I don't see any way that the Isles do this, particularly given the retention for the term of the contract, without a much higher quality package. If they would trade Sorokin at all...

I think you would at least have to add Hughes or Nemec, maybe more with the retention over 8 years.

2 mil retention over 8 years for our star goaltender. Just the move the Islanders are looking for

LOL. Quantity does not equal quality. Keep your trash goalie and meh prospects.

I was under the impression that the retention was only for this year, and not the new contract on top of it.

So NJD pays 2 mill this year, then the full 8.25 on his new deal

This trade proposal is beyond moronic, but to be fair, the retention would only be for this year. Sorokin's extension doesn't kick in until next year, so they'd just be retaining 50% on the last year of the $4MM AAV contract he's playing on this season.

Mercer is certainly quality.

1st for this year

3rd+Vanacek+Stillman for the 1 year of retention this year

Mercer+Daws for the new contract on Sorokin.

8.25 on his age 29 to 36 season
Vs mercer who you get at 900k this year, and then on a full 8 year deal probably between 5-6 mill for his age 23-30 seasons, and daws as a potential goalie replacement down the line.

I certainly don't think you'd be getting fleeced here

It's a decent return, but unless Vanecek + Varlamov can hold down the fort in net and the trade allows the Isles to bring in a game-changer, it would still be a foolish move to trade Sorokin to a division rival who is already set to turn into a powerhouse while rebuilding isn't an option for the Isles.

Lou Lamoriello is 81 years old. I don't think he cares about Mercer and his cost efficiency in his late 20's or what Daws will be down the line. He wants to win now. His best chance to do that is Ilya Sorokin turning into a world beater in the playoffs and carrying them to a cup.

How much surplus value do you think Sorokin provides over the life of his deal?

Whats a dollar value you expect him to provide
This year:
age 29:
30:
31:
32:
33:
34:
35:
36:

Fair. Lou has certainly ravaged the cupboard in NYI to build what I'd consider a painfully mediocre roster. I don't consider the isles legit contenders, but lou will probably keep trying.

He did that with NJD too. Traded for Schneider when we really should have just rebuilt once Parise and Kovy left.

I think NYI should blow it up as much as they can.

And Sorokin's value will only go down from here.

Right now he's still on a dirt cheap deal for 1 more year, and no trade protection.

After July 1st he's on 8.25 mill and can refuse any potential trade. Value goes down the gutter after that, and likely continues to drop as he uses more and more of his prime years and approaches his mid 30s.

Njd gm would be fired if he made that islanders trade gross overpayment

I believe when a player has already signed an extension the retention carries over to the next contract. So it would be 2M retained this year and then 50% throughout the 8 year deal. I believe a Canucks reporter said it last season when fans were discussing trading Miller with retention because they thought it would be for that season only, but it turns out it would be for the extension years as well

If I were an Isles fan, I'd want them to start to rebuild, but I can't imagine that happens with Lou at this stage in his career.



I think this depends on how his career pans out. If he's a consensus top 3 goalie in the NHL for the bulk of that deal, his cap hit really won't be a point of contention to other teams, especially once the cap starts rising again.

I felt like I was overpaying but that wasn't the consensus I got.

What would your offer be? Mercer 1 for 1?

I would take Mercer out and that would be my offer maybe add a second maybe

Fair. But if you get mercer at like 5x8 and he turns into a legit 2c that you get from ages 22-30. That may hold just as much value in the NHL trade world/market. I agree 100% regarding lou

Vanacek is a negative asset. He's one of the worst goalies in the league this year and still has another year of term at a decent cap hit. It's going to cost you to dump him.

Daws (goalie who has put up mediocre AHL numbers) and Stillman (looks like a future bottom-six guy at best) are nothing special and don't add much to the deal.

So you're basically proposing Mercer a 1st and 3rd for one of the top five goalies in the league (slow start this year notwithstanding) plus the Isles have to take your ****ty goalie and his contract too? Pass.

I had Mercer in bc with Sorokins full deal we'll need to shed salary down the line anyway.

Yeah in that case I'd take out the retention there, move it to pettersson, and reroute some assets their way for it

Can’t shed cap elsewhere? Even with the cap going up to 87.7 next year?

Bratt+Nico+Jack=true core
Dougie+Meier: hefty contracts but they're stars and they have trade protection regardless, can't really be shed unless some contender wants to buy them from us at a fair price, and certainly don't want to give them away.
Palat: trade protection, fills his role well, again trade protection. Would probably cost us a pretty penny to dump and I don't want to send out a 1st to get rid of a guy who's been really good this year and has an Haula similar spot in terms of role, and trade protection. Wouldn't have to pay to dump. I like his contract
Marino has trade protections, I really like his contract, and moving him would leave us a big hole for a top 4 quality shutdown RD. Those aren't easy to replace and certainly aren't cheap.
Siegs has a fantastic contract. Pinching pennies on him would be silly
Holtz,Nemec,Hughes: The guys we need to pay. They're gonna turn out, and I don't want to play around with bridge deals especially on nemec and luke. Why we need to shed in the first place
Mcleod,Schmid: Could save money by not buying term, but I like going for term and I see very defined, valuable roles for them

Really just leaves Mercer:
He's really good, but I worry what his ceiling is value wise in NJD.
He should be a C long term, but there's not a role with Jack and Nico and giving your 3C 5-6 mill a year feels like a waste. And again moving him to wing at 5-6 mill, still behind/with Meier/Palat/Bratt/Holtz, feels like it may be a bit of a waste.

So he makes the most sense to move. Recoup real assets, find him a team who needs him. I don't doubt he'll be a legit top 6C down the line.

How is this even being argued. No one is trading a franchise goalie for a bunch of magic beans.

Yeah that all makes sense I guess he is the odd man out as many have already stated it sucks sending him out but if he brings in a top 10 goalie with term I guess it’s worth it

I see the islanders as a team that should be rebuilding. Not much they can do to add and I don't see a team with a top 6 that includes Anders Lee, Brock Nelson, Pierre Engvall, and Kyle Palmieri doing real damage come playoff team.

You can take vanacek out if you really want. He's a stopgap who can handle a 50+ game workload. If he doesn't perform, you move on, no harm done. If he plays like he did last year, you can either resign him or ship him out as 28 year old starter.

Or you can waive him. I would expect to see one of Chicago, Columbus, or Toronto put in a claim.

Stillman should be a quality bottom 6er for dirt cheap. Nothing more, nothing less, but a piece a rebuilding team should look for.
Daws. Again not a big piece. Young goalie with some upside, literally no downside
You can take out Vanacek, Stillman, 3rd, Daws, retention if you like.

Into Mercer+1st for Sorokin

Mercer costs 900k this year, and has 4 more years as an RFA after. You can go sign him to a 5x8/5.5x8

Shown to be a durable, quality NHLer at age 20,21,22.

Would have finished 2nd on your team in 5v5 points last year. Kills penalties.

Mercer from age 22-30, for 3 million dollars less+ a 1st

Sorokin from ages 28-36, for 3 mill more.

How much does a middle 6 C cost in UFA? Cause I'd say that's mercer's floor

I saw Andrew Copp and Vincent Trochek go for 5.6, 35 year old backlund got extended for 4.5, Compher 5.1, Wennberg 4.5, JGP 5, Coyle 5.25. And I'd say a lot of those guys are more of 3Cs.

Goalies go for a lot less than you think.

You can just look at how the market values them money wise. From the same teams

Helle, Sorokin. 2 franchise goalies. got 8.5 and 8.25 million each

Horvat: career high 61 points at time of signing, career 2C. 8.5 million a year.

Roster plays are just valued higher by the NHL. Fans just don't realize it.

But if you follow what teams are actually doing, you can see that they aren't all that valued.

Look at the money they get in free agency. A lot less than other positions
Look at the assets given in trades. A lot less than other positions
Look at where teams draft them. A lot lower than other positions

Speaking of elite goalies traded for magic beans and bo horvat.

Cory Schneider was traded for 1 singular magic bean