and that makes this a huge no thanks from Montreal. Take the Cats 1st + Dvorak + Kidney or Mailloux, it's the best deal you're going to get!

That’s fair honestly. Thanks for the input

Lmaoo the Trouba trade would not be like Harris and the 1st. Harris a bottom 4 d-man. Pionk was a young top 4 d in my before getting moved. Dach and a 2nd is much closer. If dvorak, kidney, mid-late 1st is what your offer for Dubois is, the jets will just move him as a rental. Look at what horvat (wasn’t traded with an extension since u can’t do that anymore) and Meier got as rentals. You need to offer the jets something you want to get something u want. Or just risk it and wait a year. Up to you.

Either way, as I said in the description, not the point of the post but nice.

Horvat got a top 10 protected 1st + Raty + Beauvillier. Top 10 protected 1st = 1st (14th OVA), Raty = Kidney, Beauvillier = Dvorak. That quite literally is the same value as the Horvat deal. The Meier deal is similar but had other prospects added from both sides that just convoluted the deal. Your just ridiculous if you think Montreal is trading Dach + for PLD, at that point it makes more sense for Montreal to try an OS at 6.3 mil x 1 year and only have to risk a 1st and 3rd.

Dach isn't available in a Dubois trade and it has nothing to do with value. Dach is bought and paid for, providing good value, and has fit in smoothly. We aren't giving him up.

We aren't in a position to move young top 6 forwards or RHD. We're in the process of adding them. Moving forward, not two steps forward and one step back, not sideways, and we aren't in a hurry. Slow and steady, one step at a time.

Trading for Dubois is done to add to what we are building. If we're going to trade for him is has to be pieces that are either already on their way out before it matters or have not yet secured their place.

I'd love to have Dach in a PLD trade, but it's not happening.

Your argument: MTL won’t wait because NYR didn’t wait with Trouba.

I’ll give you a counter-argument. NYR wanted to push for playoffs in 2019-2020. MTL doesn’t want to push at all in 2023-2024.

Jets fans thinking that they will receive a lottery pick, Suzuki or Dach are being delusonial.

The fact that you think Raty and Kidney are on the same level says enough. I didn't want to get into this because it's a pointless argument. I'm not going to change your mind and you aren't going to change my mind. Can't we just agree to disagree?

New york was not pushing for playoffs lol. They won the lottery that year lol. They were ensuring they got a long-term piece they wanted. Thats why they went for it. I don't think the jets are getting a lottery pick or suzuki. Both are more valuable then Dubois. However, I disagree on dach. You have to give up to get, and id think Dach was expendable for a guy like Dubois. They got him for only a 13 oa pick and late 2nd anyway.

In the same situation, NY gave a young top 4 guy and a 1st for a top pairing shutdown guy. Asking for a young top 6 C and a 2nd for a 1C power forward (breed that's rare and valuable in the NHL) isn't out of reach. If not, the jets can just move him to another team and MTL waits and risks not getting him when he hits the market. However, they wont do that if hes the guy they want.

I'm going to also be honest with you, if I was Montreal, id be all over this trade. Dubois is a significant upgrade on Dach and it would give Montreal a dynamic 1-2 punch that can be build around as the rebuild continues into its final phase.

That being said, I didn't want to get into this because it's a pointless argument. I'm not going to change your mind and you aren't going to change my mind. Like the whole basis of this argument is speculation on both sides. Can't we just agree to disagree?

You do realize that Raty was taken 11 spots ahead of Kidney and that was before Kidney put up back to back 100+ point seasons, in a redraft Kidney likely goes either just before or just after Raty. The fact that you are a Jets homer that rivals Windjammer is enough for anyone! Actual knowledgeable Jets fans like Howie, Birtle34 and Jetman have already agreed that a package similar to what I proposed would be the most likely (their favorite is Florida's 1st + Mailloux + Dvorak), I swapped Kidney for Mailloux cause a lot of fans don't like/want Mailloux.

Firstly, Dach isn't expendable and simply won't be traded. He was one of the best players on the team this season, is signed to a very nice contract and his age lines up perfectly with the rest of the young core, so trading him at this point makes no sense at all.

Secondly, having Dubois would be nice but the difference between he and Dach doesn't bring in a cup next season. MTL would love to bring Dubois in early but if Dach is required then waiting makes the most sense. Also the fact that NYR did something that is sort of similar doesn't mean that MTL needs to make a trade under those specific parameters because you'd like them to. If MTL don't like that trade then they can simply walk away and let WPG do what they must.

Lastly, the only reason that MTL is even entertaining a trade for Dubois at this juncture is because of his desire to play in MTL and because he's a local lad. If the same player was born with a different last name in a different part of the world then this situation (trading assets for a pending UFA) would barely even be considered and probably actually be outright ridiculed. If Dubois goes somewhere else then so be it, the Habs will be no worst off then they are today. Alternately if PLD does reach UFA then MTL will be getting the same player without having to needlessly sacrifice Dach (whom they highly rate) plus an extra roughly $5m in cap space to weaponize. I prefer the latter option better at his point.

At the start of 2019 NYR wanted clearly wanted to give one good playoff chance to Henrik but with COVID and the bubble playoff, they missed their chance and they luckily won the lottery with only 2,5%.

For many MTL journalists, there is already a competition for #1C between Suzuki and Dach. The development curve of Dach this season is insane and he’s playing with a lot more confidence then previous years and at the start of the season.

The chances are very thin that HuGo trade a player they just acquire and that fit well in the team.

Dubois would be a good add to the team for sure but it is not needed. The speculation are more based on the declaration of Brisson and Friedman than a real need.

Hope you get what you want for Dubois but I think you’ll be as disappointed as Blackhawks fans when they saw what was the return for Kane.

Sure, let’s consider Raty and kidney are at the same level (though I don’t value them the same cause raty has his success at the pro level, not in junior and the overall scouting condenses is with me). That doesn’t change the fact that other than the 1st, those aren’t pieces the jets want. Kidney would be behind the jets glut of young forwards and wouldn’t get a shot for a long time (if he even finds pro success). Mailloux is a guy who would get chevy fired instantly in Winnipeg if he acquired him (though I’m now warming up to the idea at the thought of that). If dach is a big ask, then a guy like barron would need to be included instead. If you want Dubois, you need to give up something the jets want. The point isn’t that we’re fixed on dach, the point is that the jets will be getting something they want back, and a 14-19 oa pick just doesn’t cut it as the only piece of value.

That said, if you are fine waiting a year and risking not getting him, then so be it. The jets will find other suitors (if they can’t sign him to a short term deal). Meier got a better package without an extension in place and he’s basically a UFA.

Anyway, was really trying to avoid this debate when I wrote the description. But alas…