Like below replacement level bad?

if he was a 3rd pairing guy making 1.5 million a year no one would complain.
But when ever someone hurts he's always the guy who gets moved. He got shafted on the RHD out of position for almost a full season because no one else could do it.
He got moved up to 1st pairing for 1/2 a year because who else was there?
He had no business in either spot but there were no other options. If you took your average 3rd pairing guy and played him 1st pairing your results wouldn't be much different. In the beginning of the year when he played his natural LHD role in a 3rd pairing situation. There was not a whole lot to complain about.
Is JJ a bad defense man, he's not a 1st pairing guy that's for sure. Is he awful. He's clearly got NHL talent.
There is no real answer to this question because if you say a guy is good, you expect him to be 1st pairing. But not all "good" defense men are 1st pairing guys. You just have to know your role and fill it.
If you think Riikola would have been any better in 1st pairing minutes you are kidding yourself.

He's a 3rd pairing LHD. It is what it is. Does that make you good or bad? depends where you are forced to play.

Like below replacement level bad?

He's not "good", but he is not as bad as people say.

He is #6 on my depth chart for the Pens. I'd rather Johnson be on the ice than Riikola, Ruhwedel, or Trotman.

The Pens coach thinks Johnson is glorious though. While Dumoulin was out (12/1-3/2, for Dmen) Johnson was #2 in Ev TOI/G, #1 SH TOI/G, #2 overall TOI/G. (Letang ot the #1's in Ev and Ov)
21:21 per game while Dumoulin was out.

You’re right that JJ has the talent to be play in the NHL. In fact, he was a very good top pairing defenseman in his prime. But you could say the same thing about Duncan Keith & Brent Seabrook. Look at where they’re at. The truth is, JJ’s game has fallen off & his performance is really not at replacement level anymore. During the last 5 games of the season, JJ had an expected goals against percentage of 80, meaning 4 out of 5 times when he was on the ice, the team gave up a scoring chance. He was playing on the third pair during that stretch. The second lowest player on the team was Schultz at 46, quite a significant gap. How do you explain the fact that JJ’s rate of giving up scoring chances is constantly so high, whereas the other players on the team are much lower? I don’t see how Riikola would’ve done worse than him. It’s pretty evident that JJ can’t defend the front of the net, loses mark of his opponent & struggles to exit his own end. I always see you bashing players like Letang, Simon, Sheary & Marner but you defend guys like JJ & Reaves to death. Doesn’t any make sense to me.

and if both those guys were on 1.5 million contracts not a word would be spoken.
You can talk about JJ stats all day. Go look at the 20-30 games he played in his actual role and realize he was a + player on the ice.
You play a guy where he doesn't belong and you blame the guy. That is just insane.
He knows he's not a 1LD. What do you want from him. He's trying the best he can to help the team out. If there weren't injuries he'd never been in that role this year for what 40 some games.
It is what it is. All I know is they don't have better anywhere on the team. Can anyone argue otherwise?
It's not like Riikola wasn't already on the ice as well.

Yes, well below replacement level

absolutly. Dom Zuszirauwrtgsions model has him as the worst defenseman in the NHL with a -0.92 GSVA. Brent seabrook is at a -0.36 and Ceci at -0.20. his model is a lot nicer to him then Evolving Hockey's and Micah Blake Mccurdy's

Even at his peak....Jack Johnson had a negative on ice impact, especially on Defense. But got some big point point totals due mostly to PP.

He's like Ristolainen if Risto was 33.

I love criticizing him but if he's in NHL and playing regularly, he's certainly " okay " at something. Especially if on a good team/staff/direction like the Pens.



Agreed here, depends on the role he has. If he plays some games, with limited ice time and if he plays with a good D partner, he might not look that bad. Surprised the Pens played him with Letang for most part of the season (I know Dumoulin was injured but still).


But overall, he's probably one of the worst LD in the league, if not the worst (still sucks TOR didn't gave any chance to Ben Harpur).

Jack is just slightly past his prime, but still serviceable as bottom pair D man on 12-14 minutes a game.
When he first was traded to Columbus around 2012, he came from the LA Kings who were in their prime and winning championships.
He handled it with class, was a quiet leader, and was a very good top pair D man.
But both age and some off-ice issues really took a toll on his game.
I think he is a class guy, and will always respect him for what he brought to the Jackets for the 7 or so years he was here.

Short answer-no.
Is he as bad as the haters say? No.



Agree. The fact that he's overpaid and had to play as the #1LHD WAY TOO LONG emphasized his mistakes that much more. I'd say that overall he's a bad NHL defenseman, but only a below average 3rd pairing defenceman. I'll say he gets way too much blame. What other defenseman has clips of his failures publicized as much as JJ? Every game we lose is (according to haters and people who over blow everything) the fault of one of JJ, Letang, Murray, Simon, or Wes Macauley(that's the only one they might have a case for... Just ridiculous. It is still a team game and there are 38+ players not to mention coaches, refs, and on occasion zamboni drivers who impact a game.



I hope he is bought out. Schultz IMHO was worse than JJ this year. I'm not too confident in a JJ-Schultz pairing when the playoffs resume. If Schultz picks his game up that would help a lot. Maybe Sully will bench him for the first game of the playoffs like last year, and maybe he'll stay benched, and just maybe we'll do a whole lot better than get swept in the first round.

In an ideal world I’d Play rikola over JJ

Honestly I believe the reason why he’s playing is cuz they gotta use him so that he maintains some trade value. Pretty much every stat ranks Riikola over him.

For sure, the problem is his contract. Its the same situation as Brent Seabrook except he makes half as much money. Neither of them would be getting the **** they get if they werent signed to bad contracts. They had their glory days until the game changed. You're going to have defensemen who can only handle third line minutes, but ideally those guys are not making more than 1.5 mil

This. It makes no sense to crap on your own asset. You gain nothing from it.

Truth is Jack Johnson is not what he used to be, most people see that and no one wants to have the guy that spent full price on a has been because you are paying for name more than performance. He's easily still an NHL'er just not nearly the caliber he once was. No one would be crapping on him if he was making 900K.

JJ is below replacment level. Mitch played like an 8 million dollar player this year, so not to his contract standards but still pretty solid. JJ is one of the worst Dman in the league right now and thats the honest truth.

He really isn't that bad. Dumoulin and Schultz have been injured for basically the whole year and we still have a top 10 defense with him playing almost 20 minutes a night. He's no longer a top pairing defenseman but we won the cup with Rob Scuderi and Hal Gill on our bottom pairing. We won back to back cups with Olli Maatta and won one of those with no Letang. Also from what I've heard he's good in the locker room so I think we'll survive if he's here another year or two.

Mitch marner makes 1.5 million more then his comparables. Jack Johnson makes 3.25 million dollars more then he should. The fact that the two are even in the same conversation is hilarious. Johnson isnt an nhl player making 3.25 million a season, marner is a borderline superstar who's worth the money he makes

Johnson was never very good.

Explain to me why JJ concedes shots and scoring chances at a rate so much higher than the two defensemen you mentioned? Maybe it’s because of his incapabilities to mark the opposition & exit the zone. Also, mentioning Marner was a worst contract is absurd. Before enduring through a slump during the final month of the season, he was driving offence at an elite level & his market value was 9.9 million AAV. Even though he’s just 1.5 million overpaid. No where near as bad as Jack Johnson’s contract.

“Marner is a borderline superstar who is worth his contract.” You are joking right? He’s the most vastly overpaid player in the game. Honestly, he’s just not built for the NHL. He’s small, weak & soft. He always gets knocked over & refuses to hit & fight. He doesn’t have the talent to make up for his poor physique. In a few seasons he’ll be out of the league. He gets carried by Auston Matthews & is only good at generating secondary assists, which is a worthless stat. The Leafs were better off giving that roster spot to Jeremy Bracco, could’ve saved them 11 million.

“Marner is a borderline superstar who is worth his contract.” You are joking right? He’s the most vastly overpaid player in the game. Honestly, he’s just not built for the NHL. He’s small, weak & soft. He always gets knocked over & refuses to hit & fight. He doesn’t have the talent to make up for his poor physique. In a few seasons he’ll be out of the league. He gets carried by Auston Matthews & is only good at generating secondary assists, which is a worthless stat. The Leafs were better off giving that roster spot to Jeremy Bracco, could’ve saved them 11 million.

Penguins will probably buy him out if there is a CBO. I would rather sign another UFA or give someone like Joseph or Lee a chance.

Lmao nice trolling buddy. You're getting roasted in the capfriendly group chat. Marner is taller then kane and better defensively. This so called "toughness" that you think is a thing is pathetic. Marner has more hits, blocked shots and takeaways but go off kid.

19 out of 52 of marners assists were secondary. We get that youre trolling but you look like a clown. You literally talk about marner being too small, too weak and not built for the nhl. Then you go on to say he'll be out of the nhl in a few season. If you scroll up you can see your name is PatrickKaneIsGOAT. If someone smaller, less talented and weaker is the GOAT then someone more talented, stronger and bigger should be the goat. If kane is the GOAT but marner is better then kane isnt the goat so you should probably change your name. He'll probably retire this summer because he cant skate anyways. Hes always falling down, he never hits or plays defense. Now that he doesnt have panarin to carry him he should retire

Imagine thinking Marner & Kane are even comparable. You do realize that Kane is the greatest offensive talent to ever play the game, right? He doesn’t need to play a physical & defensively sound game cuz his skill & scoring makes up for it. Marner on the other hand, has weak offensive skill, he’s soft in the dirty areas & is non existent defensively. Just a terrible player all around. I looked at his analytics & they are god awful, no where near Kane. You really need to stop being a homer, it’s embarassing the Leafs’ fanbase & Canadians in general. Also, don’t even mention Panarin. The only reason why that guy is even in the league is cuz Kane carried him for 2 seasons. Also, in Columbus he was heavily reliant on Atkinson just like Marner is on Matthews.