We're pretty low on cap space, also Ceci is unnecessary for us as we have already quite many offensive d-men. And Johns seems to be fit to play.

Putting Hanzal to LTIR will create some cap space, but I'd use it to strengthen DAL closer the deadline than take a, let's face it, an overpaid bottom-4 d-man.

Why I suggested Ceci to NJ is because If I recall correctly, NJ were interested in him before they acquired Subban.

I get that, good to here johns is looking healthy. Hope he stays that way. Using ltir does make loading up at the deadline a bit trickier though. To be honest after thinking about it I don’t think Honka would fit our needs.

Out of curiosity, what exactly are your most pressing needs?

Actually... cap space I guess lol. If there were s chance to upgrade ceci and save a few bucks that would be nice. I think he’s got the right motivation for this season so who knows.

Well if it is cap space you're looking for, I think ARI could be willing to do a Hinostroza for Johnsson swap...maybe some picks needs to be added. Their point totals are close to similar but Hinostroza is almost $2M cheaper. Just an idea lol.

I am (or will be) crushed by a Hyman trade. It's not because I am a Hyman fan...well who knows...maybe I am. Anyway I recognize the things he brings to this team and how sorely lacking those qualities are aside from him bringing them.

The immediate fix would be a Hyman trade but truthfully looking into the future...it's hard to imagine Dubas being able to keep Hyman past this current deal anyway...it's just that with this Marner contract, moving on from Hyman is happening alot sooner than some of us figured.

I know this is not the place to ask....but I wanted to ask the gang @Jamiepo tagged above....why did Dubas feel like Marner needed to be signed for this season for the amount and term he got?

I'm asking because I'm still not convinced this is the year to "go for it" yet...this Marner signing feels so much like "going for it".

Thoughts on that guys??

Well the team is fairly solid this year. The top 9 are locked in for the next 2 years. Yeah the contract is an overpay, at least 1.9m. But we all knew that was coming. The team is certainly better with Mitch on it. If it all fits and Mitch is in camp then I think you just do what needs to be done. With all these other rfa’s Out and limited cal space maybe a higher market for the rfa’s can work to his advantage.

I think dubas’ first priority was to get Mitch into camp on a deal that could work.

I think its pretty straightforward, really. My guess is that the negotiations were uglier than we thought and the leafs would rather get it over with and sign an overpay than watch Mitch's value depreciate with this prolonged clusterf*uck. Cause let's be honest, his value has taken a hit given how he chose to approach things. And it would only get worse if this car wreck dragged on.

I'd bet a nickle that before the season starts Dubas, Shanny and co have a sit down with Mitch, Paul and Ferris and tell them in plain language that the contract is now done and there'll be no grudges moving forward. That said if Mitch ever puts himself ahead of the team again he'll be traded so fast that his head will spin...

Hyman might not be the guy to go.. if we have to move anyone at all. It might be Mitch. And now that he's signed with term I think the leafs could actually get a really good haul for him.

I dont see Marner as one who put himself over the Team, the trend started in January 2019 already, his camp just jumped on a bandwagon. At least hes not publicly stating he dont want to play with Kapanen......

He caved....again

Ferris proly had his pants full, but he managed not to blink first.....

Eh? I'm not referring to the contract amount. I'm referring to his tactics..

*leaking like sieve and making the negotiation process public through their puppet Dreger even after publicly being asked to stop by Shanny
*actively pursuing an OS while he had and EXISTING overpay offer from the leafs of 11M @ 7/8 yrs that would have made him one of the highest players in the game
* manipulating the narrative and painting Mitch as being disrespected and victimized by the leafs, all while he had that massive overpay offer onbthe table
.. smh
*never ending rumours of Paul and his burner accounts.

Take Mitch and the leafs out of it for a second, and ask yourself if you'd be comfortable forming a long term relationship with someone who acts like that without some kind of assurance that they learned from the experience and also wouldn't want to repeat it. And if they decided to maintain that behaviour, well, they would be forewarned that it wouldn't be tolerated...

There was lots of chatter throughout these negotiations about who had what leverage. Now that the contract is done, Mitch has absolutely zero leverage that would justify his antics . I can certainly see how the leafs will make this abundantly clear to lil Richy Mitch.

It worked for them honey, wasnt it

Again, i still think you ppl are looking into wrong direction, Mitch proly didnt do sh.t thru whole negotiations process, why would he, he hired agent for that. And about forming relations with "ppl like that", the damage was done back in January 2019, best goals 5v5 my a.s, in no way the AAV / Term should be doubled in comparison with all the other League contracts....if that one would be handled properly, today we wouldnt be talking about Mitch greed and kid would be signed 7 x 9,5M ( one year less then Kutcherov cause of "you-know-taxes" ). Ferris just followed the trend and played it out as he knew the caving is on the way again.....

Ugh. Smh. Ok

Think you're missing the point here, Laudan. But fill yer boots on that one if you want to..

So what is your solution when Matthews camp comes to the table and won’t sign a deal for 8 years under 13.25m? Do you leave him hanging out for an offersheet?

Its a tough one yes, but who on th earth is he to come with 8 x 13M demand on top of 63 and 69 and "90 to be" points in last Seasons. Thats McDavids money and he clearly isnt one. Its ok that you ppl are so firmly standing behind what hapened there, but 5y term in no way should end with 11,634 if 8 x 13M was a starting point. It pans out noone wanted to overpay Marner with offer-sheets, so actualy i dare to claim same would be with Matthews. And even if ,maybe those numbers on Offer-sheet he would recieve would be way favourable in AAV and Term that those last two contracts handed out are......

in which world you give 500k more and 2y less Term then to other franchise player that left 2M on the table to play for TML...

we were all mocking Draisaitl's and Eichel's overpayment, but now when its done in TMLland, everything is on the spot ?

Dont you think EDM werent in a pickle about McDavid and Draisaitl being Offer-sheeted ? Chiarelli land them both for 8 years.....same goes for the rest of overperforming RFAs.....

Secretly hoping it's Nylander to the Wild...

But really I bet it's Hyman or Ceci. Ceci makes the most sense to me, he has a larger cap hit and could be replaced internally by the Leafs. Hyman has an extremely reasonable contract for a top 9 forward, let alone for a forward that plays in the top 6. I suppose Hyman could be replace by Bracco, but the Leafs would save themselves a lot more money by trading Ceci.

Cap to a certain extent isn’t a real issue. Just have to stay under the relief. 1m in net space would be more than enough. I think if Lilly comes out of camp looking great than yes ceci could be moved. But man that’s risky. From what I have read... dubas is keeping everyone and Pridham is going to have them walking the tight rope all season... should be spicy...


And oh... No!!!! You can’t have slick Willy.... lol.

Admittedly I haven't been paying much attention to the Leafs the past few weeks, but that makes sense reading through the thread. In that case, I bet it's Hyman and then the Leafs bring up Bracco or something.

Okay so this is why I like discussing these topics. I don't always agree with @Laudan or @LoganOllivier hell there's alot of times I see things exactly like @Jamiepo and @Trickster do....but then that one time we may disagree on a thing. The respect is very much there tho.

I did shake my head at the 5 year term for Matthews. Dubas was also in a tough spot too because Matthews was on a scoring streak that would be kind of scary for any GM during a contract extension negotiation.

Factor in offer sheets and that is a crazy amount of pressure to get one of your best players signed.



Hehe!
A few of us are secretly hoping Dumba finds his way onto the Leafs too....

Hyman or Ceci.

Hyman can replaced internally pretty easily with a number of guys to choose from, yes they wont be the same as Hyman.

Liljergen could make the team yes, I do not think he is ready to be paired with Rielly though. I say this because Ceci is Riellys D partner right now IMO.

I could see a 3 way trade making sense were we gamble on say Honka with Ceci going to team 3 and a pick to Dallas but Dallas needs to likely move say Janmark too so they can have Johns on the roster this year.

The logical alternatives are Hyman, Muzzin and Ceci if we accept the premise that somebody has to go. (Maybe we're wrong and getting all excited over nothing.) And I think that the state of Toronto's defense is that moving either of the latter two is very unwise.

My two cents is that Dubas may be too young to negotiate well, but he understands math better than we do, and therefore I hold out hope that the reason why he settled on $10,893,000 is that he can afford to keep Hyman at that price. God knows if he painted himself into that corner and has to trade Hyman and Brown in the same year, he ought to follow Babcock out the door.

Remember all those Nylander-for-Pesce trades suggested at the beginning of the holdout that we all pooh-poohed at the time? Dontcha wanna revisit that thought now?

Personally not me, yes pesce would be great to have but I’m a huge fan of nylander and I think there is a lot of untapped potential there.

For this year the D is okay, I think next year it gets even better.

Hehe!
I think I agree with you and @Jangle29 the most ?
It's nearly 24 hours after the signing and I'm still wondering why Dubas did what he did.

When the Leafs were missing Nylander...and those times when Matthews was injured, they were fine...still were a good team. So...to think the Leafs would be terrible without Marner is so misleading.

At that time, I would have made such a deal. Now? Well...I'm sure you are keeping track of all the Nylander trade ACGMs and most of them end with non Leafs fans saying how ****ty Nylander looked last season....dismissing right away that the guy missed training camp and one month of regular season games.

Leafs would be trading him at his lowest value so there's just not a single trade that makes sense. I do believe what @Jamiepo says about Nylander and if a big salary is needed to be traded down the line then may be a candidate then.