Thats a whole lot of garbage for what should be 2 1st rounders minimum

More like get him two wingers— DOC is great but need him on third line with Ellar and Rakell/Rust are both inconsistent

Habs fans have lost their minds. Savard + Monahan together aren't worth a single 1st. They are combined 7 goals and 19 points 5v5. Not numbers worthy of a 1st, especially without retention.

I'm not very good at math but looking at the official stats on NHL.com, Monahan has 4 goals/16 assists and Savard has 4 goals/11 assists for a combined 8 goals and 27 pts 5v5. That's a little more than 19 pts combined.

I get that you don't like Montreal and/or Monahan or Savard but when using stats has the only deciding factor about the value of a player, you could at the very least use the correct stats.

No on Broz. No on PO Joseph. Habs need future forwards who can score. Got anything else to offer? Let's make a deal!

The game against the Bruins wasn't pretty, but Monahan's 3 points was one of the only positives.

I am not making the argument that Monahan is "as good" as Lindholm, but I find it funny how people on this site say Monahan is crap (while trying to trade for him) and Lindholm is easily worth the usual Center packages we see at the TDL.

Monahan has more goals and points per game than Lindholm at this point... He can be had for a fraction of the cost. I just don't get the hate.

Replace Broz, POJ, and the 3rd with a 1st. Top 3 protected at most; 2025 or 2026 is fine.

Monahan get a first and Savard a second

I mean, you put Monahan 2C. That's worth a lot, especially because of his cap hit. Don't know how many guys on the market could slide I'm 2C easily for under $2M. That's why his value is high. May not be the best producer on the market, but he eats minutes, scores his points infront(playoff guy), and you cannot tell me that's not a desired player archetype. His value is high because there's competition to get him. Anything beyond picks and prospects won't even get the Habs to trade him as they have expressed a desire to keep him if they don't trade.

He's also fantastic in the dot this season, and plays wing like nothing.

Sam Poulin?

Good starting point IMO... But not close to enough.

My bad. It was 2am here.

According to moneypuck, their stats are:
Monahan: 4/12/19
Savard: 3/7/10

So it would be 7 goal, 19 assists, and 26 points.

Not to poke fun but you made the same mistake (granted with different numbers, that I'm not sure why we are different), adding up their assists as points (unless you misspoke). Again, not throwing stones (obviously).



Well that's the either / or fallacy. Either Monahan is worth a 1st or you think he sucks. No. I think he is a very good player and is having a good year. But, you have to take into account that 55% of his goals are on the PP as are 45% of his points. For a team like the Pens that is valuable but most contenders don't need PP help. He also has an extensive injury history. These things lower his value. Not to nothing but less than a 1st. Maybe a very low 1st.



Well I'm not the OP. I do have a ACGM where I traded for Monahan but he was my 3C and PP guy. To you point, there is value in a 3C who can win lots of faceoffs and play 3rd line LW. But. I don't see that value as a lottery 1st.

Poulin and a 3rd would get Monahan in a vacuum. With any bidding war, it would become Poulin and a 2nd.

POJ, Poulin, Smith and a 3rd for Monahan and Savard?

Just like Joel Edmundson was going to fetch a kings ransom last year? Have fun in la la land. I don’t agree with OP’s trade, but your expectations are hilariously delusional.

You do realize that you are saying a guy with more ppg at 5 on 5 is a pp specialist right? According to you he has 4/12/19 (but that equals 16 not 19 points) out of his 11/20/31 totals are 5 on 5 that makes his PP totals 5/8/13 meaning he is producing slightly better at 5 on 5 as on the PP, all the while being saddled with low quality wingers. Can you imagine if Malkin had to try to produce with any 2 of Armia, Pearson, Gallagher, Ylonen or RHP? I don't think his 5 on 5 points would be very flattering either. This whole Monahan can't produce at 5 on 5 BS started with Leafs fans, yes 42% of Monahan's points are on the PP but the thing they neglect to realize is that Nylander's breakdowns are very similar he produces 36% of his points on the PP. Does that make him a PP specialist and 3rd liner who isn't worth a 1st? No, cause there is value in players who can play in all situations and produce equally (or close to it). Yes Nylander is a higher end player than Monahan but the premise stands, if Monahan isn't worth a 1st compared to guys like Lindholm because he doesn't produce as much at 5 on 5, then Nylander's value compared to guys like Guntzel who does most of his scoring at 5 on 5. The fact is, only about 10% of the players in the league score a significantly higher % of their points at 5 on 5, I am talking McDavid, Crosby, Petterson, Q. Hughes, Matthews, that is why this is such a lame argument!

There is no such thing as a vacuum in professional sports... C'mon now. I think we can all agree his price is inflated because of 4 factors:

1) The TDL
2) Scarcity of centers on the market this TDL who can do what he does
3) His incredible cap hit (Most teams have no issue paying out 500K of salary for the rest of the season)
4) His consistent delivery over the past 2 seasons with the Habs of 0.67 PPG or 2 points every 3 games with terrible 5-on-5 linemates (Evans this year, Hoffman last year, Anderson).

The upside gamble is:

What can he do on a good team?

The downside gamble is:

Are his hips really 100% after the 2 surgeries as he claims?

Anyway... Since 10-16 teams are gonna want him, I think he gets more than Poulin and a 2nd.

Love this comment! He IS making his linemates better. Everyone who plays with him starts scoring.

Even Kutcherov produces at similar rates 42 5 on 5 points 34 PP points and he is 2nd in league scoring. That is 55% of his points at 5 on 5 and 45% on the PP, does he suck too then?!

I mean he IS a PP specialist. 44% of his 31 points are on the PP. That means he is ranked 243rd in goals and 139th in points 5v5. On the PP those become 37th and 39th. So he is top 200 among forwards 5v5 and top 40 5v4. That sounds like a PP specialist to me.

Also, you mention Nylander. As if they are comparable. Nylander is ranked 16th in goals and 34th in points 5v5. He is also ranked 24th in goals and 10th in points 5v4. So he would be a top 30 player 5v5 and a top 20 player on the PP. In terms of points.

The difference is that guys like Kucherov who score 50% of their points on the PP, also score a lot 5v5. Monahan is a top 50 guy on the PP but not 5v5. Sorry.

No. Because he is ALSO good 5v5. You know you're being disingenuous. Stop it.

The thing you keep overlooking is quality of linemates at 5 on 5 he has to drag around the likes of Anderson, Gallagher, Ylonen, RHP, Pearson and Armia. On the PP he plays with Suzuki, Caufield and Slafkovsky, there is a huge gap in talent there, we only have 3 other top 6 quality guys healthy right now and they all play on the same line at 5 on 5 so how is Monahan supposed to produce?!

You could be right. He might get more than Poulin and a 2nd. I don't think the Pens would give up more than that and I think (if the Pens are buying) they would be the best destination for Monahan. Just as if the Pens are selling, Van would be the best spot for Guentzel. Just my opinion.

Right. So if that is your argument (it is fair) but don't bring up stats of guys like Nylander and Kucherov, saying they produce on the PP at a high rate so they are the same.

Now, if you want to talk about linemates, we can but you have to acknowledge that to a buying team, that is a gamble. Maybe he would do better with better linemates. Maybe not. The Pens took that gamble with Granlund, it did not work out.

But, in that argument, you point has merit. Just avoid the "player X has A% on the PP too, are they also a PP specialist" argument. It isn't a good one.

Reread my comment, I said they were obviously more skilled than Monahan, the point remains that there are only a very few players who produce at a significantly higher % of their points at 5 on 5 vs the PP. So to say that one who produces the same % of his points on the PP (Monahan) is just a PP specialist and others aren't is a ridiculous argument. If player A scores 42% of his points on the PP and is considered a PP specialist cause he only has 30 points but Player B who produces 45% oh his points on the PP but has 60 points is a complete player, without taking into account quality of linemates at 5 on5 is a ridiculous argument. They literally produce at almost the same rate, the skill levels might be different but the rates are the same. I have said this a hundred times over the last few days, if you give Monahan 2 top 6 players like Malkin and Rust and his overall and 5 on 5 production will skyrocket.